Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Posted December 17, 2014 A few years ago I was fortunate enough to pick up a OnSite Pro Flood Stop whole house wireless Insteon enabled kit. Today I decided to install this device to serve as a back up to a few other water detection systems in the home. I have read quite a few forum threads in the interwebs with respect to this device and some of the feed back has conflicting information. THE FACTS: 1. This device is Insteon enabled from the manufacture. 2. Insteon traffic is seen flickering on the controllers green LED. 3. All wireless sensors link with the master controller fine and does indicate a wet condition. 4. Linking Mode: Placing the Master / Slave device appears to show up in the ISY level 3 event logs. 5. Cross Linking: Using a Appliance Linc to link to one of the slave sensors does respond. But does not actually work? WHAT I HAVE DONE: 1. I have placed a call with the maker and he indicates this device is Insteon enabled but given its age does not recall what and how it operates. He is going to engage one of the Smartlabs contacts to see how to. 2. I've read just about every forum thread about this product and all of them say, no. While some say this device needs to be added into a new sub group. As a leak sensor did not exists when this device was released. All related PDF SH manuals are not on line so I can't compare it to the users manual which doesn't indicate anything about Insteon beyond the fact its enabled. 3. Level 3 Event Logs: I am going to try to capture a real time log when I hit the start linking button and provide it here. As some of the output does not look promising to me. Related information as it pertains to the product in question: http://forums.indigodomo.com/viewtopic.php?t=8580&f=7 ISY SUPPORT: 1. I would like to see this device added to the device table which I believe will help me further along. 2. Any insight from the forum members about this device would be greatly appreciated!
stusviews Posted December 17, 2014 Posted December 17, 2014 All the other Floodstop products indicate that they have output contact wires, but the manual for the whole house unit does not mention such wires.
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 All the other Floodstop products indicate that they have output contact wires, but the manual for the whole house unit does not mention such wires. It does have the same at the bottom of the unit like the other four units I have. This unit is different as it has a built in PLM inside and believe the remote sensor do too. Encrypted By: Phoenix Security Solutions
stusviews Posted December 17, 2014 Posted December 17, 2014 If the wires have the same function as the other devices , then you can connect them to an I/O Linc.
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 If the wires have the same function as the other devices , then you can connect them to an I/O Linc. Sure, if I wanted to go that route. But this device has native insteon support and I would like to use it as intended. Requires less gear, cost, and a extra layer of complexity. Encrypted By: Phoenix Security Solutions
stusviews Posted December 17, 2014 Posted December 17, 2014 Were did you read that Insteon support is built-in? Nothing in any of the manuals mentions Insteon and "Insteon" does not appear anywhere on the FloodStop web site. More info: http://www.power-home.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3080
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 It's written on the manual and like I said it shows Insteon traffic when its present. It also half way links to my appliance linc. I also see the PLM link attempt in the level 3 event logs. Encrypted By: Phoenix Security Solutions
stusviews Posted December 17, 2014 Posted December 17, 2014 And the device has an Insteon ID? BTW, if it's a few years old, the HouseLinc should recognize it. Have you tried that route?
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 There isn't any Insteon ID label on it. But I believe the ID I see via the level 3 event log is it but I can't get it to enroll into the ISY. Not surprisingly I guess since it doesn't exist in the device table. I will dig up the USB PLM and install HL and report back. Thanks for the alternate solution hope it shows up. Encrypted By: Phoenix Security Solutions
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 OK, with the great feed back from Stu I used HL Software to assist me in finding out what the Insteon ID was for the various devices in the system. Since I knew going in more than likely this device would not be in any of the data bases I decided to use a Trigger Linc. As this is the closet thing I could think of that would replicate what this device does. I gather some of the strange things I saw were because these devices were brute forced to use a device signature that is not related to them. But, doesn't explain why they show up with three Insteon device ID's? As you can see this is what HL indicates for the first 6 devices one of which is the Master, the rest are the wireless remote slave sensors.
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 I then proceeded to add them to the ISY with the captured Insteon ID's and this is what came up along the way.
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 Afterwards my goal was to see if I could link these slave sensors to an Appliance Linc. As you can see this was done with out any issue.
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 As hard as I tried using both NO / NC I was not able to make the Apl Linc turn on. I tried linking just the slave sensor to the Apl Linc, then did the same with the master as seen above. I even wrote a quick program, and a e-mail, to ensure if it worked a confirmation mail would be received. None came . . . So, to summarize what I am trying to do. I would like to see if any of the wireless slave sensor trip that they send an alert to the master. This works fine all by itself, but I am trying to get that same alert be seen and received by the Insteon network. Its clear a few things are at play here and I realize this. 1. The device type used is not correct. 2. All of the expected nodes are not fully operational given the above (1). 3. Linking does work as it has been proven in the above screen shots. 4. N.C / N.O. relay contacts provide 1 amp / 24 VDC.
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 Tried to use *unsupported* device 6 / 7 no joy. Tried the Leak Sensor added fine, tried Open / Close Sensor added fine. I will report back what else I am able to glean from testing tomorrow as its late now.
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 For got to add the users manual listed here: http://www.diycontrols.com/dl/FloodStop-wireless-whole-house-manual.pdf
stusviews Posted December 17, 2014 Posted December 17, 2014 It seems that 18.A4.4F is the TriggerLinc and 0F.E0.46 is the USB PLM. Also, 19.AF.03 has the same three modes as and is identified as an Insteon Leak Sensor. Won't that work for what you want to accomplish? And, what is 19.00.03? That ID does not appear in HL.
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 Hello Stu, The Master (Flood Stop) controller ID is 19.AF.03. The other ID's are the wireless slaves: 18.A6.E6, 18.A4.4F, 19.B1.3A, 19.AF.39, 19.B1.62. The other devices are HL USB, Appliance Linc, and some random switch that was present in the HL data base. What I have learned is that the Master can enroll up to 32 Insteon enabled wireless sensors into its data base. These links appear when I tried to enroll it into the ISY. Since they are battery operated devices they obviously didn't respond. The literature indicates if they (wireless) units are plugged into AC power they act as repeaters. So, haven't tried that out to see because I know it won't make a difference. I spent most of the day trouble shooting and hard resetting all the devices to factory defaults and enrolling them back into the Master. Direct linking a wireless slave does not seem to work as the ISY cries something is wrong. Its interesting to note the device cat / sub cat, is this a trigger linc?
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 OK after screwing around with this device for a little while and doing about 5 hard resets. I have a little bit of success to share with the group. I was finally able to get the HL2 Software to see and recognize this device and it spit out better cat / sub cat. Can someone let me know what this device falls under? Right now I have deleted all the previous wireless slaves from HL2 Software and am trying to get some kind of association with a APL. So far no joy as there is no method to drag any of these devices into the triggers etc. Any insight would be greatly appreciated!
stusviews Posted December 17, 2014 Posted December 17, 2014 A TriggerLinc has device cat:sub cat 0x10:0x02
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 I haven't found anything that explains what 0x9:0x02 is though. I've tried most of the common one's even devices I know are not practical to use just to see what would happen.
Teken Posted December 17, 2014 Author Posted December 17, 2014 Just found a copy of the cat / sub cat. If I am reading this correctly it says it falls under the following: Energy Management http://www.insteon.com/pdf/insteon_devcats_and_product_keys_20081008.pdf http://www.insteon.com/pdf/Product_List_2014-Jan-23.pdf
Brian H Posted December 18, 2014 Posted December 18, 2014 Correct Cat 0x09 is Energy management. Sub Cat 0x01 Is OnSitePro Leak detector Sub Cat 0x02 is OnSitePro Control valve I also see a few Sub Cats for TED5000 and TED3000.
Teken Posted December 18, 2014 Author Posted December 18, 2014 Well, it looks like all of this is for nothing! I submitted a ticket to UDI about getting this device to be added to the device list and was told it won't be. What a freaking waste of time and effort to figure out all the details. Only to be shot down in the end.
stusviews Posted December 18, 2014 Posted December 18, 2014 But you found two great documents. Thanks
Teken Posted December 18, 2014 Author Posted December 18, 2014 But you found two great documents. Thanks Don't know why they have been available forever I just never bothered to look at them. Is this the first time those two PDF's have been seen here?
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