jkraus Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 I have used Mutually Exclusive on KPL before, but first time with "A" Pad, may make a difference? I have "A" and "C" in two different scenes that both contain the same lights but to different level brightness. Each work OK but when "A" is pressed on the KPL backlight goes on but when "C" is pressed "A" backlight does not go off. If done the other way ( C then A) C backlight goes off correctly I have A & C in one of the mutually exclusive groups. Any thoughts? Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Hi jkraus, Two questions: 1. Are these buttons in any other scenes as responders? 2. Are these buttons used in any programs? Would you be kind enough to try and restore the device and report the results? Thanks and with kind regards, Michel I have used Mutually Exclusive on KPL before, but first time with "A" Pad, may make a difference? I have "A" and "C" in two different scenes that both contain the same lights but to different level brightness. Each work OK but when "A" is pressed on the KPL backlight goes on but when "C" is pressed "A" backlight does not go off. If done the other way ( C then A) C backlight goes off correctly I have A & C in one of the mutually exclusive groups. Any thoughts? Link to comment
jkraus Posted August 30, 2009 Author Share Posted August 30, 2009 when you "restore" do you have to restore every pad in a KPL i.e. all 8? Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Hi again, NO. With kind regards, Michel when you "restore" do you have to restore every pad in a KPL i.e. all 8? Link to comment
jkraus Posted August 30, 2009 Author Share Posted August 30, 2009 Hmmm... I seem to be having other issues. I recently had our baseboard redone so APs and SL we unplugged for a few days. Now all plugged back in and things seemed to be working OK, but for two nites in a row now the outside lights that came on OK at the scheduled sunset but have not turned off at 11PM as they always have before., must be some other magical issue going on. Should I start from scratch with installing APs from the beginning as I have bout 5 of them. Once again, just when I think I have it all working something happens Link to comment
jkraus Posted August 30, 2009 Author Share Posted August 30, 2009 May be narrowing in on my communication issues, but the mutually exclusive issue between C & A remains. To answer the questions, no they are not in another other scenes and yes I did a restore Joe Link to comment
ResIpsa Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 I am investigating this exact same issue, and was actually just coming here to start a new thread on it. (Up till now I have dealt with it through programs.) I have an 8-button KPL which has always displayed this problem. I tried restoring it this morning and that did not resolve it. I just completely removed it, factory reset it, and added it back to ISY, and the same issue occurs. My buttons are not in any other scenes as responders, and they are not used in any programs. FYI, my KPL shows date code 0725 and Rev. 1.65. It reports in ISY as v.2C. May be narrowing in on my communication issues, but the mutually exclusive issue between C & A remains. To answer the questions, no they are not in another other scenes and yes I did a restore Joe Link to comment
jkraus Posted August 30, 2009 Author Share Posted August 30, 2009 Interesting. To add to the confusion, I have keys B, D, E, and F on the SAME KPL in a Mutually exclusive group and they work fine, hence my question about something "different" about Key A since in a 6 pad configuration is controls the load I think, as currently my 3 KPLs are all in 8 pad mode Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Hello Tim and jkraus, I just checked two of my KPLs (neither of which are 2C; they are 29 and 31), and the both work fine: A and C in 8 button configuration Load and C in 6 button configuration A and C in 6 button configuration So, I assume the load button is the issue in both cases, right? With kind regards, Michel Link to comment
jkraus Posted August 30, 2009 Author Share Posted August 30, 2009 If you mean by "load button" button A, yes, although I am just using it in a scene. Link to comment
mozman Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 FWIW, I have always seen the same issue - you can't have the load button on a KPL be part of a mutually exclusive group. I have just started using the ISY, and haven't tried to set mutually exclusive using ISY; rather, my experience comes from using HouseLinc2 to set up mutually exclusive groups. (I have never taken the time to try to set up mutually exclusive buttons with tap-tap programming, so I can't say if that would work.) My work around was to write an event that set the load off on the KPL (which I was using solely for scenes) whenever any of the other buttons in the mutually exclusive group were pressed. Link to comment
jkraus Posted August 30, 2009 Author Share Posted August 30, 2009 Now BOTH buttons come on and off at same time. I think I have over programmed it. How do I do reset. Can I do a Factory reset then do a restore from the ISY? Step by step , please! Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Hi, I really think there's something else in play here. But, yes, you can factory reset and restore: 1. To factory reset your KPL, take the set button out, leave out for 10 seconds and then push it back in and hold it in for 10 seconds 2. Right mouse click on any of the buttons for the KPL and choose Restore Device With kind regards, Michel Link to comment
ResIpsa Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 To answer Michel's question, there is no load attached to my KPL, so Button A is only used in scenes. Hello Tim and jkraus, I just checked two of my KPLs (neither of which are 2C; they are 29 and 31), and the both work fine: A and C in 8 button configuration Load and C in 6 button configuration A and C in 6 button configuration So, I assume the load button is the issue in both cases, right? With kind regards, Michel Link to comment
jkraus Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 Michel Thought it was a communication issue I was having in another thread that I fixed: "OK, Looks like I figured it out. When I replugged everything into the socket that the PLM plugs into the isolation X10 filter was on the wrong side of the extension cord so all of the TV and DVR was not isolated. Now that it is seems to be working OK" but still having problem after reset and restore. Both A & C are both coming on when either is pressed, very weird Joe Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Hi again, I guess it's time for us to get a 2C KPL and test. As I mentioned before, I cannot reproduce this problem here. Are all your KPLs version 2C? With kind regards, Michel Michel Thought it was a communication issue I was having in another thread that I fixed: "OK, Looks like I figured it out. When I replugged everything into the socket that the PLM plugs into the isolation X10 filter was on the wrong side of the extension cord so all of the TV and DVR was not isolated. Now that it is seems to be working OK" but still having problem after reset and restore. Both A & C are both coming on when either is pressed, very weird Joe Link to comment
jkraus Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 I don't know how to tell. I bought them within the past 6 months, but how do I tell? Can I tell without removing it? if not I may replace with an extra KPL I have, but what is the difference? You said "I just checked two of my KPLs (neither of which are 2C; they are 29 and 31), and the both work fine: ", but I do not know what that means The description in the ISY console says "ver 2D" Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Hi Joe, I thought you mentioned they were 2C (the description in ISY). So, do you have both 2Cs and 2Ds? If so, are both exhibiting the same problem? With kind regards, Michel I don't know how to tell. I bought them within the past 6 months, but how do I tell? Can I tell without removing it? if not I may replace with an extra KPL I have, but what is the difference? You said "I just checked two of my KPLs (neither of which are 2C; they are 29 and 31), and the both work fine: ", but I do not know what that means The description in the ISY console says "ver 2D" Link to comment
jkraus Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 No, never said that. Now checking, I have 2 each Ver D and one ver 00 for a totall of three, but the one acting up is ver 2D Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Hi again, So, is it true that both 2Ds have the same issue and the 00 does not? I just need to isolate the problem and make sure it's not device firmware related vs. ISY related. Thanks so very much for your patience and input. With kind regards, Michel No, never said that. Now checking, I have 2 each Ver D and one ver 00 for a totall of three, but the one acting up is ver 2D Link to comment
jkraus Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 Sorry, not being clear. I have two ver D but have only tried this particular set up on one of them. On other units I have used mutually exclusive button, but never using pads A so was focusing in on that difference. The other "difference" is that I may have a defective device since again I have only tired one. I have another KPL in a box never used, don't know the version # but could try that as I think the ISY "replace" feature, although never tried, should make it pretty easy, as it does all of the programming for you, right? Thanks for your help Joe Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 Hi Joe, Apologies for a tardy reply. I think the best thing to do would be to simply add your new KPL to ISY ( do not replace ), try the Mutex buttons on the new KPL and let me know if it works. If it does, then the problem is isolated to either that firmware version of KPL or that specific KPL. With kind regards, Michel Sorry, not being clear. I have two ver D but have only tried this particular set up on one of them. On other units I have used mutually exclusive button, but never using pads A so was focusing in on that difference. The other "difference" is that I may have a defective device since again I have only tired one. I have another KPL in a box never used, don't know the version # but could try that as I think the ISY "replace" feature, although never tried, should make it pretty easy, as it does all of the programming for you, right? Thanks for your help Joe Link to comment
jkraus Posted September 2, 2009 Author Share Posted September 2, 2009 OK, will try over the next coupe of days as this KPL is not in a critical application so till I get time, I will report, so just put in the new one and try. Will do Link to comment
jkraus Posted September 5, 2009 Author Share Posted September 5, 2009 Hi Michel I got around to replacing the KPL with another one then using the "replace device" function. It also is a Ver 2D and same thing, both A&C come on together and go off together, but each will activate teh correct scene. Now in these scenes I have two other KPLs. Those scenes are controlled by different pads (B&D) on the two other KPLs , would that be an issue? Also, unrelated question (I think it is unrelated) is currently I have two different scenes for the same lights but at different levels. Then each of these two pad controls the two different scenes. Is it better to make one scene, put both pads in that scene but have them just control the lights to different levels? The more I research, I have more questions. In each scene that has a KPL pad A in it there is a control for "applied locally fo keypad A" but not other pads just A. Why is this and what's unique about A Is it for when it is in 6 button mode? But this is in 8 button mode. Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 Hi Joe, Thanks so very much. So, it seems that there's an issue with version 2Ds. As far as your question about them being part of other scenes, it should not really matter as long as there are NO programs that are activated to control those scenes based on the status of devices in the other scene. And, finally, here's my rule of thumb when creating scenes (or multiple): 1. If the same exact devices appear in both scenes 2. If the same exact controllers control the same responders Then you should use one scene. As far as applied locally, it basically means the on level which is used when you physically click the load button on that device. With kind regards, Michel Link to comment
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