jtara92101 Posted February 12, 2012 Posted February 12, 2012 I once knew the answer to this question, but I'm afraid it's been quite a while since I last had to do this, and I wasn't able to find the answer here or in the documentation. I have a keypad in my living room where the A, B, and C buttons are assiged as follows: A: Theatre B. Snack C. Mood The A, B, C buttons are mutually-exclusive. I've made them mutually-exclusive as recommended by making the "other" buttons responders to each scene. (e.g. B and C are responders to A.) I know there is some Insteon issue where the B and C buttons won't appear in the attributes for the scene itself - only for the A button. You have to set the levels for B and C to 0 on the list of responders for the A button. etc. This all works fine - when I use the buttons. But I also want to activate scenes from my Roomie Remote on my iPad. This activates a scene on the isy99. e.g. it's the same as me going in on the console and activating the scene. When I do this, the LED status lights do not update properly. The scenes activate correctly, (lamps) but the LED status lights don't. How do I make the LED lights update when I activate the scene from the ISY? Do I need a program?
LeeG Posted February 12, 2012 Posted February 12, 2012 A Scene On cannot turn Off Secondary KeypadLinc buttons. The Secondary buttons to turn Off must be Responders to a Scene and issue a Scene Off.
jtara92101 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Posted February 12, 2012 (Sorry, I should have posted this in questions and answers. Moderator: please feel free to move.) A Scene On cannot turn Off Secondary KeypadLinc buttons. The Secondary buttons to turn Off must be Responders to a Scene and issue a Scene Off. ??? When I press one of A, B, and C to turn ON the corresponding scene, it DOES turn OFF the other two LEDs. This is because I have set the levels to 0 in the links from the button. The other LEDs only appear in the links for the button, though, NOT in the scene itself. So, for A, you do not see B and C in the scene itself. However, when you go down to button A, you will see B and see as responders, and set the levels to 0 there. However, if I turn ON the SAME scene from the isy- either manually from the console or from a program - (not from the button itself), the the other LEDs do NOT turn off. I need to know how to turn the other LEDs off when I set the scene on from the ISY, not from the button. It's a similar situation to a 3-day circuit, right? A 3-way circuit works as you would expect when you use the buttons, but it gets complicated if you want to turn the scene on or off from a program.
LeeG Posted February 12, 2012 Posted February 12, 2012 The other button LEDs turn Off because of the Mutually Exclusive definition you indicated has been established. Mutually exclusive definition works only where the button is physically pressed. A Scene On cannot turn a Secondary button LED Off. The KeypadLinc firmware does not support that (except maybe the very latest Dual Band KeypadLinc which the IYS does not have support for yet). Add buttons B and C as responders to Scene. Trigger a Program with a button A On press and Set Scene xxxx Off for the Scene with buttons B & C as responders.
jtara92101 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Posted February 12, 2012 OK, what I wound up doing was creating 3 new scenes: LR A LED Mutuals, LR B LED Mutuals, LR C LED Mutuals. I made the LEDs that have to be turned off when a given scene is turned on responders in the corresponding scene. So, LR A LED Mutuals has the B and C switches as responders, etc. In Roomie Remote, I turn the Theater scene (corresponding to the A button) on, and the LR A LED Mutuals scene off. (I could just as well have created a program to do this, and have Roomie run the program.) The three LEDs come on briefly, then the two unwanted ones go out. BTW, I am not setting mutual exclusion using "Buttons Grouping" because when you press that button, the ISY pops up a dire warning that it's a bad idea, and that you should accomplish button groups through scenes by adjusting respective on levels. But when you do that, you can't set the on level of the LED in the scene itself - only in the attributes for the buttons. That is, for the LR Theater scene, buttons B and C do NOT appear in the scene. But if you look at the LR A Theater button under the LR Theater scene, you see all of the responders to the scene (which you would typically "copy scene attributes from LR Theater") and AS WELL you will see the B and C LEDs as responders. If you set the levels to 0, then they will be off when the A button is on. But it only works when you push the button. It's terribly confusing, but from what I gather, not UDI's fault. At least I have a work-around.
LeeG Posted February 12, 2012 Posted February 12, 2012 It is confusing for sure. What is not obvious looking at the externals is the fact that when button A Controller is selected and button B & C sliders are moved to 0%, the Scene Responder On Level for those buttons is NOT being set. That is, the first of three bytes of data (On Level) in a Responder link record is NOT being changed. Internal KeypadLinc configuration information (much like Button Grouping) is being altered. Also why it only works for a physical button press on the KeypadLinc itself. The ISY tries to mask much of the complexities of Insteon which it is doing in the case. If you want to see the difference run the Event Viewer and watch what memory is changed when the button B & C sliders are moved to 0%. You will see that the link database memory is not even addressed let alone changed. When the ISY Scene is turned On using the Admin Console or Set Scene xxxx On, conventional link records between the Controller (ISY PLM) and the Responder device (KeypadLinc) are used. It is this area where KeypadLinc firmware has not supported turning a Secondary KeypadLinc button Off with a Scene On. All KeypadLincs starting from 2005/2006 have this limitation (see next). However, SmartLabs has changed the KeypadLinc firmware on the latest devices. The v.40 firmware in the latest Dual Band KeypadLinc Relay now supports turning a Secondary button Off with a Scene On command. It is possible the latest firmware in the KeypadLinc Dimmer has the same change but I have not yet confirmed that. The ISY will have to pick up support for this feature before the ISY UI can define this.
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