Scene confirmation / Re-Try communication ?

[telljcl]

I was curious if there is any way to have the ISY monitor the "success" of its communication with devices?

 

I have numerous programs that turn things ON or OFF due to various conditions, but sometimes one item in a scene (say, a keypad button) won't "get the message", so the lamp associated with the scene gets turned on, but not the keypad button light that goes with it.  Sometimes it might be the other way around.  

 

I've got some of the more "critical" programs set to re-run a minute or so later to increase the chances that it will work every time.

 

Doesn't the ISY get feedback on status so that it knows if the commands got through?  Shouldn't it try again if something didn't work?

 

Also, I get the same issue occasionally launching scenes from a keypad button (not ISY initiated) - the button will rapid-flash after I press it to let me know something may not have worked right (although usually it did work right, but the keypad apparently didn't get a response from something).  Isn't the ISY aware of what is supposed to happen in this scene also, and shouldn't it "buffer" and/or re-transmit commands it doesn't get a confirmation status from?

 

I do realize the best thing is to have a perfect electrical environment where there is never a missed command, but I've done about what I can do in that regard, and its pretty reliable, but I'm sure I'm probably missing something here in relation to error handling or command re-sends.

 

 

Thanks!

 

[LeeG]

A Scene command issued by the Program (PLM is Controller) does not receive any confirmation messages regarding success/failure.

 

A Scene initiated by a KPL button press does not indicate result to the PLM as it is only a Responder to the Scene.  The ISY has nothing to react to as far as a retry/corrective action.   Also that action would have to be initiated by the KPL.  The user is notified of the issue by the flashing button.   Insteon expects the user to decide what should be done such as pressing the KPL button again. 

Edited August 9, 2014 by LeeG

[telljcl]

Lee,

 

I assumed all of the architecture of the entire Insteon Network was known to the ISY (what a keypress on key "B" on keypad 5 is supposed to do)?

 

So the ISY cannot monitor keypad (or other insteon controllers) for failure feedback?

 

In an ISY program scenario, the ISY (apparently due to the PLM?) is unable to verify success or failure?  Is there someway to "verify" that all elements of a scene got switched (short of blindly sending multiple "turn scene off" commands)?

 

I always assumed the ISY was the traffic cop of all the happenings on the Insteon network - I must not have a good understanding of it.

 

Thanks for your help.

 

 

[LeeG]

The ISY is aware that KPL 5 button B has been pressed, the command the KPL generated as a result of the button press, and the ISY knows what devices should react to the button press because the ISY created the Scene.   However, Insteon does not tell the PLM (which is a Responder device to the button press) how the other Responders to that KPL button actually reacted.  The KPL as the Controller of the Scene is informed of each Responder reaction.   That is how the KPL knows to blink the button LED if an error occurred.  That success/failure information is passed to the KPL as Controller of the Scene but not passed to any of the individual Responders such as the PLM.

 

There is an insteondetails.pdf document on insteon.com web site that covers how Insteon Controller and Responder devices respond to Insteon Scene processing.  There is Insteon detail in that document that is really not necessary to understand in day to day Insteon but there is Scene operation that may be useful.   

[telljcl]

Thanks, Lee.

 

I guess that makes more sense.  Essentially, ISY keeps track of the Insteon Status by what is supposed to have happened as opposed to what may have actually happened, it appears.  I guess I can build in "query" commands after a scene is run to see if they actually happened completely or not as there seems to be no other way (I guess this is essentially what a KPL etc... does automatically, and causes the "blink")

 

Somewhat related to this, this brings up another question related to signal issues.  The old Smarthome software (Houselinc maybe?) had a diagnostic feature(s) which enabled automated, repeated communication with all (or just those you select) devices and would run this a specified number of times, and present a % success / failure rate for each responder communicated with.  There was other detailed info as well, but some of it was over my head.  Is there any diagnostic tool like that ISY has that can run tests on all devices so it might be easier to diagnose any signal areas which are prone to failure? 

 

Thanks!

[LeeG]

That type of diagnostic does not exist in the ISY.   HouseLinc is now free.   I have factory reset a device (necessary as HouseLinc would run the device links and pickup unwanted devices), added it to HouseLinc and run diagnostics against the specific device. Not as useful as running against the entire network but it does show results of repeated comm to a device.   When done factory reset the device and run Restore Device under the ISY to restore the ISY information.

[telljcl]

Great idea on using houselinc - I still have my old PLM (USB I think?) Could I use that with my PC to do what you're describing?

[LeeG]

Sure.  I would recommend using a separate PLM.   The ISY PLM could be restored just like any device added to HouseLinc but I prefer not to use any more ISY devices than necessary.

Edited August 11, 2014 by LeeG

[Brian H]

If your USB PLM does not work with HouseLinc.

It maybe too old. Early 417 Link Database hardware versions of the PLM are not supported.

Edited August 11, 2014 by Brian H