jlloyd_UD Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 I have an Insteon ISY 994i network with several sensors, relays and dimmers. i switched from an ISY 99i not too long ago but am unsure whether my problem is related to that switch. I have two access points and some dual band units but most are not. The network is almost completely reliable but is not too complicated with only several scenes. One of my originally purchased switches (installed July 2010) is an Insteon 2486S KeypadLinc Relay V36 which I understand is no longer available but can be replaced with a dual band device with a heftier relay. My complaint is with the main switch that controls a street light about 100 feet at the end of a driveway. It also has an outlet with a GFI protection. My device and the light at the end of my driveway shows up in my network listing in various ways at various times (occasionally as a an icon with red exclamation point or a green rectangle ) and works fairly reliably. When I query the the external light with Query Insteon Engine, I get a diagnostic which reports that the network "Cannot communicate with exterior street light (15.62.3B.1). Please check connections." I have checked and tightened all wire connections with the relay. I can command the relay to switch the light on from my Administrative Control Panel and I can switch the light on directly from the device. Sometimes it takes several admin control commands to turn the street light on or off but it always works after a few commands and sometimes with one command. I have also a garage door relay connected to this switch and it works flawlessly. Why do I continue to have some trouble as illustrated by the diagnostic message despite the light eventually responding correctly? This is more an annoyance than anything else but I would like my network to be without any problems before I continue to expand. My next project is a water sensor/main water shutoff which I certainly want to be reliable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeG Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 The Red ! indicates a comm problem with the device. The green rectangle means a link record update was not able to communicate with the device and was queued. Taking several attempts to control the device indicates a comm problem. Not being able to Query Insteon Engine indicates a comm problem. Everything mentioned indicates unreliable comm with the device location. When comm to the device is fixed all the issues should be eliminated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlloyd_UD Posted July 13, 2014 Author Share Posted July 13, 2014 Thank you LeeG. I suspected it was a comm problem but no matter what I do as in moving access points around, etc. nothing changes. I have a motion detector near this circuit and another switch on a different line. The motion detector switches the porch light near instantly but the street side light will switch after about 10 seconds as if the command has to be repeated numerous times to finally get through. These circuits are undoubtedly different, as I said one is outside and GFI protected and the other is internal but they are inches apart. Is it just a matter of hitting the correct Access Point combination or will I need a third access point for my garage outlet? I suppose I can take one of my access points and put it on the garage outlet and see what results with my troublesome KPL relay switch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveL Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 Jlloyd_UD Please let me know how I can contact you so we can work on a solution. Support@universal-devices.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsobel Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 Thank you LeeG. I suspected it was a comm problem but no matter what I do as in moving access points around, etc. nothing changes. I have a motion detector near this circuit and another switch on a different line. The motion detector switches the porch light near instantly but the street side light will switch after about 10 seconds as if the command has to be repeated numerous times to finally get through. These circuits are undoubtedly different, as I said one is outside and GFI protected and the other is internal but they are inches apart. Is it just a matter of hitting the correct Access Point combination or will I need a third access point for my garage outlet? I suppose I can take one of my access points and put it on the garage outlet and see what results with my troublesome KPL relay switch. Is the issue the same if the light is on or off? E.g. do you have trouble just turning it off (which could suggest noise from the device itself) or both on and off? If both, then I agree with Lee. In Mexico I have extremely thick stone walls and literally have about 25 or so access points (including one mounted under the roof in outdoor enclosures to help relay signals between buildings). I certainly have learned that Insteon actually does get more reliable with more units (sans some older firmware bugs). Also, IMHO, the dual band devices (wired in switch or outlet) help from a dual band perspective, but not as much as an access point (since its not 'in' the wall and the antenna generally is less obstructed). In your case I'd suggest another access point or two, or if you have additional switches you want to convert eventually then to do those now. Even 1 or 2 extra devices physically close to the that circuit (if you bridge via RF) or functionally close (e.g. on the circuit) if wired in, can help immensly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlloyd_UD Posted July 13, 2014 Author Share Posted July 13, 2014 Well, the problem I have understanding this is that it is a fairly recent (within past year) problem as I never detected the comm indicators until this past year after running an ISY99i for about 4 years and then switching to the ISY994i last December. I have had some problems also with linking my motion detectors recently. I had them working last evening after doing factory resets and relinks for two of them. Today, one will just not cooperate but I only say this becasue it might be a connected problem although I do not think so. I have several dual band devices and may add more. I put in a 30 amp Insteon switch dual band on my electric hot water tank a year and a half ago or so. This problem is little more than an annoyance but perhaps after the next purchase of a dual band keypad linc device and the problem persists I will get another access point. I have a 1900 sq foot two level house stick built with a great room main living area and I don't think I have thirty outlets into which I could plug APs. Last April (17 months ago), I had a whole house generator installed and had lightning protection (zenor diodes) placed on both legs of my 220V line and a third protective device on a remote pump house near my boat. This might have coincided with the appearance of this problem but not sure. Would these protective diodes cause communications to become weaker and if so, is another AP the solution or would another solution work better? I think I have told you my situation short of the topology. I appreciate all the suggestions as I puzzle through this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlloyd_UD Posted July 13, 2014 Author Share Posted July 13, 2014 bsobel, sorry, I did not answer your question. it works squirrelly the first time I try to turn on but then it seems to work OK to both turn it off and then to turn it immediately back on. It is like it clears a path the first time and then everything seems to work properly. I have switched APs around with no relief on that particualr function and no detrimental effect on anything else, i.e everything else continues to work properly (except the problems with my to motions sensors which I am trying to work out as a separate issue). Thanks for you comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teken Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 The first thing I would suggest is to confirm proper coupling of the two sides of the single phase electrical system in your home. Using the manual for the AP (Access Points) confirm you have bridged the two sides correctly. If you moved the AP to the garage please confirm the phase coupling again. Also, what is the load at the light fixture down the driveway? One thing to note is to ensure any noise makers / signal suckers are identified and resolved. I always turn off breakers one at a time or unplug all the electronic devices in the home and add them one at a time until the Insteon system falters. Please report back once you have done the above steps and suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlloyd_UD Posted July 19, 2014 Author Share Posted July 19, 2014 Back after a few days of troubleshooting and doing other non-related chores. A few days back I did the circuit breaker shut down by groups and by one by one to isolate bad sources of noise. I noticed one circuit when shut down allowed it to comm better but still not perfectly. I then had to do other chores so only returned to the diagnostic tasks this morning. As a matter of fact, I used the load at the driveway light for powering a cut off saw using an exterior outlet on that same switch for my other chores (crown molding trim work). Normally that circuit is unused except for the driveway light which is infrequently used. This morning I was turning the light off and on with the console and it seemed to work perfectly even though the icons had not changed. Then I looked at the Button grouping, the LED level, and the toggle modes for the switch without changing anything. Inexlicably the console reported that the ISY was writing to the switch and the trouble comm flags turned to normal icons for the switch after the writing. I have no idea why the processor suddenly decided to perform a write. I like it when there are no problems but hate it when I do not know why the switch has suddenly decided to work as designed. I will continue to monitor and relink my garage door to one of the buttons after a few days of stability. Bottom line, my problem has vanished and I am sorry that I cannot tell you why! I did save the event log if anyone would like to see it (attached). I am not sure what it says other than there was some writes to memory and an EPROM refresh this morning when I was playing with the console at about 7 AM. ISY-Events-Log.v4.0.5__Sat 2014.07.19 01.53.44 PM.txt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Techman Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 If you're using any CFL bulbs they sometimes inject noise into the powerline if they have a bad ballast which could cause communication issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teken Posted August 28, 2014 Share Posted August 28, 2014 Has the problem been solved now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlloyd_UD Posted August 28, 2014 Author Share Posted August 28, 2014 Teken, The problem was resolved and has not recurred. I have not relinked my garage opener yet to the previously faulty switch but it seems that the problem has vanished and the switches are again working. As I said, it suddenly went away after an inexplicable "write" and the icons representing the switch returned to normal. I do have a few CFLs and one burned out after the problem resolved so I do not know the connection, if any, of that event. I am wanting to change my CFLs over to LEDs at some point when the prices might come down further. Thanks all for the suggestions and the help. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teken Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Teken, The problem was resolved and has not recurred. I have not relinked my garage opener yet to the previously faulty switch but it seems that the problem has vanished and the switches are again working. As I said, it suddenly went away after an inexplicable "write" and the icons representing the switch returned to normal. I do have a few CFLs and one burned out after the problem resolved so I do not know the connection, if any, of that event. I am wanting to change my CFLs over to LEDs at some point when the prices might come down further. Thanks all for the suggestions and the help. Jim Jim, Glad everything worked out in the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scyto Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 I have been having issues like the it boiled down to two things. All 3 KPLs had issues until I set them to each have 2 retries. 1 KPL continued to have issues until I moved the PLM. Hope that helps anyone else who comes across this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricK Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 How do I change the number of retries for the v.36 Kpl? Thanks, eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeG Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 EricK That KPL Firmware is I2. I2 devices do not support retry adjustment. That feature was added with I2CS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricK Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 Lee, that is what I thought. But based upon the title of the thread and the post from scyto I was hoping there was a way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeG Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 scyto has newer I2CS KPLs to be able to set the retry count (this topic and title was created by a different user). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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