Micro On/Off Module with Motion Light

[boser]

I am trying to create an "Insteon compatible motion light" out of

1) an Insteon On/Off 2442-222 module and

2) a RAB STL360 motion light

 

The motion sensor output goes to 110V when motion is detected and back to 0V after a delay of a few seconds (its settable in the motion sensor, I've set it to the minimum). I've connected the sensor output to the On/Off module "sense wire" (the yellow one; the purple one is not connected to anything). The light is connected to the line output of the On/Off module.

 

I would like motion to turn on the light, and the ISY to turn off the light after a delay that depends on the time of day.

 

Questions:

 

1) How do I configure "options" in the ISY dialog for the On/Off module? After much trying I've checked "Program Lock" (not sure what it does) and "Dual Line: (Off) Single Line". All other boxes are unchecked.

Does anyone have experience with this and can confirm this to be the right setting?

 

2) What do I put in the If statement of an ISY program for the Then pass to run when motion is detected?

Since I'm looking for an event, I tried "Control ... is switched on", but got this working only with "Status ... is on". The Then body has a wait for a few minutes and then sets the light off.

Again, is this the way to do this?

 

Bernhard

[SteveL]

Boser,

 

Would you have time to discuss your question in a phone call? Please send an email to support@universal-devices.com with a number I can contact you at.

 

Here are a few points though: typically you will trigger the timer program for the light to turn off by status if a timed event changes the status or sensor input and control if you manually turn it

 

If you want the motion to trigger the light off if no motion for let's say 10 min but reset the counter to 10 min as long as there is motion seen any time within the time range then create two programs.

 

One program is just the timer in the then statement. Call it light timer. Then: wait 10 min, then turn off light

 

Next program uses the sensor status to trigger the If statement and the Then: runs the program "light timer" Then statement.

[larryllix]

I am trying to create an "Insteon compatible motion light" out of

1) an Insteon On/Off 2442-222 module and

2) a RAB STL360 motion light

 

The motion sensor output goes to 110V when motion is detected and back to 0V after a delay of a few seconds (its settable in the motion sensor, I've set it to the minimum). I've connected the sensor output to the On/Off module "sense wire" (the yellow one; the purple one is not connected to anything). The light is connected to the line output of the On/Off module.

 

I would like motion to turn on the light, and the ISY to turn off the light after a delay that depends on the time of day.

 

Questions:

 

1) How do I configure "options" in the ISY dialog for the On/Off module? After much trying I've checked "Program Lock" (not sure what it does) and "Dual Line: (Off) Single Line". All other boxes are unchecked.

Does anyone have experience with this and can confirm this to be the right setting?

 

2) What do I put in the If statement of an ISY program for the Then pass to run when motion is detected?

Since I'm looking for an event, I tried "Control ... is switched on", but got this working only with "Status ... is on". The Then body has a wait for a few minutes and then sets the light off.

Again, is this the way to do this?

 

Bernhard

This may give you some help with this. Read down to Xathros posts He has a good grip on this stuff.

 

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=13564

 

Do a search. You will many discussions on this basic motion to light control usage.

[macbannai]

Hello,

 

First thing, The incomplete link for Xathros post is for an insteon motion sensor not a 3rd party motion sensor.

 

Now, it sounds like a conversation took place and hopefully boser's question that started the post was answered, however, I'm looking for similar solution.  I have the 'yellow' sense wire connected to a Heath Zenith motion sensor output and then the load on the micro module to the lights.  I can turn on/off the lights with the ISY by toggling the micro module and I have the "momentary: (Off) Latching" checked in the micro module options.  Only thing is, when motion is sensed the micro module doesn't turn on and I'm not sure where to go from here, I'm not clear if the wiring is wrong or if I need to set a program to detect the sense on the micro module from the motion sensor output. 

 

I did look at what options I had available in programs, but I can't seem to figure out what setting to look for that detects the micro module's sense wire has been activated for me to take action with a program.

[LeeG]

The Heath Zenith motion sensor does not output a voltage that will trigger micro module. The motion sensor has dual bright feature that affects the sensor signal. This has been discussed on the Smarthome forum in the past. It was suggested that a relay be driven by the sensor (if my memory is correct) but I don't think an actual working solution was posted.

[stusviews]

There is no solution for the Heath/Zenith dual-brite motion sensor. Heath/Zenith relay motion sensors are OK.

[macbannai]

That is certainly a bummer for me, so if I had this version in the link below, would the sense wire turn on the micro module, thus turn on the lights?

 

http://www.lowes.com/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10051&catalogId=10051&langId=-1&langId=-1&productId=50236471&storeId=10151&storeId=10151

[stusviews]

That seems as though it will work, but I wonder why they specify the the bulb must be dimmable.

[Brian H]

Specifications are not too clear.

Could be the output is controlled by a triac or AC SSR. Even if it is just full On and Off and not a  relay

[macbannai]

Alright, I have switched out the motion light, this one does not have the dual brite functionality.  I re-checked the wiring, the line is connected to both the motion sensor and the micro module.  The load from the motion sensor is connected to the yellow sense wire on the micro module, the load from the micro module is connected to each of the lights and still when motion is sensed the micro module won't turn on, I can however turn the light on/off from the ISY.

 

Am I missing anything?

[stusviews]

Which motion sensor (be specific)? Does the motion sensor control the load correctly when the Micro Module is not used? With the Micro Module wired to the load and the motion sensor not connected, does touching the yellow wire to the line terminal control the load?

[LeeG]

The PAR38 Halogen bulbs are dim-able and the LED bulbs (if used) must be dim-able. That indicates to me the motion sensor output is still electronic rather than relay driven. I suspect if a scope is used the motion sensor output is not pure 120v.

 

The Flood Light display usually has the less expensive relay driven models. The relay can be heard as the motion is detected.

[DavidJ101]

The only motion sensor that I've found that is truly a relay model is the Cooper MS-180. I have 4 of them hooked to Micro-Relays and they all work reliably. I have several different brands of MS's lying around that I've tried and the MS-180 is the only one that I can honestly say works all the time.

[stusviews]

I've had success using Leviton, Lutron and RAD motion sensors as Micro Module triggers. Even a Heath/Zenith sensor that was not dual-brite.

[DavidJ101]

I'm sure that there are plenty of other sensors out there that will trigger the sense line of the Micro-Module, but the MS-180 is the only one I've had dealings with. I should have made that more clear in my earlier post.

[macbannai]

OK Stu, I just performed the test requested.  

 

What was originally connected to the motion sensor load was the 'yellow' wire, I removed the 'yellow' sense wire and touched it to the line and it did activate the micro module and turn on the flood lights.  So the micro module is doing it's part.

 

You asked about the specific MS, this is the standard Heath Zenith MS that comes in the box with the mounted floodlight sockets, it shows model number SH-5412, also after speaking with the Heath Zenith support line and they said that the motion sensor doesn't work with relays and only halogen lights.  Also speaking with Insteon they suggested that the motion sensor may be giving less than 120v which would cause the result of the micro module not to activate --- which could be a helpful proof from your test suggestion.

 

It sounds like I can still keep the same light mount, but just order a motion sensor that supports the micro module relay, like the cooper or RAD.  Is that everyone's best suggestion?

[stusviews]

The Heath/Zenith SH-5412 has bulb saver technology which takes 2 seconds to fully illuminate the bulb. While that may be OK for the bulb, it's not OK for the Micro Module sense circuitry which requies full voltage at the start.