Deciding what to Buy

[smithlevenson]

I have some basic questions about the Elk M1 that I can't get a totally clear answer on. Any help on any question is greatly appreciated. I am not wedded to the Elk M1 so if something works better please let me know.

 

1) Controller: The Elk M1 can be controlled by the ISY 994i? I want to be able to set the alarm based on conditions and variables set in the ISY. What is the connection to the ISY? Ethernet or RF and Powerline?

 

2) Sensors: My house is pre-wired for an alarm. I assume I can use all these wires to wire in Elk (or 3rd party) sensors. I am wired for door contacts and motion sensors in the house.

 

3) Installation: What is the estimated install time? I am not that worried about this other than trying to allocate hours or days to it. I am pretty competent with ISY, programming and electrical. I imagine it will just be a typical learning curve.

 

4) The keypads: Are they lit all the time? I am planning one in my bedroom and would not like the light to be blaring all night long. One status LED would be perfect.

 

5) Remote Status: Can I get real time status on the alarm remotely? I don't think I want anything except a direct keypad or keyfob turn off of the system for security reasons, but arming and monitoring it remotely would be great.

 

6) Monitoring: Does anyone have monitoring suggestions? I am planning on wiring to Ethernet. I don't think I need backup wireless because the thieves here are more smash and grab types. The last 3 robberies in my neighborhood the thieves were here less than 2 minutes. I would of course like to be notified directly of course, but professional monitoring would be great to have to disarm once I have confirmed no activity with the cameras. 

 

I am sure I have more questions, but this will get me started. Thanks Again.

 

Smith

[Scottmichaelj]

See my reply in red. If you have any other questions feel free to PM me and I will give you my contact information. My company is a authorized Elk reseller and installer plus Alarm Relay referred company.

 

 

 

I have some basic questions about the Elk M1 that I can't get a totally clear answer on. Any help on any question is greatly appreciated. I am not wedded to the Elk M1 so if something works better please let me know.
 
1) Controller: The Elk M1 can be controlled by the ISY 994i? I want to be able to set the alarm based on conditions and variables set in the ISY. What is the connection to the ISY? Ethernet or RF and Powerline? The ELK M1 can be controlled by the ISY 994 but you will need to buy the Elk module. The connection is M1 Gold panel via a serial cable to the Elk XEP. From the XEP to the ISY is Cat/RG45 to a switch in your network. Then the XEP shows up as another IP device.
 
2) Sensors: My house is pre-wired for an alarm. I assume I can use all these wires to wire in Elk (or 3rd party) sensors. I am wired for door contacts and motion sensors in the house. You can use all your existing hardwired sensors. The only "tricky" thing would be existing wireless, then you would need a wireless receiver for those.
 
3) Installation: What is the estimated install time? I am not that worried about this other than trying to allocate hours or days to it. I am pretty competent with ISY, programming and electrical. I imagine it will just be a typical learning curve. This varies from person to person. Most people can install a system and program it within in a day. However testing and tweaking to your preferences over time could take days and weeks.
 
4) The keypads: Are they lit all the time? I am planning one in my bedroom and would not like the light to be blaring all night long. One status LED would be perfect. Keypads do not have to be always lit. There is a setting in the ElkRP software to configure them. 
 
5) Remote Status: Can I get real time status on the alarm remotely? I don't think I want anything except a direct keypad or keyfob turn off of the system for security reasons, but arming and monitoring it remotely would be great. If you have the Elk plugin module for mobilinc you can see the alarm status and arm/disarm the system. Mobilinc also has a "faux" keypad where you would have to enter the user code so just anyone cant do it. Plus if you have a touchid enabled that adds even more security. Not sure if Android has this. The Agave app for android has a keypad so you have to enter a code as well. IMHO Keyfobs are great for kids.
 
6) Monitoring: Does anyone have monitoring suggestions? I am planning on wiring to Ethernet. I don't think I need backup wireless because the thieves here are more smash and grab types. The last 3 robberies in my neighborhood the thieves were here less than 2 minutes. I would of course like to be notified directly of course, but professional monitoring would be great to have to disarm once I have confirmed no activity with the cameras. Alarm Relay who is Watchlight is what many of use use here. They are an amazing company, professional and quick response times. Every client I install a system for uses them as well and I have not had one negative comment. You will never stop a smash and grab though. Any company can call the police but if they dont get there in 30 mins what can you do. Another form of protection for smash and grabs is putting security tint on the windows. Then its hard for the theifs to use a center punch and break the glass walk in grab the laptop sitting on the kitchen table and run out. The other half to smash and grabs is not leaving the computer on the kitchen table in plain view where it entices a smash and grab. Alarm relay can be monitored using internet. However if you have no backup and the internet is down...a cell backup still might be a good idea.
 
I am sure I have more questions, but this will get me started. Thanks Again. Feel free to PM me or post if you think of anything else. Also do a search I have helped a bunch of people on the forum so many questions like these have been answered. Cocoontech forums has a ton of ELK and security related threads as well and might be helpful for researching too.

Smith

[Teken]

Just to add some clarity to one question you posed - The ELK system uses different value resistors to determine short, open, out of band resistive value. If your existing alarm system has EOL resistors you will need to change them otherwise the system will declare a fault.

[smithlevenson]

Thanks for the info. As always it is much appreciated. I do not have sensors, just wiring for them installed by a local alarm company when I built the house.

 

Just to add some clarity to one question you posed - The ELK system uses different value resistors to determine short, open, out of band resistive value. If your existing alarm system has EOL resistors you will need to change them otherwise the system will declare a fault.

[apostolakisl]

Thanks for the info. As always it is much appreciated. I do not have sensors, just wiring for them installed by a local alarm company when I built the house.

 

That is odd.  Does this mean that you have wires sitting behind your window and door moldings waiting to be connected to something?  How would you know where the wires are and how would you get to them?

[Teken]

If this is a new install and only the wires exist that's great but please do consider installing the EOL resitors. Doing so will ensure any possible fault on the line will be captured and please don't install the resistor at the panel. I would encourage you if its financially possible to consider having a cellular back up to the system.

 

The adage one is none - two is one . . .

 

The following reply is intended to address some security elements in a general sense while others are meant to provide some over view. In no specific order of importance or relevance please consider the following during your deployment.

 

- Identify all wiring and document it in a book and at the panel door. Doing so will offer quick reference and reduce hunting as to what a specific white, brown, black, what ever wire does.

 

- Always adhere to the maximum wire distance the panel states to ensure the expected operating voltage is seen.

 

- Sensors: Always read, understand, and install the sensors per the makers recommendations ensuring proper height, distance, and FOV is respected. Never install a indoor sensor for the outside even if you have read 99999999999999 people do so. Unlike other things in life you want 100% uptime and assurance if an alarm goes off its real. You don't want to be visited by the police or receive a service charge for false alarms.

 

- Insurance: Once the alarm system has been fully commissioned and monitored by a certified CS (Central Station). Advise your home owner insurance carrier so you can obtain that nice discount. This would also be a good time to complete a inventory audit and document what valuables and possessions you have. Even if you simply take panoramic photo's having something is better than nothing to offer the insurance co.

 

Always review your insurance policy and fully understand what (IS) and what (ISN'T) covered and for what condition must be met before coverage is offered. You will quickly find out depending upon where you live and what company you have some actually state a break in must happen threw the front door or a door.

 

I would ask you how many doors are in your home?

 

Many have side doors to the garage which leads to the interior of the home. That door is technically an interior door it is not in fact an exterior door by the insurance companies definition. Nor is a garden double door a front door, nor is a cellar door which also leads to the basement of some homes.

 

After a break in, fire, tornado, earth quake, it doesn't matter what happens the only thing that will ever make you remotely whole is insurance.

 

Please ensure you sit down and talk to your carrier and ask what amounts are offered for what use case. Understand the fine print and have them explain it in plain English because lots of the written text really sounds like legalize which makes no sense.

 

Testing / Validation: When you start to commission your security alarm system ensure you test every zone. Ensure the definitions match what you expect to happen and how the system faults over during a violation. You must always test the system via a *Walk Test* to ensure the motion sensors operate as expected in both extreme heat, cold, and humid conditions.

 

You pretty much get what you pay for in terms of reliable sensing . . .

 

Cheaper sensors will literally allow a person to walk past the entire FOV of the sensor grid. This is because they are not calibrated to detect slow to fast moving objects accurately. If finances aren't too tight always consider dual tech sensors which incorporate IR & Microwave.

 

Better sensors offer what the industry calls *Creep Sensing* this essentially means the sensor is watching the walls where a person would try to hug the wall undetected. Anti Masking is another feature many lower priced sensors don't offer and that simply means if someone use spray paint or some kind of masking agent to cover the lens.

 

Better sensors can detect these threats easily  . . .

 

Almost every major sensor maker offers the ability to monitor the sensor for being removed, open, to missing. Ensure you configure all tamper sensors to detect the above to ensure the highest level of protection.

 

Battery Load Test: Purchase the largest SLA battery you can to fit inside the can. This will not only offer you the longest run time but offer you a operational buffer during extreme hot / cold. Every year you must perform a real world load test of the system which means you will actually trip the alarm and see how long it will continue to operate.

 

Since many city's have noise abatement laws in place this is very hard to do with out being *That Guy*. So you will simply test it for ten minutes and see what happens. While doing this you will monitor the alarm panel voltage for a fault condition(s).

 

Once you have completed the the audible / visual tests you can use a carbon pile load tester to actually load the battery and see if it pasts the test. This simple test will offer you a pass vs fail immediately so don't live your life thinking you're protected when you aren't.

 

If you're feeling thrifty you can purchase a high quality conductance tester which offers more insight and accuracy while also avoids damage to the battery.

 

Passwords: I have blogged about this probably for 25 years now. You must think of your home like a work place. At work many Enterprise organizations require frequent password changes. You must do this also and don't use the same 4-6 digit PIN everyone uses!

 

More secure environments like mine change the password every quarter and must use 6-12 digit PIN's. While also having RFID, Scan cards, and bio-metric finger / hand access.

 

Duress Code: Always ensure you have a duress code and pass phrase logged with the CS. This is the only thing that will ever give you a chance during a home invasion / kick down.

 

Key Holders: You must always know and update who the key holders are on the account. They all must be assigned a different pass phrase to authenticate who they are.

 

Wireless: More than likely this doesn't impact you but for the benefit of others there are technically 4 classes of security. The most common is class 1, 2, 3. By default if you ever install one single RF device it will drop you down one class. Most consumer grade alarms fall under class 2 and when a person adds in RF devices it drops them to a 1.

 

There is probably only one reason to install a wireless RF device and that is to *Compliment* an existing wired solution. Wireless was created for the lazy, inept, and cheap. There isn't a home today that can't be wired for an alarm system because that's what everyone did for the last 50 years!

 

It doesn't matter what anyone every tells you about XYZ wireless sensors blah blah blah . . .

 

Consider the source, consider what there back ground is, and consider what their motives are.

 

Humans by their very nature are lazy - imagine a home with no less than 25-55 battery operated devices? People can't even do a monthly fire check of the smoke alarm, GFCI, AFCI, etc. What makes them think that so called 1-10 year battery device will be checked.

 

God forbid they actually had the common sense to have spare batteries on hand . . .

 

The ongoing costs, maintenance, along with varied performance is why wireless devices are never used in anything serious.

[jasont]

That is odd.  Does this mean that you have wires sitting behind your window and door moldings waiting to be connected to something?  How would you know where the wires are and how would you get to them?

That's exactly how my house was pre-wired, with all of the wires running back to a big bundle in a smart closet. I'd install one door sensor, leave the door open, then go back to the smart closet and test all of the wires until I found the open one. Was a fun afternoon. Lol

[Scottmichaelj]

Just to add some clarity to one question you posed - The ELK system uses different value resistors to determine short, open, out of band resistive value. If your existing alarm system has EOL resistors you will need to change them otherwise the system will declare a fault.

The Elk panel comes with everything he will need including the resistors. Nothing to worry about there.

[Scottmichaelj]

That is odd. Does this mean that you have wires sitting behind your window and door moldings waiting to be connected to something? How would you know where the wires are and how would you get to them?

Most home builds will run wire and place a small cap/plug over it with loop on the inside end. Pull out the plug and wires come out with it. Screw the wires to the terminals apply a bit of silicon and push it back in. Easy peasy.

[Teken]

The Elk panel comes with everything he will need including the resistors. Nothing to worry about there.

 

My comment was before the OP provided the information that he has a brand new home prewired. Not that an existing system was in place and thus my reply was under the assumption if it was an existing alarm system that he be aware (IF) the existing system used EOL resistors that he be cognoscente of such and use the appropriate values required by the ELK system. 

[Scottmichaelj]

My comment was before the OP provided the information that he has a brand new home prewired. Not that an existing system was in place and thus my reply was under the assumption if it was an existing alarm system that he be aware (IF) the existing system used EOL resistors that he be cognoscente of such and use the appropriate values required by the ELK system.

Still worthless info and only confuses people buddy. If there's a alarm system in place and your swapping it out with a new system they would use new resitors that are included. I haven't seen one self install try and use them. Its possible but unlikely. Just saying. K.I.S.S.

[Teken]

Still worthless info and only confuses people buddy. If there's a alarm system in place and your swapping it out with a new system they would use new resitors that are included. I haven't seen one self install try and use them. Its possible but unlikely. Just saying. K.I.S.S.

Your grasping at straws . . .

[Scottmichaelj]

Your grasping at straws . . .

So are you.

[Teken]

Stay off the sauce it's affecting your reading comprehension.

 

 

=========================

 

The highest calling in life is to serve ones country faithfully - Teach others what can be. Do what is right and not what is popular.

[Scottmichaelj]

Stay off the sauce it's affecting your reading comprehension.

 

 

=========================

 

The highest calling in life is to serve ones country faithfully - Teach others what can be. Do what is right and not what is popular.

Why do you insist on always having the last word and what makes you think I am drinking?

 

The point IF I must, you say "stop grasping at straws" yet you are the one grasping for straws. Your assuming people are so cheap they will reuse an old resister off their old security panel rather than have common sense and use the new ones (which they may think only work with Elk) on the install.

 

IF I really wanted to open a can of whipass on you I would go to DSC, Honeywell, Elk and whomever manufacturers website and see if the resistors are different. If I was to guess I bet they all use the same ones.

 

So go relax and take your trolling elsewhere. I am trying to help the OP. Maybe you need to think about "does my post add anything beneficial"?

[Teken]

Why do you insist on always having the last word and what makes you think I am drinking?

 

The point IF I must, you say "stop grasping at straws" yet you are the one grasping for straws. Your assuming people are so cheap they will reuse an old resister off their old security panel rather than have common sense and use the new ones (which they may think only work with Elk) on the install.

 

IF I really wanted to open a can of whipass on you I would go to DSC, Honeywell, Elk and whomever manufacturers website and see if the resistors are different. If I was to guess I bet they all use the same ones.

 

So go relax and take your trolling elsewhere. I am trying to help the OP. Maybe you need to think about "does my post add anything beneficial"?

 

The only person who is injecting anything and wasting bandwidth is you at the moment. It would be a good idea for you to check what resistor values other companies use because they are indeed different!

 

Even though you pretend your off colored remark of *Its still worthless* is something you decided to offer. I have to assume based on such a childish reply and given the clear facts what I stated in my initial remark.

 

You felt slighted  . . .

 

Why? I don't know why because my reply was exactly what I stated which was to offer more clarity.

 

You failed to once again read, comprehend, and understand what I wrote above.

 

So I will lay it out:  s l o w l y and quote what I wrote and what your reply was in a childish manner which in no way offered anything positive to the conversation besides attack another forum member because you are having a bad day.

 

 

Just to add some clarity to one question you posed - The ELK system uses different value resistors to determine short, open, out of band resistive value. If your existing alarm system has EOL resistors you will need to change them otherwise the system will declare a fault.

 

What does the first sentence state?!?

 

Read it again . . .

 

The Elk panel comes with everything he will need including the resistors. Nothing to worry about there.

 

What does this reply have to do with what I just clearly stated?!?!

 

Nothing . . .

 

My comment was before the OP provided the information that he has a brand new home prewired. Not that an existing system was in place and thus my reply was under the assumption if it was an existing alarm system that he be aware (IF) the existing system used EOL resistors that he be cognoscente of such and use the appropriate values required by the ELK system. 

This was my clarification which you obviously didn't read or chose to ignore. What is stated doesn't get any clearer.

Still worthless info and only confuses people buddy. If there's a alarm system in place and your swapping it out with a new system they would use new resitors that are included. I haven't seen one self install try and use them. Its possible but unlikely. Just saying. K.I.S.S.

 

This is your reply even after I tried to clarify what was meant even though 99999999999999999 lay and common person already understood this perfect English. But you decided to come into a thread shooting your mouth off for what reason?!? 

 

Why do you insist on always having the last word and what makes you think I am drinking?

 

The point IF I must, you say "stop grasping at straws" yet you are the one grasping for straws. Your assuming people are so cheap they will reuse an old resister off their old security panel rather than have common sense and use the new ones (which they may think only work with Elk) on the install.

 

IF I really wanted to open a can of whipass on you I would go to DSC, Honeywell, Elk and whomever manufacturers website and see if the resistors are different. If I was to guess I bet they all use the same ones.

 

So go relax and take your trolling elsewhere. I am trying to help the OP. Maybe you need to think about "does my post add anything beneficial"?

 

I am very relaxed and the only one trolling is you at the moment. I never came into this thread stating *Hey come talk to me, PM me, I sell this, I am authorized for this, like a shill.

 

So once again (IF) someone is reading these replies who do you believe has offered more insight without bias? I don't get paid for what I tell people. I don't get anything for helping people nor do I benefit from spending countless hours reading and offering insight to those asking the very same.

 

So, I would ask you to consider your last line of reply: Does my post add anything beneficial??

 

The facts speak for themselves and it has nothing to do with getting in the last word. Stop being obstinate and take it easy on the sauce because your not very fun to be around when your crabby.

 

End of line . . . 

[Scottmichaelj]

The only person who is injecting anything and wasting bandwidth is you at the moment. It would be a good idea for you to check what resistor values other companies use because they are indeed different!

 

Even though you pretend your off colored remark of *Its still worthless* is something you decided to offer. I have to assume based on such a childish reply and given the clear facts what I stated in my initial remark.

 

You felt slighted . . .

 

Why? I don't know why because my reply was exactly what I stated which was to offer more clarity.

 

You failed to once again read, comprehend, and understand what I wrote above.

 

So I will lay it out: s l o w l y and quote what I wrote and what your reply was in a childish manner which in no way offered anything positive to the conversation besides attack another forum member because you are having a bad day.

 

 

 

What does the first sentence state?!?

 

Read it again . . .

 

 

What does this reply have to do with what I just clearly stated?!?!

 

Nothing . . .

 

 

This is your reply even after I tried to clarify what was meant even though 99999999999999999 lay and common person already understood this perfect English. But you decided to come into a thread shooting your mouth off for what reason?!?

 

 

I am very relaxed and the only one trolling is you at the moment. I never came into this thread stating *Hey come talk to me, PM me, I sell this, I am authorized for this, like a shill.

 

So once again (IF) someone is reading these replies who do you believe has offered more insight without bias? I don't get paid for what I tell people. I don't get anything for helping people nor do I benefit from spending countless hours reading and offering insight to those asking the very same.

 

So, I would ask you to consider your last line of reply: Does my post add anything beneficial??

 

The facts speak for themselves and it has nothing to do with getting in the last word. Stop being obstinate and take it easy on the sauce because your not very fun to be around when yours crabby.

 

End of line . . .

What system do you think he had? Maybe we could agree on a Vista 20p panel as there are a ton of those out there? Look up the resistors for it and then the Elk. Post proof from the manuals of each showing me they are different. Then I might listen. Let also add what resistor size would even make a difference? Elk uses a 2.2k, a Honeywell uses 2k, 0.2k wouldn't even register a difference! Stop and prove what you say. Just cuz you say something doesn't make it true. Why are you arguing with me? Your the one who went off on the resistors tangent. The OP doesn't care and it doesn't matter for what he asked for.

[Teken]

What system do you think he had? Maybe we could agree on a Vista 20p panel as there are a ton of those out there? Look up the resistors for it and then the Elk. Post proof from the manuals of each showing me they are different. Then I might listen. Let also add what resistor size would even make a difference? Elk uses a 2.2k, a Honeywell uses 2k, 0.2k wouldn't even register a difference! Stop and prove what you say. Just cuz you say something doesn't make it true. Why are you arguing with me? Your the one who went off on the resistors tangent. The OP doesn't care and it doesn't matter for what he asked for.

For just a moment could you read the replies. Did you notice he *Liked* my reply about the resistor?

 

Doesn't that mean he saw value to that insight?!?

 

Read it again when your sober!

 

You believe there isn't a difference in 2.0 vs 2.2 K ohms?! I suppose every alarm company decided to just use what ever was on hand and call it good?

 

You really need to stop talking about something that obviously isn't in your skill set.

 

Go hug your wife, tell her you love her, and tell her your being mean to Teken.

 

Because you lost money on the ponies!

[Scottmichaelj]

For just a moment could you read the replies. Did you notice he *Liked* my reply about the resistor?

 

Doesn't that mean he saw value to that insight?!?

 

Read it again when your sober!

 

You believe there isn't a difference in 2.0 vs 2.2 K ohms?! I suppose every alarm company decided to just use what ever was on hand and call it good?

 

You really need to stop talking about something that obviously isn't in your skill set.

 

Go hug your wife, tell her you love her, and tell her your being mean to Teken.

 

Because you lost money on the ponies!

Just bc you say it with confidence doesn't make it true. Please stop attacking me personally, I haven't brought your family into this nor should you. Your going a bit over the line with me. The OP was asking for help so I tried to help him. Maybe he just wanted to thank you and that's why he liked your post. Your only making a conjecture why he liked your post to fit your argument with me. Are we not on the same side? I am not arguing that he use his old resistors of if he had a panel installed. I am just saying not everyone is a complete idiot. You yourself posted how most people on this forum are highly intelligent so stop assuming people are stupid. Why must you always go and say things that don't really need to be said? Are you Captain obvious?

 

All your post fluff would make a great chocolate filled donut. yum donuts. Now I want donuts. Thanks a lot.

[Teken]

Just bc you say it with confidence doesn't make it true. Please stop attacking me personally, I haven't brought your family into this nor should you. Your going a bit over the line with me. The OP was asking for help so I tried to help him. Maybe he just wanted to thank you and that's why he liked your post. Your only making a conjecture why he liked your post to fit your argument with me. Are we not on the same side? I am not arguing that he use his old resistors of he had a panel installed. I am just saying not everyone is a complete idiot. You yourself posted how most people on this forum are highly intelligent so stop assuming people are stupid. Why must you always go and say things that don't really need to be said? Are you Captain obvious?

 

All your post fluff would make a great chocolate filled donut. yum donuts. Bow I want donuts. Thanks a lot.

Your right don't tell her your being mean to Teken. She will only scold you and say dial it down.

 

Now stop pissing on my leg it's quite wet!

[larryllix]

I have some basic questions about the Elk M1 that I can't get a totally clear answer on. Any help on any question is greatly appreciated. I am not wedded to the Elk M1 so if something works better please let me know.

 

1) Controller: The Elk M1 can be controlled by the ISY 994i? I want to be able to set the alarm based on conditions and variables set in the ISY. What is the connection to the ISY? Ethernet or RF and Powerline?

 

2) Sensors: My house is pre-wired for an alarm. I assume I can use all these wires to wire in Elk (or 3rd party) sensors. I am wired for door contacts and motion sensors in the house.

 

3) Installation: What is the estimated install time? I am not that worried about this other than trying to allocate hours or days to it. I am pretty competent with ISY, programming and electrical. I imagine it will just be a typical learning curve.

 

4) The keypads: Are they lit all the time? I am planning one in my bedroom and would not like the light to be blaring all night long. One status LED would be perfect.

 

5) Remote Status: Can I get real time status on the alarm remotely? I don't think I want anything except a direct keypad or keyfob turn off of the system for security reasons, but arming and monitoring it remotely would be great.

 

6) Monitoring: Does anyone have monitoring suggestions? I am planning on wiring to Ethernet. I don't think I need backup wireless because the thieves here are more smash and grab types. The last 3 robberies in my neighborhood the thieves were here less than 2 minutes. I would of course like to be notified directly of course, but professional monitoring would be great to have to disarm once I have confirmed no activity with the cameras.

 

I am sure I have more questions, but this will get me started. Thanks Again.

 

Smith

Maybe you want to sell your panel? Does it come with the eol resistors?

 

How much would you be asking for it? What model is it?

 

I seem to quite valuable to some.

[Scottmichaelj]

Maybe you want to sell your panel?

 

How much would you be asking for it?

 

I seem to quite valuable to some.

He doesn't have a panel. It seems his house is prewired and he wants an Elk.

[MWareman]

Scott, I could be wrong (often am) but I have not been in ElkRP for a while. I seem to remember you could adjust Elk to whatever resistors were there, and not necessarily have to replace them with the supplied resistor - even per zone? (As long as the resistor is at the sensor end of the wire of course!)

[apostolakisl]

Scott, I could be wrong (often am) but I have not been in ElkRP for a while. I seem to remember you could adjust Elk to whatever resistors were there, and not necessarily have to replace them with the supplied resistor - even per zone? (As long as the resistor is at the sensor end of the wire of course!)

I have been all over the elk rp2 software and have not seen where you can adjust the voltage the panel reads as secure.  Basically, the panel has ~2200 ohms of built-in resistance prior to the output.  It reads the voltage off the output as it outputs (after the internal resistor).  So if you add 2200 more it splits the voltage in half and the panel reads half of what it would be at infinite (open circuit).  The internal resistor serves two purposes.  1) It controls how the voltage will read downstream from it based on what resistance it meets downstream and 2) Without an internal resistor a shorted zone would truly be shorted and fry the board.  

 

So, rounding off, you get 14v with open circuit and 7v with eol, and 0 volts with closed (no eol).  On battery backup it goes to 12 and 6v.  The Elk manual tells you the exact range of voltages that will be read as what on page 9.  There is also an alternate resistor setup you can include for added tamper protection.  Also, I have used that 4 voltage configuration to configure non-alarm zones for communicating 4 unique states.

 

DSC uses 5600 ohm resistors, so if you were replacing a dsc panel you would definitely need to replace the eol resistors (if they were used at all).  Not sure about any other since I have only ever installed DSC and Elk.  But 5600 ohms would not work.  It would read roughly 9.6 volts which is out of range for secure.

 

I highly recommend using eol resistors and actually putting them somewhere that approximates the actual end of line.

 

I wouldn't think a builder would put in alarm system wiring without the alarm system, but if it is a custom house, you can mostly get them do whatever you want that doesn't violate code.

[Scottmichaelj]

I have been all over the elk rp2 software and have not seen where you can adjust the voltage the panel reads as secure. Basically, the panel has ~2200 ohms of built-in resistance prior to the output. It reads the voltage off the output as it outputs (after the internal resistor). So if you add 2200 more it splits the voltage in half and the panel reads half of what it would be at infinite (open circuit). The internal resistor serves two purposes. 1) It controls how the voltage will read downstream from it based on what resistance it meets downstream and 2) Without an internal resistor a shorted zone would truly be shorted and fry the board.

 

So, rounding off, you get 14v with open circuit and 7v with eol, and 0 volts with closed (no eol). On battery backup it goes to 12 and 6v. The Elk manual tells you the exact range of voltages that will be read as what on page 9. There is also an alternate resistor setup you can include for added tamper protection. Also, I have used that 4 voltage configuration to configure non-alarm zones for communicating 4 unique states.

 

DSC uses 5600 ohm resistors, so if you were replacing a dsc panel you would definitely need to replace the eol resistors (if they were used at all). Not sure about any other since I have only ever installed DSC and Elk. But 5600 ohms would not work. It would read roughly 9.6 volts which is out of range for secure.

 

I highly recommend using eol resistors and actually putting them somewhere that approximates the actual end of line.

 

I wouldn't think a builder would put in alarm system wiring without the alarm system, but if it is a custom house, you can mostly get them do whatever you want that doesn't violate code.

Thanks for posting with actual information. I do see track homes almost weekly that have a central enclosure with all wires tossed in it, audio, coax, security, phone, etc. So it's not abnormal by any means. At the end of the day things went off the rails as it seems to be on almost every post. I think Teken is trying to up his post count to match Stus. The thing is Stus are shorter and most of the time on topic.