QueryAll query...

[f11]

The default QueryAll program is set to run at 3AM, which I assume was chosen because its unlikely that any other program will be interfered with at that time of night, and because it guarantees that the end device status' are checked at least once a day during a period where its unlikely the user is manually changing their states.

 

Can that program be changed to re-run the query at 8AM and 6PM as follows:

 

Program Name: QueryAll

If

Time is 3:00:00AM

Or Time is 8:00:00AM

Or Time is 6:00:00PM

Then

Set Scene 'My Lighting' Query

Else

- No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

 

I'm thinking this is a way reading all device's current status more often in case things get out of sync. Or is this even necessary? I chose the times I did because they tend to be after the morning and evening program runs.

 

Rod

[Chris Jahn]

Technically speaking, you shouldn't need this query at all because the status of each device is continously maintained. The 3am query exists just in case some Insteon traffic during the day was lost and thus didn't reach the ISY.

[Guest]

Technically speaking, you shouldn't need this query at all because the status of each device is continously maintained. The 3am query exists just in case some Insteon traffic during the day was lost and thus didn't reach the ISY.

 

But with the weakness of the PLM this would be a good feature. I can turn on and off lights in my house from slave switches no problem but the ISY does not see this since the PLM has poor communication with the mesh.

 

SH fixed the lockups with the extended version of the PLM now they just need to fix the communication problems. I am sure the Homeseer guys would love to see that as well.

[Sub-Routine]

I use several scenes in my Query to select only devices I wish to query. I did this because I have some LampLincs that are not always powered.

 

If
       Time is  3:00:00AM

Then
       Set Scene 'Indoor Lights' Query
       Set Scene 'Outside Lights' Query
       Set Scene 'Basement Lights' Query

Else
  - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')


Schedule migrated from previous version.
Modified for specific devices.

 

Of course you could use one scene dedicated to the query function.

 

Rand

[MikeB]

But with the weakness of the PLM this would be a good feature. I can turn on and off lights in my house from slave switches no problem but the ISY does not see this since the PLM has poor communication with the mesh.

 

Excessive queries of all your lighting, especially on large setups, creates excessive powerline traffic which can cause actual button presses or scheduled events or triggers to not work properly. If you want reliable communications, your goal should be to reduce noise and eliminate excess powerline traffic - not create more.

 

Also, if you have poor powerline communications in your home, I can't see how extra queries are going to help - it'll only make your problems worse. You could have devices whose statuses are accurate, but then you run a query, communications fail, and the ISY no longer knows the correct status.

 

If you're having communication issues, solve it - don't try to mask it with extra queries that are only going to make things worse.

[Guest]

But with the weakness of the PLM this would be a good feature. I can turn on and off lights in my house from slave switches no problem but the ISY does not see this since the PLM has poor communication with the mesh.

 

Excessive queries of all your lighting, especially on large setups, creates excessive powerline traffic which can cause actual button presses or scheduled events or triggers to not work properly. If you want reliable communications, your goal should be to reduce noise and eliminate excess powerline traffic - not create more.

 

Also, if you have poor powerline communications in your home, I can't see how extra queries are going to help - it'll only make your problems worse. You could have devices whose statuses are accurate, but then you run a query, communications fail, and the ISY no longer knows the correct status.

 

If you're having communication issues, solve it - don't try to mask it with extra queries that are only going to make things worse.

 

Mike,

 

As I have told you many times for the past few months I am not having any communications problems at all except for the PLM. Tons of testing etc recommended by forum members and SH Tech support basically proves the mesh is ok. Even SH admitted that I needed to add an accesspoint to the PLM to "help" it a little but probably would not fix the problem entirely.

 

SH needs to fix the PLM as most people understand by now (just like they needed to fix teh lockups and have finally dont that now). If you are thinking its just me with this problem spend a few hours on the Homeseer boards and you will be enlightened (I love that pun when it comes to lighting automation).

 

Denying that problems exist with SH products does not help them get their problems under control. If you want to help SH (and I believe your really do) you have to help them understand what is happening. I actually have spent a lot of time with their tech support and they are listening for a change. They actually have called me a few times as well. Things are improving at SH for a change.

[MikeB]

Digger -

 

I replied to your post because I don't think scheduling My Lighting queries to run constantly throughout the day is a good idea. If you are having communications problems, that will simply multiply it and possibly interfere with normally working functions.

 

If a user is having problems with the ISY recognizing status changes on their devices, they're far better off fixing the issue (reducing noise, relocating AccessPoints, fixing broken links, replacing bad devices, etc.) than trying to mask it unsuccessfully with 2 queries every hour.

 

If the PLM does have a lower signal output / sensitivity than the PLC, I'm 100% behind efforts to try and get that rectified. However, that doesn't mean people need to live with comm issues in the meantime. Many people (most people?) on here that I know of have good communications to and from their PLM, so it can be done.

[Guest]

Digger -

 

I replied to your post because I don't think scheduling My Lighting queries to run constantly throughout the day is a good idea. If you are having communications problems, that will simply multiply it and possibly interfere with normally working functions.

 

If a user is having problems with the ISY recognizing status changes on their devices, they're far better off fixing the issue (reducing noise, relocating AccessPoints, fixing broken links, replacing bad devices, etc.) than trying to mask it unsuccessfully with 2 queries every hour.

 

If the PLM does have a lower signal output / sensitivity than the PLC, I'm 100% behind efforts to try and get that rectified. However, that doesn't mean people need to live with comm issues in the meantime. Many people (most people?) on here that I know of have good communications to and from their PLM, so it can be done.

 

Mike,

 

I DO NOT have communications issues with any device at all period end of story but the PLM. The PLM is not equal to a PLC and that is the problem many people are seeing (and SH is not saying any different). SH needs to fix this is all.

 

SH themselves have been on the phone with me for a couple of hours over the period of about a month (on and off when I had a working PLM) and agree that I am not having communication problems with any devices other than the PLM from everything they had me try and also my results of Powerhome testing and other testing with power off to everything else in the house etc. as they had me try (not saying they are all rocket scientists all of the time).

 

Your excuses to make SH look good all of the time do not help those people (not just me) trying to convince SH to fix their products. Just because you never had a paddle fail does not mean that others didnt and SH needed to know that it was a widespread problem and fix it (and they did). The same goes for the PLM lockups (and they fixed that to with a lot of pressure from teh Homeseer guys) and also now with the communications and they are trying but they need people to tell them what is going on (they say it themselves). If a SH tech support person is not saying there are any problems other than the PLM why do you insist that is must be noise when you have not spent 5 minutes compared to their few hours troubleshooting this with me?

 

As a workaround some of their techs recomend the accesspoint plugged in for now until some better resolution can be worked out in the future (they are redesigning the whole thing apparently). A query every 30 or 60 mins is not much differnt than your query whenever someone presses a specific button in your system and you update your KPL lights. Its ok for you to do it because it was your idea? I have been doing a manual query every 10 minutes or so for the past few hours and not a single lockup or problem with a light not working. The only problems are the comm failures noted by the ISY because of the PLM.

[MikeB]

A query every 30 or 60 mins is not much differnt than your query whenever someone presses a specific button in your system and you update your KPL lights. Its ok for you to do it because it was your idea?

 

I'm not really sure what you're referring to, but my best guess is these threads?

http://forum.universal-devices.com/view ... highlight=

http://forum.universal-devices.com/view ... highlight=

 

There are no queries at all in those programs. For example, with the 'entire floor status LED' program the only extra powerline activity is actually turning the status LED on or off, which happens only when:

 

- All lights are off, and the first light is turned on.

- All lights are off except for one, and that final light is turned off.

 

One of the major features of the ISY, in my opinion, is that it always KNOWS (in a good working Insteon system) what the status of every device is. There really should be no need to query, except for the occasional missed command (caused by simultaneous button presses, etc.), which is why they have their 3am query - just in case.

 

If I depended on even 10 minute queries to know the status of my lights, those programs would be useless to me. That's why it's recommended to fix the source of your comm issues rather than run queries. Now if you think that Smarthome needs to release an improved PLM to fix your particular issues, that's fine - and the topic of another thread. My point is that frequent queries is not a substitute for a good working ISY/Insteon system.

 

I have been doing a manual query every 10 minutes or so for the past few hours and not a single lockup or problem with a light not working. The only problems are the comm failures noted by the ISY because of the PLM.

 

If you have a substantial Insteon system, and run queries every 10 minutes, button presses during those queries may be slow to respond, and commands may be more likely missed. If it's working for you, then run with it - but it's not good advice for the majority of ISY users.

[Guest]

A query every 30 or 60 mins is not much differnt than your query whenever someone presses a specific button in your system and you update your KPL lights. Its ok for you to do it because it was your idea?

 

I'm not really sure what you're referring to, but my best guess is these threads?

http://forum.universal-devices.com/view ... highlight=

http://forum.universal-devices.com/view ... highlight=

 

There are no queries at all in those programs. For example, with the 'entire floor status LED' program the only extra powerline activity is actually turning the status LED on or off, which happens only when:

 

- All lights are off, and the first light is turned on.

- All lights are off except for one, and that final light is turned off.

 

One of the major features of the ISY, in my opinion, is that it always KNOWS (in a good working Insteon system) what the status of every device is. There really should be no need to query, except for the occasional missed command (caused by simultaneous button presses, etc.), which is why they have their 3am query - just in case.

 

If I depended on even 10 minute queries to know the status of my lights, those programs would be useless to me. That's why it's recommended to fix the source of your comm issues rather than run queries. Now if you think that Smarthome needs to release an improved PLM to fix your particular issues, that's fine - and the topic of another thread. My point is that frequent queries is not a substitute for a good working ISY/Insteon system.

 

I have been doing a manual query every 10 minutes or so for the past few hours and not a single lockup or problem with a light not working. The only problems are the comm failures noted by the ISY because of the PLM.

 

If you have a substantial Insteon system, and run queries every 10 minutes, button presses during those queries may be slow to respond, and commands may be more likely missed. If it's working for you, then run with it - but it's not good advice for the majority of ISY users.

 

 

Mike

 

ENOUGH with attempts to start a fight like you always do!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I am trying to fix the source of my communication problems. Its the PLM and as I said even SH has said I dont seem to have any other issues since everything else works but the PLM.

 

You CONSTANTLY have to prove everyone else wrong and SH has to be right 100% of the time and it cant be your precious SH friends products being a problem. The PLM has issues and you are not helping the situation for anyone by making excuses for it. You arent listening to anyone else but yourself. SH STAFF SAY TO COMPLAIN OR IT WONT GET FIXED. Squeky wheel will get the grease. PLEASE STOP CHEERLEADING and lets all nicely work on this with SH and get this fixed. Imagine how many ISY units UDI will sell if the PLM becomes reliable.

 

 

The 10 minute query was a test to see if your theroy held any water (it didnt but it was a good theroy). The system worked fine so why not do a query every 30 or 60 minutes to get better accuracy.

[MikeB]

If you have questions/complaints about the PLM, and want to post on UDI's forums, why don't you consider posting about it to the Everything Insteon group which I believe Steve Lee from Smarthome monitors?

 

I'm not trying to 'start a fight' with you, Digger, I'm simply stating that I think frequent queries are a mistake. I stand by my statement that less powerline activity = a better, more reliable Insteon system.

 

In respect of the original poster, and UDI, this is my last post on this thread.

[f11]

Other issues aside, it sounds like there shouldn't normally be any reason to submit QueryAll actions more often than the 3AM default program. It also sounds like if I decide to run them during the more active part of the day, I may impact the response times of other actions programs are controlling. At the same time, if I do run QueryAll frequently, it doesn't cause other problems except possibly the traffic congestion, or in worst case if a comm does fail, several devices will be in an unknown state. That's what I was curious about.

 

I understand what you guys are discussing, and I can see both perspectives, but since I don't have any comm issues (that I'm aware of) that I'm trying to manage by multiple QueryAll actions, it isn't relevant to my concerns.

 

Thanks for the debate (seriously, I learned a lot from both of you), but let there be peace for now. Thanks!!

 

Rod

[Guest]

If you have questions/complaints about the PLM, and want to post on UDI's forums, why don't you consider posting about it to the Everything Insteon group which I believe Steve Lee from Smarthome monitors?

 

I'm not trying to 'start a fight' with you, Digger, I'm simply stating that I think frequent queries are a mistake. I stand by my statement that less powerline activity = a better, more reliable Insteon system.

 

In respect of the original poster, and UDI, this is my last post on this thread.

 

SH is fully aware of it. You have not been reading my posts just denying everything. I have had tech support working on this on and off for over a month. They agree there is a problem and they are trying to fix it but htey need people to complain so they can get the resources to actually get it done. Until then I will do a query. You dont like it fine. Dont do it.

[Guest]

Got ahold of SH tech support earlier today and they had me try something. I was instructed to have the ISY GUI open and also Houselinc with both the PLM and the PLC plugged into the same outlet (used a small extension cord for the PLC).

 

I was then told to walk around the house and turn switches on and come back and look at the log and the ISY GUI.

 

The Houselinc log showed every switch pressed in the order I pressed it. The ISY GUI did NOT have the correct status for about half of the devices. I called Tech Support back and told them the results and got "ok thanks".

 

I thought I would get a better answer than that.

[upstatemike]

I planned my PLM install in advance of getting my ISY and so far I have not had any communication problems. I installed two accesspoints at the breaker panel so I have coupling and signals repeated on both legs right at the panel. My PLM is about a hundred feet from the breaker panel on a dedicated circuit that only feeds the single outlet that the PLM is plugged into. The Accesspoints repeat everything and ensure that signals from distant devices are nice and strong going into the dedicated PLM circuit so nothing gets missed.

[Guest]

I planned my PLM install in advance of getting my ISY and so far I have not had any communication problems. I installed two accesspoints at the breaker panel so I have coupling and signals repeated on both legs right at the panel. My PLM is about a hundred feet from the breaker panel on a dedicated circuit that only feeds the single outlet that the PLM is plugged into. The Accesspoints repeat everything and ensure that signals from distant devices are nice and strong going into the dedicated PLM circuit so nothing gets missed.

 

I have 4 accesspoints and a hardwired coupler. No comm issues at all between devices. The PLM however has issues. SH asked me to do that specific test for a reason I am sure. They just did not elaborate. Obviusly they must be onto something.

 

Hopefully they will just fix it and that will be that.

 

I love that the KPL buttons stay in sync 100%. I find it wierd that they work fine and have to go through the ISY yet the ISY is not in synch (unless the ISY is just linking them but Idont hink so) SH wont talk to much about the ISY itself for whatever reason.

 

I hope this is all resolved before our next big party. Guests shake their head at the lights when they dont work right and I rely on the ISY for a lot of automation. The PLM kills that. I might put the ISY aside and go back to houselinc and the PLC controlled by the ELK which worked just fine except the ELK cant keep the status up to date.