Wingsy

Thanks Michel. I've just recently found a way to recover from my evil ways. I connected the old router and managed to get access to the ISY, where I changed the setting from having a fixed IP (which was a lousy idea...don't know why I did that) to DHCP. Hooked up my new router again and I'm good.

A few weeks ago I replaced the PLM due to a lightning hit. Got most everything up & running ok. Bringing up the Admin Console wasn't an issue. But since the last time I had the console running I have replaced my router with a Netgear Nighthawk, and an ethernet switch (also Netgear) and my ISP DSL modem. The modem also changed my internet connection method, from PPPoE to DHCP. And now when I try to run the console it gives me a small window with a title of: ISY Finder - Not Found. I've tried eliminating the ethernet switch by connecting one of the router's ethernet outputs directly to the ISY (and another ethernet output to my computer). No change. Any ideas?

House hit by lightning, knocked out PLM. I've got over 90 Insteon switches & things throughout the house but I think all of these somehow survived, including my ISY994i. 3 TVs, 3 Sat receivers, 2 computers, etc., all dead. Now I'm getting around to replacing the PLM and restoring the universe to its previous self. I reset the ISY while the new PLM is connected, then chose "Restore Modem". I get a screen telling me to put my battery devices in programming mode prior to continuing. This is a problem. I have 4 motion sensors that require a ladder to get to and 3 ON/OFF sensors that also require a ladder. These devices only stay in programming mode for around 3 minutes and that's not near enough time for me to set them all up. Question is, can I proceed without these devices in prog mode, then come back after the rest of the system is done and set each one up individually? If so....how? Appreciate any help you can offer.

I thought you were talking about Momentary B where the relay responds to both an ON and an OFF. In Momentary C where the relay is triggered based on the state of the Sense input: I'm showing where an OFF command from the ISY always turns the relay OFF regardless of the state of the Sense input (--), and likewise an ON command always turns it ON regardless of Sense state. A linked controller does trigger the relay based on Sense input (like the manual says) but an ISY doesn't. Is that what we're talking about?

I don't understand. Isn't the highlighted areas showing it? The note says the ISY "OFF" command doesn't ever trigger an IOLinc. An ON command does. The ISY can't trigger based on Sense input, it always triggers when the ISY sends an ON, and turns off the relay when it sends an OFF. It seems this is always the case no matter what mode the IOLinc is in.

It is possible, and here is how I did it. Sunset Program - [ID 0013][Parent 0001] If Time is Sunset + 25 minutes Then Set Scene 'Outside Lights Dim' On Set 'FR Pool Table Lights' 30% In Scene 'MBR Bath Lights' Set 'MBR Bath Lights' 30% (On Level) In Scene 'MBR Recessed Lights' Set 'MBR Recessed Lights' 30% (On Level) $IsDayTime = 0 Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') The line you're interested in is the "In Scene.." lines. Those scenes are real simple - the switch is set to controller and the switch is set as responder as well. The sunrise program is: Sunrise Program - [ID 0012][Parent 0001] If Time is Sunrise - 15 minutes Then Set Scene 'Outside Lights Dim' Off In Scene 'MBR Bath Lights' Set 'MBR Bath Lights' 100% (On Level) In Scene 'MBR Recessed Lights' Set 'MBR Recessed Lights' 100% (On Level) $IsDayTime = 1 Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') Here's a screenshot of the bathroom lights, if that will help.

And when someone with those lights is behind you it appears that they are constantly flashing their lights at you as they hit minor bumps in the road.

Mustang, I did that too! When I was 16 or 17 I put a landing light from an old Piedmont Airlines F-27 in the front of my car, and for the same reason you did. My car looked like an oncoming train when I had that light on. But from that moment on, I never met anyone who didn't dim when I flashed my regular headlights, so never got to really try them out. Traded cars soon after that and had to remove them. I feel like you'd be a candidate for buying my 2-million-candlepower house when I sell.

That would be the ideal solution in all cases except where you needed fast response. Using just a program in the ISY is how I initially set up my stairway lights, but soon discovered that sometimes the lights didn't come on until seconds after being triggered. Not good if there's something on the 2nd step. Same for my driveway lights, triggered by a buried coil. Sometimes they didn't come on until 1/3 the way down the driveway.

OK, I've modified the pdf to include a linked controller. Michel - let's wait a few days before you link the pdf and see if anyone has any corrections or suggestions. Stepping back and looking at the combinations it's no wonder there are so many people confused over the IOLinc (me included). IOLinc Options Matrix.pdf

Well, no. Not yet anyway. If you want to do that, let me expand it to include a linked controller and correct the result that I mentioned earlier, from OFF to UNCHANGED. Without the full post no one would know that that item is a bit off and I'd hate to be the source of even a tiny piece of misinformation.

Here's something I think you guys might like. If you're a girl you'll just probably ask "Why?". Guys know why. I have a friend who owns a tower company. At about the time I was building my house he was replacing the strobe lights on many of his towers and gave me a couple of the older models. For normal lighting I put a circular LED in the base of the lights and mounted them on top of my driveway columns. Works well. The strobe was still functional and I left it that way. And sometimes at night when I'm feeling a little crazy I'll fire them up. As you may know, tower strobes focus the light into a horizontal circular beam. When you're close to one of these on a tower, the main beam goes right over your head. When it's 7 feet off the ground and you're 50 feet away, those two 2-million-candlepower strobes hit you like a supernova. It'll burn the outline of the trees right into your retina. You should see it. When I sell I'll have to find someone as eccentric as I am. I justified this by saying that I'll hook it up to my burglar alarm and if it doesn't scare away the crooks at least they'll be there blinded when the police arrive. The strobes are hooked up to an Insteon switch but after a couple of ALL-ON events I unplugged the strobe part. When I do a demo I have to plug it in first. Oh well.

With few exceptions I had my house wired so any dimmer could be replaced with a standard switch, with traveler wires where needed. I do have keypads at every entrance (whose main switch controls the room lighting) but I also have separate dimmer switches right beside them that control the porch lights, ceiling fan and some floodlights. The keypads do things like all floodlights on, set room lights to dim, turn on driveway lights, and turn on dining room lights. The dinning room (actually a corner of the great room) is the kicker there - there is no physical switch for it; it's on a nearby keypad that controls an inline dimmer. Those lights were added after the house was finished. Another inline fanlinc, not controlled by any switch (yet - I'm using my iPhone at present), runs the fans on the back porch. Another inline dimmer controls the lights on the columns at the end of the driveway (switch located IN the column), and finally an inline dimmer that controls a single light at the outside foyer (it's linked to the front porch lights). It would be a simple matter to revert all that (except dinning room and fans) to standard switches. If I had to run any additional wiring inside the outside walls, I think I'm screwed - it's a log home and the outside walls already have all the wiring they'll ever get. My automatic stairway and driveway lights (and driveway chime) may also be a problem. The future owners would have to revert to a manual switch. That may soon change though. I'm working on a way to automatically control those lights without needing ISY or Insteon (but I would need something ELSE, like a time delay relay. But surely any electrician could repair that if it ever failed). It sometimes worries me that in 10 years I may not be able to buy an Insteon wall dimmer, or another ISY, or another PLM.

Chances are really good that if I sold my house the buyer won't have a clue about how to keep all these Insteon things ticking. I guess I'll tell them that if there's a problem (no, "when" there is a problem) they can try to find an electrician with experience in this stuff or to just yank out the problem devices and go back to ole timey switches. What will you do?

Not to hijack this thread but I think my question may also help mvgossman.... My sunset program is: If Time is Sunset + 25 minutes Then Set Scene 'Outside Lights Dim' On Set 'FR Pool Table Lights' 30% In Scene 'MBR Bath Lights' Set 'MBR Bath Lights' 30% (On Level) In Scene 'MBR Recessed Lights' Set 'MBR Recessed Lights' 30% (On Level) $IsDayTime = 0 Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') My Adjust Scene statements are to set the level of brightness low during the night when those lights are turned on manually. Another similar program runs at sunrise to allow them to go to 100% when turned on. Is this the best way to do this?

Good point. Yes it was from testing. I had an IOLinc in front of me with a switch connected to the Sense input, a plug-in dimmer linked as a controller to the IOLinc, and the ISY admin console running so I could send ON and OFF commands from the ISY. Each time I would change an option I would run through my 3 sources of ONs and OFFs to see their effect. And I was surprised to see that a linked ISY-IOLinc behaved quite differently from any other linked controller. Confusion was present here too, for the umpteenth time. I believe that where the manual talks about configuring the various ways to control an IOLinc, they target an IOLinc linked to something other than an ISY. In fact I think all the Insteon manuals have little or nothing to say about the ISY, since they don't make it (?). For the benefit of any newbies reading this, the IOLink options can be set while running the ISY994 Admin Console app, and then selecting your IOLinc device (after linking the IOLinc to the ISY) and then clicking the "Options" button at the bottom of that window. The IOLinc manual also describes how to set some options manually without using the admin console.

This is one big can of worms, figuring out that IOLink. I don't know why they designed it the way they did. It seems that they had only 2 objectives in mind - a garage door opener and a projector screen (like in their examples). And the documentation is sorely lacking in clarity. Anyway, here's the combinations of options (as shown in the admin console) and inputs that create a relay output: (x = don't care) A few things to note: Once triggered in any momentary mode the IOLink relay will close for the set duration and then open, even if triggered again during the timeout. You cannot extend the time by re-triggering prior to timeout. And during the timeout period any OFF command will immediately open the relay (the exception is when a controller is specifically configured to trigger on OFF and turn off on ON).. The label for the checkbox "Relay Follows Input" is misleading. I think it should be labelled "Input Triggers Relay", because the only time the relay follows the input is in Latching mode and in all other modes it triggers the momentary functions. You could say the relay actually does follow the input because if the input goes OFF prior to timeout, the relay will open. But their terminally certainly threw me for a loop. When "Relay Follows..." is NOT checked, the Sense input has absolutely no effect of the IOLinc relay. When you read "Triggered by either.." or "Triggered by both...", don't even think that it applies to the Sense input or an ISY program. It only applies to a linked controller. The manual's example of how to set up "either" or "both" seems to be accurate; the example shows when the IOLinc is linked to a controller. The Sense input and ISY programs can only trigger an IOLinc with an ON command. In the documentation is says: Momentary A Either an ON or OFF command can be programmed to trigger the I/O Linc relay. The other command will be ignored. For example, if an ON command is programmed to trigger the relay, an OFF command will be ignored. Not true. An OFF command from anywhere will turn the relay OFF immediately (the exception is when a controller is set to trigger on OFF - it will go off when an ON command is received). There's probably a mistake up there somewhere and I've possibly left some stuff out, like more info on the effects of a linked controller. Comments welcomed, let's beat this horse to death. Edit: Well, right off the bat I see where I should have included "UNCHANGED" in the relay column in rows 1 and 2 in all images, since in those cases the relay isn't OFF, it's Unchanged. IOLinc Options Matrix.pdf

Well, they DO mention what an OFF command will do. They say it will be ignored but that is definitely not true. If the Sense input goes OFF while the IOLInc is timing out, it goes OFF. I started off down this road a long time ago believing what I read in the manual, and that is why I wear a helmet whenever I start fooling around with an IOLinc. It doesn't hurt as much when I bang my head against the wall. From the manual: Momentary A Either an ON or OFF command can be programmed to trigger the I/O Linc relay. The other command will be ignored. For example, if an ON command is programmed to trigger the relay, an OFF command will be ignored. BS I'm going to start another thread to talk about exactly what an IOLinc will do. I've got one here in front of me with a toggle switch connected to the Sense input and the ISY console running on my computer. First I'll try all combinations of the Options screen and report the results of what I get. (I've done this before.) Should I start that thread here or in the Insteon forums?

Yes, an ISY program will turn off the IOLinc relay even when set to Relay Follows Input and the input is still active. But of course the IOLinc relay will also go off when the Sense signal goes away, which it would do when a foot leaves the step. (The IR stairway sensor is ON when the beam is broken and OFF otherwise.)

Well the problem with that is, if the relay follows input and the input is straight from the stairway sensor, the LEDs would go off when a foot leaves the step.

I think this is about as simple as it's going to get, doing what I want. IR stairway sensor triggers the time delay relay (TDR). IOLinc relay lights the stairway LEDs. Time delay restarts if TDR is triggered while timing out. IOLinc Sense input triggers a scene with the overhead lights. No ISY program needed. I would use just the TDR but I also need a way to trigger a scene for the overhead lights, hence the IOLinc. And I can't use the TDR relay to both light the LEDs and trigger the IOLinc since one circuit is 12v and the other is 5v, so that's why the IOLinc relay does the LEDs.

I don't think I've ever replaced it, but way back when I first started working on the stairs I know I did a factory reset at least once after convincing myself I had a flaky unit that did not do what I understood the IOLinc "Options" should do. Since my driveway lighting has a similar setup and also uses an IOLinc I've always assumed the ALL-ON was just a bug somewhere that was triggered by any IOLinc. Way back before the house was built I bought about 10 various Insteon devices and tested them thoroughly before I committed to installing about 90 of these things throughout the house. And today I'd say I have about 85 that work perfectly every single time. But just think... I was planning on putting my well pump on an Insteon switch! I'm glad I waited on that one. I'll post a drawing soon of that time delay relay approach I'm planning on. I'd like to hear feedback from you and Stu. And I appreciate you and Stu taking the time to critique my setup and making suggestions.

I used to have a delay back when there was no scene involved. I had a 3 second delay followed by turning on the IOLinc relay, and that was repeated 3 times (trying to fix the occasional problem of the IOLinc not responding). 45 seconds later I also had a 3-Repeat loop to turn it off with a 3 second delay between tries. Still got ALL-ONs from the turn-on and maybe very infrequently from the turn-off. (My observer lost patience observing these things a long time ago.) Relay contacts rated at 2A. 7 LEDs @20ma each is 0.14A. There is no surge current in these LEDs - just LEDs with series resistors.

"...as a proper schematic..." OK In my garage I have one IOLinc. It's Sense input is from a magnetic reed switch on the door that I use to activate a lamp in the kitchen. That's all it does. The relay side of that IOLinc I use to open/close the garage door via my iPhone (seldom used). I get ALL-ONs when the garage door is opened and I'm not using both sensor & relay of the IOLinc at the same time. But it is true that in the stairway I am doing that. That's going to change. I'm going to change my stairway to this: 1. Re-triggerable delay relay triggered by the IR sensors. That relay stays energized while the IR signal is present (a foot on the step) and starts timing out when the signal terminates. Found some in China dirt cheap ($7 for 3) https://www.banggood.com/5V-30V-Wide-Voltage-Trigger-Delay-Timer-Relay-Conduction-Relay-Module-Time-Delay-Switch-p-1158433.html?cur_warehouse=CN 2. The NO contacts on that relay will connect to the sensor of an IOLinc, set for "relay follows input". That will also trigger a scene containing my overhead lights so they're on when the relay is on. An occasional delay there won't matter. 3. The IOLinc relay will control the LEDs, and no ONs or OFFs will ever be sent from the ISY. The time the stairway lights will stay on will be controlled by adjusting the delay time of the external relay. That's easy enough to do so that's OK. If I still get ALL-ON events doing it this way I'll remove the scene for the overheard lights. If I still get them I'll try removing the IOLinc from the PLM. If I still get them I'll remove the IOLinc entirely and use it for target practice. Doing what I want would be really simple if only the IOLinc would trigger from an ON event from its sensor and ignore OFF events, and be retriggerable. I'd use a motion sensor if it had external trigger inputs. It does what I want (I think).

I've noticed that in the two places I have IOLincs and ISY programs involved together, it's a source of the ALL-ON events I'm having. I have about 10 programs triggered from other devices and controlling things other than an IOLinc and they run several times daily. No ALL-ON events from them. So right now I'm leaning towards using a plug-in dimmer or ON-OFF module to get a signal into the ISY, using a very small solid state relay that I'll embed into the dimmer. I'll connect it to the dimmer's UP and/or DOWN buttons, and control it with a signal I'll generate when activated by the IR sensors. The dimmer's switched AC will power the AC adapter that runs the LEDs, and the ISY program will still control the off time as well as the overhead lights. No IOLinc in that kluge. Yes I admit that it's a kluge, but I'm determined to get this working just the way I want it AND to cure the ALL-ON event disease. One way or another the ALL-ON event must go. You would understand why if you were here the first time we had one. Actually I still chuckle every time I think about it..... Wife, alone in the house at night, watching TV... I pull into the driveway... driveway alert goes off, all doors unlock (you know what that sounds like?), all ceiling fans come on, garage door opens, and the main event: the gas logs come on with a big "whoosh" sound and a blaze right in front of her. She got a bit excited and threatened me with solitary confinement if I didn't fix it or return it. (well not really but almost.)