disker

OBERKC!!! YOU ARE THE MAN!!!!!!!! This was it - 100%!!!!!! Issue completely resolved!!!!!!!!!!! It's just too bad this isn't an option in the ISY! Hey UD - feature request for the new 5.x firmware - add ability to configure the Resume Dim option on dimming switches!

This makes sense as I can only get half of my switches to exhibit this behavior. I do not see this setting in the options for the switches. Just program lock, led on tx and no led. Looks like it's time to pull out my manual!!!!

After further testing, the issue still exists - only in a different form. It's this different form that tells me exactly what the issue is and that it can probably be reproduced on any dimming switch that is controlling a load. After selecting the movie theme, if I turn the lights off from any method and then go to the switch controlling the load, the lights will go on at the level of the movie scene even though that switch is a controller of the normal light scene. As I said - this can be reproduced just by using a load controlling switch with no scenes programed. Turn on the switch. Using the dimming or brighten option on the switch, set the level of the light to something it normally doesn't turn on to. Turn the switch off and then turn it back on. It will go back to the last setting used instead of it's default setting. This is something my wife pointed out to several months ago that she noticed when she adjusted the light level in a room and the next time she turned on it was at the last level instead of the expected level. This may be fine if you don't normally dim/brighten the lights or if you are using something like a fan-link to control the load as it will be controlled by remote switches which always turn the load controller on at the level the scene they are set to defines. I'm sure when I bring this to Insteon's attention they will say it is a feature and not a bug, although it produces undesired results. They designed the switches to return to the last known state in the event of a power outage. Great when the power comes back on, but when I set a button to turn the lights on to a desired level, I want it to always come back on at the set level instead of whatever it may have been set to on the last power on. I'll keep those who are interested updated on what they say.

This does turn button 2 off when the movie scene is deactivated by using anything else attached to the normal lighting level scene. This works as intended and when removed makes no difference to the results. Since I had some new switches arrive today, I decided to do the swap while I had the power off for the latest additions. By doing the swap and having one of the paddle switches become the load switch, everything not only works as intended, but I'm now able (as an extra benefit that I wasn't originally seeking) to have 'button 1' and 'button 2' act as radio buttons to indicate which scene is active since 'button 1' no longer has to stay on since this switch is no longer controlling a load. Again, thanks to larryllix who educated me about the link checker in the ISY software. While it didn't have any affect with this issue, it did help me resolve another issue that I was having with an unrelated room/switch where a scene would sometimes work 100% and sometimes would not. Also for the information that once the ISY is used to set up the scene, it is actually programing the scene into the actual switches involved and from that point on, they handle everything. While I knew this, it wasn't presenting itself to my frontal lobe for processing and needed to be shoehorned in there again!!! I am going to contact Insteon to let them know about this and hopefully a newer revision will have a fix. Until then, Alex, I will take paddle switches for the load.. er uhm... I mean win! In case you haven't guessed it, I do have a fairly complex lighting setup that keeps growing. Rest assure that if I ever do ask a question, it is usually going to be a doozy that can probably only be fixed properly by a manufacturer fix, but I still want to make sure that it isn't something I can't do on my own. Thanks guys! Kevin

That is exactly the issue. I do tend to get very detailed and it is in this that I can sometimes cause confusion with too much information. I just performed the factory reset/restore to the switch. No change in behavior. Unless anything else can be suggested I am thinking that I should probably just swap the KPL and one of the paddle switches in the room and have the paddle switch control the load and see if that works as intended. The good thing about these switches is as long as they aren't controlling the load or if they can be replaced by another load controller, they can be moved anywhere in the building!

I'm not adjusting KPL LEDs at all. Their status indicator is the automatic function that they do normally. If you have a dimming paddle switch the LEDs of the switch move up and down to show the current light level. It is not something you can adjust or control in any way. As for button labels I am just referring to their position on the 8 button switch instead of giving them names that could further confuse the description of my issue. 'button 1' is the top left button that is also tied to the load. 'button 2' is the top right button on the switch. With the confusion about thinking that I am controlling the LEDs on the KPL I am thinking that I need to restate my goal and my issue. To simplify it I have tested it with just the 8 button switch in the scenes so I will use that test as my example: I want to have my 8 button switch control my living room lights and set them to different levels depending on which button I press. When I press the top left button I want the lights to turn on to 75% of full brightness, When I press the top right button I want the lights to turn on to 20% of full brightness. My issue is that after pressing the top right button, the scene for the top left button will only turn the lights on to 20% until it is reset somehow. I am only using scenes to do this and I am not concerned in any way about the actual LEDs of the KPL. As a Band-Aid I wrote a program that will check to see if the top left button is pressed to turn the lights on. If it is then it sets the light's level to 75% as the scene itself should have done. This works but is only a Band-Aid and should not have to be done. I hope that this makes things less confusing. Yes, when activating the scene with 'button 2', 'button 1' is lit. This is normal operation as button 1 is the button for the 'Load' of the switch and it will always be on if the room light is turned on to any brightness. I also mentioned nothing about button 1 being turned off by pressing button 2. This is an assumption on your part. Again it is the light level of the room's light fixture that I am adjusting, not the brightness or the illumination on the KPL. The scene for button 1 states turn my lights on to 75%. The scene for button 2 states to turn them on to 20%. Pressing button 1 turns the lights on to 75% and off normally with repeated presses as specified by the scene. Now, if I press button 2 the lights turn on to 20% and off normally. After activating the scene for button 2 regardless of if the lights were then turned off with button 1 or button 2, turning on the lights with button 1 ONLY turns the lights on to 20%. If I add a paddle switch in to the same scene as button 1 and use it to turn the light on, or if I reset the scene using the ISY then button 1 on the KPL will turn the lights on to 75% as intended until the button 2 is pressed again.

I know this is an old thread but I think I have a solution to your dilemma. I control my shower vent fan with an Insteon switch and have programs that will act as a timer. Each press on adds 5 minutes to the on time and a fast-on turns it on without a timer. With some slight modification you can probably get them to work for your fan. PRG: Vent Fan If Control 'Fan' is switched On And Control 'Fan' is not switched Fast On Then $_Fan +=1 Run Program 'Vent Fan Intercept' (If) PRG: Vent Fan Clear If Control 'Fan' is switched Off Or Control 'Fan' is switched Fast Off Then $_Fan = 0 $_Fan Timer = 0 PRG: Vent Fan Countdown If $_Fan < 1 Then $_Fan_Timer = 0 Set 'Fan' Off $_Fan = 0 Else wait 5 minutes $_Fan -= 1 Run Program 'Vent Fan Countdown' (If) PRG: Vent Fan Intercept If $_Fan_Timer < 1 Then $_Fan_Timer = 1 Run Program 'Vent Fan Countdown' (If) I believe to use this for your intentions you can add your check for the current time into PRG: Vent Fan to have this only work during the times you specified, change the 5 minutes in the Else section of PRG: Vent Fan Countdown to 1 hour and if you didn't want to be able to add an hour then change the variable assignment in the Then section of PRG: Vent Fan to $_Fan = 1. If you do decide to remove the incremental part of the timer you can probably streamline it further, but this will get you started.

I'm not sure what you are talking about separating the LEDs from the scenes. I'm not controlling any LEDs on the switches, but rather light levels of the controlled lights. The LEDs on the switches are just performing their status indication as they are intended by design and are working fine. If you could perhaps clarify what you are suggesting I can perform the requested tests.

Agreed! I did a factory reset on it about 1 month ago attempting to fix an issue with a now dead fan-link that I used to use. After removing the fan-link I did a reset/rewrite at that time to make sure I didn't have any corrupted tables. The 2 paddle switches have not been reset but they also have not had any other additions to them since they were installed and they work perfectly. In fact, after I use either of them to turn the lights off and back on, 'button 1' works as it should until the next time I activate the movie scene. I have not reset it with the current issue and while I don't think that will resolve the issue, I may try it tomorrow to see just to make sure I cover all bases. I have seen stranger things. I just did as per your suggestion. Everything came up marked [identical]. I hadn't noticed that option before - that's a good one to know about! Thanks. I also forgot to mention that if I turn the scenes on or off from ISY they do exactly as they are supposed to. When controlling them this way the buttons still behave the same way. IE: If the last scene used was normal lights then 'button 1' will turn them on properly but if the last scene used is movie then 'button 1' only does the 20% setting. I have also noticed that when 'button 1' is activating the 20% setting, the 2 paddle switches still have their indicators going up to 75% as per the scene. I'll try the reset/rewrite tomorrow and see if that makes a difference and post the results. Right now it is bed time!

I kindly ask that you re-read my OP. Here is what I stated: I stated that my program was the workaround and not the issue. I do thank you for your attempt, however.

My program is the band-aid that I want to remove. The program works fine. It is the scene that I have issues with. And honestly - if a solution can't be found the current setup works with the band-aid program in place - I just want to do it the right way with just the scenes. I just prefer not to have Band-Aid solutions.

I forgot to mention that I had each controller in it's related scene set with the same settings. I agree that this should be able to be done with scenes only. The only program that I have is the one I mentioned above to make 'button 1' work properly after the movie scene was used and the lights turned off. As I mentioned, the 2 paddle switches work fine. For gits and shiggles I added one of the buttons from one of my other 8 button switches using the same config at it also worked. It seams that the only time I have issues is just using 'button 1' which is the load control button. While writing this response I double checked my programs as well and verified that this was the only program that referenced this button. Since the scenes are stored in the links to the switch it would seem that this may then be an Insteon issue... Hmmm...

I am thinking that this may be an issue with how the ISY handles its scenes but I may be wrong. If it isn't related to the ISY then if someone can help me do this the right way I would GREATLY appreciate it. Setup: Build 4.5.4 1 - 8 button dimmer switch controlling load 2 - paddle switches - dimming What I am wanting to do is set these up to control my living room lights for normal operation and for theater level lighting. Here is how I have everything configured: Scene: Living Room Main 8 button dimmer button 1 (LOAD)(Controller) ::Set for on=75% ramp rate=4.5 paddle switch 1 (Controller) ::Set for on=75% ramp rate=4.5 paddle switch 2 (Controller) ::Set for on=75% ramp rate=4.5 8 button dimmer button 2 (Responder) ::Set for on=0% ramp rate=0 Scene: Movie Time 8 button dimmer button 1 (LOAD)(Responder) ::Set for on=20% ramp rate=4.5 paddle switch 1 (Responder) ::Set for on=20% ramp rate=4.5 paddle switch 2 (Responder) ::Set for on=20% ramp rate=4.5 8 button dimmer button 2 (Controller) ::Set for on=100% ramp rate=0 Now, I assume from this that it should function to where if button 1 or either paddle button is turned on the lights go to 75%. If button 2 is on at this time then it turns off to denotate that it is not in movie mode. If button 2 is pressed then the lights (and the indicators on the paddle switches) go to 20%. If any one is turned off they all go off. For the most part this is the case. The issue that I am having is after pressing button 2 to activate the movie scene, subsequent presses of button 1 only turn the lights on to 20%, however presses of the paddle switches to on turn the level to 75% as they are supposed to. My current workaround is a program: If Control 'Button1' is switched on Then Set 'Button1' 75% This works but it has a delay as the lights hit 20% then they continue on to 75%. I think this is an ISY scene issue because the way the scenes are set up, this should work without the program. If it isn't an ISY issue then I would appreciate some assistance to see where I have gone wrong with my configuration. If it is, then I would like to formally submit this as a bug to be fixed in the upcoming 5.x firmware. I realize this is a slightly confusing description but I have tried to lay it out as best that I can. If you need clarification, please ask and I will be happy to provide it. Oh: And thanks for all the wonderful information you guys have posted in my forum. It is because of this that I am able to say "It's great when your house does what you program it to!"!!! (And, I do say that quite often!) Thanks! Kevin