jgcharlotte Posted October 8, 2016 Posted October 8, 2016 I'm not sure I understand the 'non-toggle' mode. It looks like once you turn it on by pressing the button, it stays on and never turns off. I use the toggle mode to simulate a momentary so I can do 'press on/press off' (without any extra presses due to sync issues) with all 8 buttons and control 8 devices. I'm wondering if there is something I am missing about the 'non-toggle' mode that I can do instead.
danbutter Posted October 8, 2016 Posted October 8, 2016 As I understand it the non toggle functions as an on or off switch only. I don't currently use it, but I do have a button that is just for turning stuff off. I think it just depends on your use case.
fitzpatri8 Posted October 9, 2016 Posted October 9, 2016 Jg, it sounds like you understand. In toggle mode, each press/hold of each mini remote button alternates between sending on/bright and off/dim. In non-toggle, each button press/hold sends on/bright. Because the battery-operated mini remotes turn off their radios between uses, they cannot hear and respond to other controllers, thus the potential of them becoming out of sync with the rest of the scene and requiring two button presses to get the desired result. Your solution is the best choice, since the ISY does track the current state of the responder devices and can send the right signal with a single button press.
jgcharlotte Posted October 9, 2016 Author Posted October 9, 2016 Thanks, that's exactly what I'm seeing. I guess the intended use is to use the button for ON only, turn the target device OFF with something else. I do wish it was momentary instead, or one-shot. Right now I have a program to test for ON or OFF (toggle mode), set a state variable to 1 for one second, then back to 0 to create a one-shot. Then the one-shot triggers the program that evaluates the status of the target device and sends the correct command, ON or OFF. It works well, but requires 3 programs and a variable per control. I have not used KPL's before, I assume they act the same way, I have one coming in today.
G W Posted October 9, 2016 Posted October 9, 2016 What exactly are you trying to do? S.A.T.T.P. Best regards, Gary Funk
jgcharlotte Posted October 9, 2016 Author Posted October 9, 2016 Push on/Push off control. Without having to press twice if the device is controlled by something else, such as schedule, other control, etc.
G W Posted October 9, 2016 Posted October 9, 2016 That's the toggle mode. But if the remote truned it on it will remember it is on so if something else turns it off, the remote will think it is still on and issue an off command on the first push. S.A.T.T.P. Best regards, Gary Funk
jgcharlotte Posted October 9, 2016 Author Posted October 9, 2016 I don't think so, if I understand what you're saying. The toggle mode just toggles back and forth between on and off and doesn't care about the status of the device. So if the remote turned it on, the button will be on. If something else turns it off, the next press of the remote button will have no effect because it sends an off command. It has to be pressed again to generate an on command. I use the one-shot to evaluate the status. When you press the button if the device is on, send off, if the device is off, send an on. Maybe there's a simpler way to do it, but I couldn't think of one. It works perfectly. I Generate OneShot - [iD 009D][Parent 0095] If Control 'MBR KPL Button B' is switched On Or Control 'MBR KPL Button B' is switched Off Then $MBR_KPL_B_Mom = 1 Wait 1 second $MBR_KPL_B_Mom = 0 Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') Turn ON - [iD 009E][Parent 0095] If $MBR_KPL_B_Mom is 1 And Status 'MBR-Corner Lamp' is Off Then Set 'MBR-Corner Lamp' On Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') Turn OFF - [iD 009F][Parent 0095] If $MBR_KPL_B_Mom is 1 And Status 'MBR-Corner Lamp' is not Off Then Set 'MBR-Corner Lamp' Off Set Scene 'MBR KPL Indicator B' Off Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')
G W Posted October 9, 2016 Posted October 9, 2016 What you are doing with programs does solve the issue with the remote not getting updates when it sleeps. Best regards, Gary Funk
stusviews Posted October 9, 2016 Posted October 9, 2016 Non-toggle for the Mini Remote is somewhat different than for a KeypadLinc. The latter offers both non-toggle on and non-toggle off, but the former has non-toggle on only. I use non-toggle on for uses where off has no purpose, such as our garage doors, entry gates and fan speeds. I do use programs to turn the fans off. Everything else is accomplished with scenes.
jgcharlotte Posted October 9, 2016 Author Posted October 9, 2016 Non-toggle for the Mini Remote is somewhat different than for a KeypadLinc. The latter offers both non-toggle on and non-toggle off, but the former has non-toggle on only. I use non-toggle on for uses where off has no purpose, such as our garage doors, entry gates and fan speeds. I do use programs to turn the fans off. Everything else is accomplished with scenes. Yeah, I haven't really explored the difference in the KPL. I just assumed the functionality is the same as the mini-remote. I wish on the KPL that I could get the LED to ignore the status of the button. I want the LED to display the status of the device the button is controlling regardless of how it was turned on or off.
G W Posted October 9, 2016 Posted October 9, 2016 Yeah, I haven't really explored the difference in the KPL. I just assumed the functionality is the same as the mini-remote. I wish on the KPL that I could get the LED to ignore the status of the button. I want the LED to display the status of the device the button is controlling regardless of how it was turned on or off.It does do that if you add everything to a scene and you control the scene. S.A.T.T.P. Best regards, Gary Funk
stusviews Posted October 9, 2016 Posted October 9, 2016 Like all battery powered devices, the Mini Remote can be a controller only. It cannot respond to anything, so it's state cannot be controlled.
jgcharlotte Posted October 9, 2016 Author Posted October 9, 2016 It does do that if you add everything to a scene and you control the scene. S.A.T.T.P. Best regards, Gary Funk Hmmm, I did set up a scene for each LED so I can control it independently, but it still follows the button status. I need to play some more.. . . .
G W Posted October 9, 2016 Posted October 9, 2016 Hmmm, I did set up a scene for each LED so I can control it independently, but it still follows the button status. I need to play some more.. . . .On the KPL how do you have the button configured and how do you want the button to act? S.A.T.T.P. Best regards, Gary Funk
jgcharlotte Posted October 10, 2016 Author Posted October 10, 2016 It is configured as an on/off toggle. I would like it to read the status of the target device and send the appropriate command ie, if the device is on, send off and vice versa. Since it does not appear to do that, I would just like it to be a momentary (on while pressed) or a one-shot (on for a specified period of time, ie, 1 second, then off. That is what I'm creating in software with the state variable.
G W Posted October 10, 2016 Posted October 10, 2016 (edited) It is configured as an on/off toggle. I would like it to read the status of the target device and send the appropriate command ie, if the device is on, send off and vice versa.That's exactly what a KPL does. You have something configured wrong. S.A.T.T.P. Best regards, Gary Funk Edited October 10, 2016 by GaryFunk
jgcharlotte Posted October 10, 2016 Author Posted October 10, 2016 Maybe so. Like I said, I was assuming the KPL acts exactly like the mini-remote, so I coded it the same way. It may be simpler with the KPL, I need to play. This is the first KPL I've ever had since my boxes do not have neutral. I ordered it with the tabletop box and it just came in today.
fitzpatri8 Posted October 10, 2016 Posted October 10, 2016 Toggle mode is more powerful on the KeypadLinc, with each button supporting cross-linking as well as its own toggle setting. Set to toggle mode, each secondary KeypadLinc button press sends a signal opposite the current button state. If the button is currently on, tapping sends an Off; if the button is currently off, tapping sends an On. In non-toggle mode, each KeypadLinc button press sends the identical signal, regardless of the current button state. Because the KeypadLinc is a power line device, it can be linked as both a responder and as a controller. That way, it can stay synchronized with the state of the scene it controls.
jgcharlotte Posted October 10, 2016 Author Posted October 10, 2016 (edited) Ok, but I don't care about the button state, I want it to send the opposite of the DEVICE state. If the device is controlled by something other that the button, ie, schedule, different button etc. it throws it out of sync, right? Maybe it's because I'm not doing it as scenes, but programming? Edited October 10, 2016 by jgcharlotte
G W Posted October 10, 2016 Posted October 10, 2016 (edited) Ok, but I don't care about the button state, I want it to send the opposite of the DEVICE state. If the device is controlled by something other that the button, ie, schedule, different button etc. it throws it out of sync, right? Maybe it's because I'm not doing it as scenes, but programming? If you control the device from a scene and add the device and the KPL to the scene the KPL will be updated. You can control the scene from a program and the KPL will stay accurate. S.A.T.T.P. Best regards, Gary Funk Edited October 10, 2016 by GaryFunk
stusviews Posted October 10, 2016 Posted October 10, 2016 Ok, but I don't care about the button state, I want it to send the opposite of the DEVICE state. If the device is controlled by something other that the button, ie, schedule, different button etc. it throws it out of sync, right? Maybe it's because I'm not doing it as scenes, but programming? A program won't change the state of a secondary button unless you control a scene that includes that button. Any particular reason that you're using a program (which introduces a delay) rather than a scene?
jgcharlotte Posted October 10, 2016 Author Posted October 10, 2016 Not really. I used to use scenes for everything, even manual controls, when I had the 26. When I upgraded to the 994, I got away from that. If that is the case, that the KPL will stay updated, I should re-valuate that strategy. i am using scenes to control the status of the button LED.
stusviews Posted October 10, 2016 Posted October 10, 2016 That'll work if your program turns the scene that has the button as a member on and/or off . But if the program only controls scenes with no special condition other than on or off, then scenes are considerably more efficient.
G W Posted October 10, 2016 Posted October 10, 2016 Not really. I used to use scenes for everything, even manual controls, when I had the 26. When I upgraded to the 994, I got away from that. If that is the case, that the KPL will stay updated, I should re-valuate that strategy. i am using scenes to control the status of the button LED.You should be using scenes for everything. S.A.T.T.P. Best regards, Gary Funk
Recommended Posts