LeeG

john410 Suggest using Event Viewer at LEVEL 3 as each new device is added. That way there will be trace data should a symptom arise.

"Lacking a good ISY backup, what is the appropriate procedure to re-establish the device links? Is this a situation where I need to factory reset all Insteon devices and delete the modem on the ISY and start linking everything all over? Once the devices have been re-linked and renamed, re-import the programs from the current configuration?" Never Delete the PLM. That creates this problem. Once the links are lost, normally a File | Restore Devices will restore them. If this does not restore the links because they were deleted from ISY, then restoring an ISY Backup taken before links were deleted from ISY followed by another File | Restore Devices should resolve the links. If no ISY Backup was created before replacing PLM (and File | Restore Devices does not resolve) then deleting each device, factory reset device, adding device back to ISY is required. Again, NEVER Delete Modem (PLM). This action deletes the links from the ISY.

Is PLM a 2412 or 2413? What does Tools | Diagnostics | PLM Info/Status show? Likely need to run Tools | Diagnostics | Event Viewer at LEVEL 3. Attempt to add device. Post Event Trace.

john410 "After re-reading the section in the ISY manual about scenes and cross-linking, I think it makes sense to setup a virtual 3-way switch using a scene. I have no idea what group number gets assigned or how that all works, but I'll just follow the instructions and hope for the best." If using SwitchLinc, ToggleLinc, KPL load control button, Group 1 is being used. You would not use that number if doing manual links. The ISY takes care of all of that. SceneCrossLink SwitchLinc1 Controller SwitchLinc2 Controller " I guess if I setup a program to turn that light on, the program will have an action that says "turn on Scene xxx". Likewise for off." Exactly right. If some time Then Set Scene 'SceneCrossLink' On Else If some time Then Set Scene 'SceneCrossLink' Off Else

john410 "Shouldn't I link these directly?" No. When using an ISY nothing should be linked manually. That activity makes ISY functions such as Restore Device, Restore Devices and others impossible to use since that would destroy the manual links. It is also easier to create the Group/Scene with the ISY Admin Console. No access or button pressing of the two devices. "If the secondary switch turned the primary on or off, why would I need a scene or even have the ISY know about the secondary switch." A Group/Scene must be created, whether done manually by pressing device buttons or through the ISY. DeviceA must use a Group/Scene to control deviceB and the reverse. Actually 2 Groups/Scenes are needed so DeviceA and DeviceB stay in sync. Manually create 2 Groups/Scenes or define the relationship once with ISY. The non load device must use a Group/Scene to turn On/Off the load switch. "I'm really not getting the group/scene thing. My needs are simple - turn a specific switch or lamp module on at time X and off at time Y, with the option to manually override (physically flip the switch)." This simple activity does not require a Group/Scene. Certainly can be done with Direct commands from a Program. Not likely you will turn On/Off the lamp module manually because the outlet is low near the floor. It really is easier to create Groups/Scenes with the ISY Admin Console than have to manually create them. Plus creating them manually prevents using other ISY functions in the future. However, it is your installation. Do as you are want. Once told of the down side it is your choice to accept the issues.

john410 For simple device turn On/Off/% On level, with Direct commands using a Program is fine. As was noted there is a slight delay of a second or so to trigger a Program and have it issue Direct commands. Groups/Scenes are a normal part on Insteon. A device when operated locally notifies the ISY of the local activity with a Group/Scene. Normal Insteon usage. Turning a KPL Secondary button On/Off with an ISY Program requires a Group/Scene. Normal Insteon usage. DeviceA turning DeviceB On/Off/% On Level requires a Group/Scene. Devices (not counting PLM) have no knowledge of Direct commands for controlling another device. Just a few examples where a Group/Scene is used.

In the protocol, what is point of the Max Hops field? Seems the originator of a message could just set the initial value of the Hops Left field to something less than 3 if it wanted to limit the number of hops a message makes. Max Hops affects speed. A Max Hops of 1 must be ACKed more quickly than a Max Hops of 3. Takes time for an Insteon message to be repeated multiple times with Max Hops = 3. What is the point of groups? If each device is to respond with an ACK message using a "group cleanup direct message", it seems the total time to transmit a direct message to each device and get acknowledgement would be the same. Ignoring what a PLM can do, all other devices use Groups/Scenes to control another device. I'm still confused about linking and groups. For example, how does a switch (controller) tell another switch (the responder) that it wants to link as a certain group number? Can I link as a point to point (from a specific address to a specific address)? If so, how do I do that with 1 button on each device? Other than a PLM all devices that talk to each other do so with Groups/Scenes. In ISY the link(s) are created when an ISY Scene is defined and devices added to the ISY Scene as Controller or Responder. What is a "scene" and how is it different than a group? Scene and Group are the same thing. When referencing device hardware pubs the term Group is used. When referencing external pubs Scene is used. Again, the same thing is being discussed. When using the PLM and ISY994i, should I press the link button on the PLM when linking to devices? Never. Devices are linked when adding to an ISY Scene Specific question about the 994i: What is the best way to "wipe the slate clean" as far as starting over with Insteon? I want to keep my programs and assigned X10 devices but want to start from scratch with the Insteon. I have three Insteon responders (2 lamp linc and 1 on/off module) that I have tried to get working with two different PLMs. I'm thinking these devices are screwed up now and I just want to make them behave like they did out of the box. Delete the device from ISY and Factory Reset device. Then add device to ISY. Without good coupling Insteon devices will have problems communicating with PLM and each other. Likely these will raise addition questions. Feel free to post back.

chachdog "so if the battery is low you have to put it in linking mode to see that? I see a motion sensor batt low in the isy but not sure when or if it does anything. " You indicated that the Motion Sensor was in On Only mode so Off commands were not expected. The suggestion was to Query the Motion Sensor to see what Options were actually in use. Because the Motion Sensor is a battery powered device it sleeps to save battery life. The Motion Sensor is put into manual linking mode to keep Motion Sensor awake so a Query can be done. When the Query is done I suspect the On Only Option will not be set because Off commands are being sent. After any changes to Options are made be sure to take Motion Sensor out of linking mode.

jb642 The v.43 Leak Sensor firmware has been around for more than a year. As you indicate once Wet it stays Wet until physically Dry and the Set button is tapped. Not sure why they changed the design, maybe a short Wet condition was being missed. EDIT: added Event Trace of v43 Leak Sensor showing series of Wet messages followed by Dry messages when Set button tapped to reset Wet state V43LeakSensorWetDry.txt

I have seen a Motion Sensor do unexpected things when the battery is low. You can put the Motion Sensor into manual linking mode and do a Query to get the current configuration. Be sure to take Motion Sensor out of linking mode when finished..

The trace in post 4 shows a Motion Sensor On command received followed by a Scene On for Scene 0x11 from Program. Note that the ISY does not receive any information from the Scene Responders. Based on the Scene definition the ISY marks each Scene Responder to the state the Scene is expected to accomplish. If the Scene is intermittent then there is likely a comm issue. Could be interference or a problem with the devices used to couple the 2 120v legs. Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:40 AM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 36.93.D7 00.00.01 CB 11 01 LTONRR (01) - Motion Sensor On Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:40 AM : [std-Group ] 36.93.D7-->Group=1, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:40 AM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [36 93 D7 1] [DON] [1] uom=0 prec=-1 Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:40 AM : [ 36 93 D7 1] DON 1 Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:40 AM : [D2D-CMP 0021] CTL [36 93 D7 1] DON op=1 Event(val=1 uom=0 prec=-1) is Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [iNST-TX-I1 ] 02 62 00 00 11 CF 11 00 - Scene On Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [36 93 D7 1] [sT] [255] uom=0 prec=-1 Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [ 36 93 D7 1] ST 255 Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 36.93.D7 00.00.01 C7 11 01 LTONRR (01) Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [std-Group ] 36.93.D7-->Group=1, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=1 Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [iNST-DUP ] Previous message ignored. Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 00.00.11 CF 11 00 06 LTONRR (00) Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [3B A5 38 1] [sT] [109] uom=0 prec=-1 Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [ 3B A5 38 1] ST 109 Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [38 92 B6 1] [sT] [153] uom=0 prec=-1 Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [ 38 92 B6 1] ST 153 Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [32 97 60 1] [sT] [102] uom=0 prec=-1 Fri 12/25/2015 10:23:41 AM : [ 32 97 60 1] ST 102

The second trace in post 5 is an Off command from Motion Sensor. Not usual to turn turn On a Scene due to Motion Sensor Off Fri 12/25/2015 11:30:00 AM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 36.93.D7 00.00.01 CB 13 01 LTOFFRR(01) I'm looking at the trace in post 4.

kohai The Wait and Repeat statements have the same characteristics. For some functions it makes more sense. If Control 'motionsensor-sensor' is switched On Then Set 'something' On Wait 5 minutes Set 'something' Off Else As long as the motion sensor senses motion the Wait is refreshed with a full 5 minutes. Only when no motion is sensed for 5 minutes does 'something' turn Off.

danbutter Between the two examples it sounds like the Variable is changing value when motion stops. If the problem is not clear post the Program setting the Variable. In the first example the Wait is terminated when Variable $Laundry_Light no longer equals 1. The Wait terminating is normal Wait operation when the Program If Condition causes the Program to Trigger while in the Wait. This leaves the Laundry Light On as there is nothing in Else clause. In the second example the Wait has no statements after the Wait so it has no affect (does not actually Wait). When the Variable changes state after motion stops the Program is Triggered, the If is now False so the Else executes.

Go to this link for how to Replace PLM. Power sequencing is most important. http://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=ISY-99i/ISY-26_INSTEON:File_Menu#Replace_Modem_.28PLM.29 Was a File | Delete Modem (PLM) issued (should not have been).

Fast On/Off commands use a predetermined On Level and fast Ramp Rate. Conventional On uses either Local values or Scene Responder link record values depending on whether a Direct command or Scene command.is used. Do a Tools | Diagnostics | Show PLM Links Table and post result. Do a Show Device Links Table for device being used and post result. Have Tools | Diagnostics | Event Viewer at LEVEL 3 when issuing On command and post trace. Do not run Event Trace during Show activity.

Yes, use the the Red wire.

What is the logic of the Wait 999 hours?

Based on the Last Run and Last Finish times the Outdoor Program was also Idle if the Summary page was captured at the right time.

What ISY Firmware What ISY UI What OS Are there devices in the wrong state, if so which device(s) and state The Indoor Program Last Finish Time is before the Last Run Time suggesting the Program is active and Icon state may be inaccurate but need to know state of devices being controlled to verify. Also need to see Folder.

OP has a programming style that does not match ISY capabilities. May also have comm issues. Not likely either is going to change which leaves the OP dissatisfied with the environment. Hard to see how this is going to change despite all the good information presented about how to program the ISY.

jerlands Examples that terminate a Wait or Repeat If Control 'kplbuttonx' is switched On Or Control 'switchlinca' is switched On Or Status 'kplbuttony' is On Or $Svar1 is 2 Then ....... Wait 5 minutes ....... Else Any of these conditions occur terminate the Wait 5 minutes kplbuttonx is turned On switchlinca is turned On kplbuttony state is changed State variable SVar1 value is changed

Amigo The second example never Triggers. That is the difference between Integer and State variables. Integer variables cannot Trigger a Program. If 'integer var 1' is 4 Then do something Wait 5 minutes do something Else In the next example once the State variable Triggers the Program the value of the Integer variable affects the ultimate If condition True/False evaluation but the Integer variable can never cause the Program to Trigger. If 'state var 1' is 4 And 'integer var 1' is 2 Then do something Wait 5 minutes do something Else

Amigo "if you have a "Wait" in the body of path, then it also forces the IF statement to be evaluated (continuously?)" That is not accurate. A Wait allows the If to evaluate, it does not cause a reevaluation. Program If processing is event driven. The Program can be in a Wait and the If clause not run. Something in the If conditions must want to trigger the Program and be in a Wait. The 'state var 1' changing to 4 triggers Program and executes the Then clause with the Wait. While in the Wait the If does not execute again because 'state var 1' has not changed. While in the Wait should 'state var 1' value change the If is evaluated once. If 'state var 1' is 4 Then do something Wait 5 minutes do something Else

Happy to help. Thanks for the feedback. I don't use the automatic update but suspect the UI may not be automatic because there are various ways to invoke the Admin Console.