JacktheRipper

Update: All of the Insteon and UDI equipment I had has been spoken for and shipped as of this morning. Thanks to everyone who expressed an interest in it. ...Jack

I have three ASUS routers in play in my homes. One house has an ASUS GT-AC5300 (my son configured it for his gaming addiction) and another has an ASUS RT-AX82U). Both of these houses have fiberoptic internet connections (500 Mbps up & down), and have worked flawlessly for the past year or so. My living hell is my main house in Orange County. It has an ASUS RT-AX3000) but is connected to "AT&T Internet 100", which uses two bonded DSL phone lines to get to 100/20 Mbps, at least in theory. Believe it or not, cable service is not available for my home, located in Orange County, CA, population 3.2 million. Things were so flaky I programmed an ESP32 to log internet outages, and was shocked at the results.This AT&T service experiences many "micro-outages" each day (about 1 to 10 seconds each), and often goes down hard for minutes if not hours many times a month. The router seems to cope with this, but some connected devices get confused and lost. So I programmed a Feit switch to restart the router (and the pass-through AT&T modem/router before it) upon remote command. That has always fixed things. I'm waiting for Verizon, T-Mobile or Starry to finally roll out their promised 5G-Home service to my area, and will switch the minute it's available.

Michel... thanks for understanding my decision, and thanks for the tip regarding the MoesGo controllers. My new house is full of Control 4 controllers including some 4-button switch panels, and I may be able to change them out for something I can work with directly (as opposed to the Control 4 service company I called, who wanted $85 for just showing up!). All the other homes in the track have Control 4, and their porch lights are all on 7/24 because my neighbors are loathe to pay the Control 4 monthly fees. The Feit products work OK once you know how to properly configure them (turn OFF phone bluetooth before programming them. Otherwise they only work if bluetooth is there!). There are gaping holes in their product mix (only wall dimmers, not switches, and they make fluorescents buzz like crazy). Very poor motion detectors. No integrated switch/motion detectors (California Title 24 requires them in all baths/kitchens--how did Feit miss this?). So I had to go to tp-link Kasa for some devices, and they work fine. I use Alexa to weld them to Feit devices if needed. And I'm learning just how unreliable and limiting Alexa Routines can be. The promise is much bigger than what's delivered. I don't have any experience with Google to know if it's any better. My security cameras, doorbells and robo-vacs are mostly Eufy, which work flawlessly. I do have a Lorex NVR and six 4K cameras on one of my houses, and they have worked fine, but the app is clunky. But the thing I'll miss the most is this forum. Neither Feit no tp-link has anything like it. The support of other knowledgeable forum contributors, and you, in particular, has been outstanding. Thanks very much, and fair winds and following seas for your future endeavors...Jack

"...to speak of many things. Of ships and shoes and sealing wax, of cabbages and now, sadly, the death of kings..." With apologies to Lewis Carrol, I have decided to withdraw from using Insteon and ISY products for my home automation needs. I was an early adopter of Insteon (maybe 2002), and bought my first ISY 99x in 2005 as I recall. I was on the waiting list for six months as Polisy was developed, and got an early Polisy PRO. I still think the dual band mesh technology is the best thing out there, so why have I made this decision? Well, we all know the sad tale of SmartHome and Insteon, and the false starts of trying to rekindle the brand. I bought a new house and could not find a reliable source of Insteon products to outfit it. I was walking through Costco and came across deals for FEIT smart switch modules (three for $14.99) and wall light switches (two for $19.99). For $85 I had nine switch modules and four switches, all that I needed initially. I downloaded the FEIT app and got it working in a few hours. Alexa discovered everything automatically along the way. Between the native FEIT app capabilities and Alexa Routines, I can do some pretty fancy things (FEIT works with WiFi only, but Alexa needs an internet connection too). I then changed out all the Insteon/ISY products in our other two homes for another $200 or so. I can see and control all devices in all homes from one easy to use, modern app. So my decision provides an opportunity for you. I have three perfectly good ISY 994i's (two with IR), and one Polisy. I have some 30 Insteon devices, all but three dual band. I have contact sensors, mini remote keypads and one motion detector (2844-222). Does anybody want them? I'm not looking to get rich (I already am), but I would like to have the FedEx delivery costs covered. Just pm me. And I would like to take a moment to thank those of you who have helped me in this forum over the years. You know who you are. And, of course, Michel you are a gem. ...

I have two ISY994i's, #1 running 5.3.4 and #2 running 5.3.0. Both are running normally, and I can log into the Admin console on both if I do it correctly. I have downloaded the zip for 5.3.4, and when I try to manually upgrade #2, I get to 95%, and then get an error "Upgrade Failed: Failed uploading file(reported written size is invalid)". This happens while it's loading udi.css. Windows 10, current Java, cleared the cache, etc., etc., etc. Any thoughts?

No, sir, I did not. My MS II gradually lost range to just a few feet over a period of a few months, and I ultimately removed it from my installation and did not replace it. I have followed this thread with interest, though. I do most home automation things now with Arduinos, specifically ESP32s. That way I'm in complete control of things. Here is an excellent tutorial on how to use a HC-SR501 PIR motion sensor in a simple Arduino program. In particular, read the "Advanced Uses" section at the bottom of the tutorial for insights on how these sensors work.: https://arduinogetstarted.com/tutorials/arduino-motion-sensor In that advanced section, there's a good discussion on two sensor adjustment pots (range and time delay) and a jumper that controls single event vs. repeated event signal outputs from the sensors.

idkayaker... Precisely my original intent when I started the thread, so I would be glad to help. There's a lot of insights sprinkled in the exchanges above, and boiling all that down to a coherent document would be great. Please feel free to make a draft and circulate it for community comment. lilyoyo1... I wish it were simple to first understand, and then correct, communications issues that interfere with Insteon operation, but it is not. While Insteon and ISY were a vast improvement over X10 when I first got into using them (circa 2004 or so), I have found them to be far from perfect. Modems seem to gradually lose robustness (I'm on my third one, just for my own house), Motion sensor sensitivity seems to degrade over time too, for both MS 1 and MS 2 sensors. Switch reliability has been a problem for me as well. I have two at the moment that occasionally report back that they have toggled state, but in fact they have not done so. That is not a communications issue, it's a device reliability issue. Sending repeated commands has helped. Some lessons I've learned over the years include... (1) Get rid of 100% of your fluorescent devices, particularly the bulbs with built-in mini-ballasts. They simple put too much junk out on your wiring, which kills that avenue of Insteon robustness. I discovered this (duh) when I had some porch lights that could be turned on by an Insteon switch, but could not be turned off. (2) Lamplincs don't operate very well with smaller led loads, such as small Christmas light strings. When the load is very small, it confuses the Lamplinc sense feature. Use on/off (relay-based) devices instead. (3) Don't use LAN devices that transmit their traffic over your power lines. When I had solar put in a few years ago, the installer snuck of those systems in on me, and it killed my Insteon operation. (3) Don't use (non-Insteon) three-way switches that communicate over your power lines. Begs for a list that might be titled "The Top Ten Things You Can Do to Improve Insteon Reliability"...

Boomerang... I just installed 5.0.16, and my MS I here in my home works fine. My MS II is on a remote ISY in my son's home in another state, and I have 5.0.14A running there. His MS II works fine with that software version. I won't be upgrading his ISY to 5.0.16 until Thanksgiving, when I'll be there. The only thing I can suggest is to uninstall the MS II from your ISY, then reinstall it. If that doesn't work, there may be a way to do a factory reset on it. I haven't researched that....

I have my MS II set to 255, and it seems to work fine. I would think a higher sensitivity setting would mean it's more sensitive. Don't know what value a motion detector with zero sensitivity would have.

Be glad to. In my garage I have an Insteon wall switch near the door into the house, a wireless contact sensor on my garage door and a MS II. I have a scene (Gr Lights) that has the wall switch as a controller/responder, and the MS II that is a controller (although listed as a controller/responder, as noted above). The MS II is configured to turn the lights on, but not off (done in its config settings). Note that the contact sensor is not in the scene, because I don’t want the lights to be turned off when the door closes. I have a program “Gr Lights Timed Off” that is normally disabled when the lights are off, but is enabled by the following program below when any on command is received. It has the following code: Gr Lts Timed Off - [ID 000D][Parent 0010][Not Enabled] If - No Conditions - (To add one, press 'Schedule' or 'Condition') Then Wait 20 minutes Set 'Gr Lights Scene' Off Disable Program 'Gr Lts Timed Off' Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') I have a second program that turns the lights on and enables the above program, with the following code: Gr Lights On Command - [ID 000B][Parent 0010] If 'Garage Light Switch' is switched On Or 'Gr. Door Sensor-Opened' is switched On Or 'Gr MS II.Motion' is switched On Then Set 'Gr Lights Scene' On Disable Program 'Gr Lts Timed Off' Wait 5 seconds Enable Program 'Gr Lts Timed Off' Run Program 'Gr Lts Timed Off' (Then Path) Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') You have to noodle this a bit, but the lights only turn off if either the wall light switch is turned off (it’s in the scene), or if the timer program times out. The timer program is enabled, or re-enabled, for every ON command issued, including possibly multiple ON commands from the MS II if I’m in the garage for an extended period (it’s my woodshop). So while I’m in the shop, the lights never turn off. One final detail: If the MS II senses motion, but it thinks it's already on, it does not issue an on command, so set the timer to a very short value to make it work consistently.

mwester... I did write such a program, and the temp and luminance values do seem to be updated with each motion detected. Battery level did not change, but that might be correct, given the short time span of my testing. Is there a way to get these variables available to a program? I don't have a need to do this, but others might. For instance, a freeze alert message might be of use. I'm an Arduino guy, so I already have notifications of freeze alerts from the garage at my second home in Oregon (where my MS II is located) issued by an Arduino derivative that has a temp and humidity sensor connected to the internet.

See next corrected post

I just verified that when a Motion Sensor I is added to a scene, the only option that is offered is for it to be a Controller. The MS II came up as a Controller/Responder as the default, as I remember it. That led to my confusion. I'm aware that the only way to make the MS II "respond" to anything sent to it is to put it in linking mode (although mwester suggested (here) that a program could be written to sneak in commands immediately after a motion detected event happened. I haven't tried to do this. Might be a way to do a Query and get that temperature updated.). The solution I outlined above using programs works both with and without the MS II being in the scene to be controlled. I leave it in because the light turns on immediately, whereas when the program issues the on command, there is a slight delay. So, relative to my goal stated at the top of this thread, of having a coherent user manual/tutorial for the 2244-222, I've learned a few things from the MS I user manual (traditional Insteon manual with good explanations), the MS II user manual (new style written for the hub and light on details), and this and other Forum threads I've participated in. Thanks to all of you for helping me learn about this.

Lily... Yeah, I finally figured that out. As a newbie, I was confused by the Admin Console listing the MS II as a "Controller/Responder" for my garage scene. Perhaps that misrepresentation ought to be corrected, don't you think? Relative to what I want, I did the following: I included the MS II in the Insteon Scene with the garage light switch that is a true controller/responder for the scene. I set the MS II to issue on commands only. I wrote a timer program, normally disabled, that turns the lights off after a time-out, set at 10 minutes. If the light switch or the MS II turns on the scene, the timer program is enabled and starts the timer. If the MS II detects subsequent motion, it triggers a second program that (1) sends an on command for the scene, (2) disables the timer program, (3) waits 5 seconds, then (4) re-enables the timer program and runs it. This refreshes the timer program to always time out 10 minutes after the last detected motion. When the timer program reaches the time-out, it turns the scene off, then disables itself. This works fine for all use-cases, but is rather complicated. I was just looking for a simpler implementation that could have been possible if the MS II could be configured to always issues on commands if it detected motion, whether or not it thought the lights were already on. I guess it can't, so I'll stick with my solution. Thanks...Jack

Hey, thanks for replying. What I did initially was to configure the MS II to issue on commands only, and I had a "timer-off" program that was normally disabled, but was enabled and run by virtue of the lights coming on (from either switch or MS II). After it timed out (10 minutes), it issued a scene off command, and then disabled itself. A second program was triggered by the MS II's On commands to (1) wait 5 seconds, (2) disable the time-off program, then (3) re-enable it, to get a fresh timer going. Seems like it should have worked, but it proved unreliable for some reason. I'll go back and give it another try. Thanks again...Jack

I have a scene called Garage Lights that has a 2477S On-Off switch as a controller/responder, and a Motion Sensor II as a controller/responder. I don't really think the MS II is acting like a responder at all, at least the way I have it configured. Here's the problem: If the motion sensor detects motion, it issues an On command for the lights, then waits for no motion detected within a timeout value, and then issues an Off command if the timeout is reached. All that is good and expected. However, if the lights are turned off by the 2744S while the MS II is still waiting to issue its Off command, the MS never issues another On command if motion is subsequently detected, thinking the lights are already on. Is there any way to configure the MS II so that it always issues an On command if it detects motion, even it it thinks the lights are already on? Can it be done if it's powered by a USB cable?

kclenden... I've determined that removing the battery cover turns the Tamper node to ON status with a long beep in protest. Replacing the cover turns it to OFF silently. Perhaps you never have removed the cover after linking to ISY. I had done so, so I was showing a NO status. I posted some additional learning in my other thread on the MS II here

I've learned a few more things: (1) The MS II Tamper Node status is normally OFF or blank if the battery cover is in place. If the battery case is removed, the Tamper status turns to ON, and the MS II sensor gives one long beep in protest. Replacing the cover turns the Tamper Node status to OFF with no beep. (2) I have the MS II in a scene with an Insteon wall switch for garage lights. Both the wall switch and the MS II are designated as Controller/Responders. However, if the wall switch is turned ON, but the sensor has not detected motion, the MS II does not go to ON status, even though it's in the scene just turned ON by the switch. (3) Similarly, if the wall switch is turned OFF, the scene turns off, but the MS II does not change status (remains ON if it was ON, and OFF if it was OFF). In particular, if it was ON it will not turn the lights back on if motion is detected after the lights were turned off by the wall switch. It must time out and send its OFF command before resetting to detect motion and turns lights on. This was driving me nuts until I figured out what was going on by looking at the Tools>>Diagnostics>>Event Viewer.

So Dave, I have made a little progress in understanding some of the items I mentioned above: (1) To do a factory reset, remove the battery, push down and hold the Set button, and reinsert the battery, continuing to hold the Set button down for ten seconds until you see the leds blinking differently. (edit: to add the sensor to the ISY, you must use the menu item Link Management>>Link a Sensor>>Motion Sensor II. The "Start Linking" option does not work with this wireless device, or any other perhaps.) (2) The Timeout value in the Motion section is used only when you have configured the sensor to Report: ON/OFF. When the sensor detects motion it sends an ON command immediately. If the sensor detects no motion for "Timeout" seconds, it sends an OFF command. I still don't know what the "Off Button Timeout" value in the Misc section does. (4) Apparently "Nodes" are the entries you see in ISY devices screen. There are three nodes for the MS II: Motion, Tamper and Enabled. I added the Motion node to my lighting scene as a Controller/Responder configured to Report: ON/OFF. Works as I have described in Item (2) above. Any change you make to the Config Screen above, or pushing the "Calibrate Temperature" or "Beep" or Query buttons on the Motion node screen requires you to put the MS II in linking mode. To do that, push and hold the Set button for five seconds (beeps and starts green blinking on two second intervals). You may have to right click the node and select "Write updates to Device" to actually get changes installed in the sensor. Then, to go back to operational status, push the set button once (MS double blinks every 2 seconds), then push the Set button again (no blinking unless motion is detected). You may want to review another thread I started here: https://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/25915-configuring-a-wireless-sensor-via-portal-access/?tab=comments#comment-259246 kclenden helped me understand a lot of this.

Exactly correct. At the time I noticed this, I had set the sensor to Report: On Only. Since then I have it set to Report: On/Off, and the status now toggles appropriately. For the three Triggerlincs that show both on and off statuses, I have programs like this: PM Front Door Alert - [ID 0013][Parent 0014] If 'PM Insteon / PM Front Door Opened' Status is On Then Send Notification to 'Jacks iPhoneCC' content 'PM Fr Dr Open' Else Send Notification to 'Jacks iPhoneCC' content 'PM Fr Dr Closed' For the one that is showing only an ON status, I only check for an ON control event in a program (not a status). Perhaps that explains the difference. Here's the full story... I have a scene for garage lights that contains an Insteon wall switch (controller/responder), and the MS II (controller/responder with Report: ON/OFF). I have a Program#1 that turns the scene on if the Triggerlinc sends an ON command from the garage door opening (and it does not send any OFF commands when the door closes). The MS II sensor goes to ON status and turns the scene on if it detects motion, or if the scene is turned on by the program or the wall switch. It turns the scene off after a timeout of no motion detected. In case the battery in the MS II is depleted, I have a second Program#2, normally disabled, with a Then clause that turns the scene off after a delay, then disables itself. Program#1 enables Program#2 and runs the Then clause. I did this back-up scene-off program because this garage is in a vacation house, and I'm not always there to change out a battery if needed. Hey, thanks so much for helping me understand this sensor. Since my original post above, I think I have finally got to what I wanted

kclenden...Yes, it did seem to repair itself over time, but I have to tell you that I'm really confused about how these wireless devices operate. The MS II shows three entries (Nodes?) in the Network>>ISY view, labeled xxx.Motion, xxx.Tamper and xxx.Enabled. There is no heartbeat mentioned anywhere that I can find. The xxx.Motion always shows a status of "ON", even after hours of operation with an empty room. The xxx.Tamper shows a status of OFF and never changes. The xxx.Enabled shows a status of ON and never changes. So, how often does the heart beat, and what, exactly does it do to the ISY? Note that the Wiki Help has no mention of the MS II, and the Insteon User Manual assumes you have a Hub. My Hub failed dead after only 10 months of use, and I don't plan on replacing it. Adding to my confusion about wireless devices, I have four identical Triggerlincs on doors, but they operate differently: each Triggerlinc has three entries (Open, Closed and Heartbeat). Heartbeat is always ON for all four, Close shows no status for all four, and three of them show an Open status of ON if the door is opened, and OFF if the door is shut. However, the fourth one always shows ON, no matter what the door position is. Having said that, they all seem to be working correctly. Why are they different?

I manage an ISY in another state, via an ISY Portal connection. I have a Motion Sensor II in a little-used room, and I wrote a program to send me a text alert if motion is detected in that room. Unfortunately I hit the "Calibrate Temperature" button on the MS II device screen, and the ISY could not connect to the sensor. It now displays the big red exclamation point, and says it cannot communicate with the sensor. I presume that means my program no longer works. I can't push the button on the sensor because it's 1,000 miles away. Any way around this?

The User Manual for the Insteon Motion Sensor II (2844-222) assumes you have an Insteon Hub, but I haven’t found an equivalent manual for using the sensor with an ISY. If someone has such a manual, let me know. In the meantime, I’ve played with the sensor mounted in my garage to turn the garage lights on when motion is detected. And while I got it working, it was a confusing process of pressing the Set button multiple times, figuring out what pressing the Motion button does, and trying to decipher the many different red and green blink patterns along the way. And then there is the configuration screen below, assuming you’re running at least v 5.0.14 of the Admin Console (recommended, my process described here ). What does it all mean, and do I have it configured correctly? Specifically, my questions are (1) Starting from a factory reset, what are the steps to link the sensor to the ISY. I’ve done this successfully, but having a written process would be good, with an explanation of all those led blinking patterns I saw. (2) There is an “Off Button Timeout” value in the “Misc” section, and a “Timeout” value in the “Motion” section. What do they do? Note that I’ve configured to send On commands only--Off commands are handled with a specific program I wrote with additional logic. (3) Others have reported that they haven’t been able to stop the led blinking when motion is detected, no matter what they do in the Config Screen. I haven’t verified this. (4) What are “Nodes”? I have one, apparently. Mentioned a couple times in the Config Screen below, but I don’t understand their utility. (5) In another thread here , we discussed that the temp and luminance sensors are used for internal purposes only, and the values reported in the ISY device screen are not really updated at all. I wonder if Battery Level is really updated. In that thread, kclenden provided a way to get valid updates, but I haven’t implemented it because I don’t need that data. (6) What do the items in the “Light” section do? And beyond the Config Screen, there are the “Calibrate Temperature” and “Beep” buttons in the ISY device screen, but if you press them, the sensor must be in Set Up mode. And speaking of the Set Up Mold, I think you enter it by pressing the Set button once, and exit by pressing the Set button twice. Did I get that right?

j... Thanks for the tip--it worked for me. I tuned up the instructions a bit for my particular PC, and put it in as a comment in a program called "Comments"...: To address font size issue... (1) Right click on ISY Launcher shortcut (2) Select Open file location (3) Right click on javaws.exe (4) Properties > Compatibility > Change high DPI settings (5) Check "Override high DPI scaling behavior. Scaling performed by:" (6) Select "System (Enhanced)"

I discovered an interesting little factoid when troubleshooting why I wasn't getting text alerts sent via my gmail account, after it had worked for years: In the Wiki here: https://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=ISY-994i_Series:EMail_and_Networking_Substitution_Variables there's a Note at the top that says that both the Subject and the Body of the email message must contain something, otherwise the email is not sent! No warning about this as you're configuring your email message. I had tried to get a terse text message to my iPhone via <my phone #>@txt.att.net, and I deleted everything in the body of the email, and put the alert just in the Subject line. Corrected that, and everything works fine now (yes, I'm using gmail IMAP).