Another KeypadLinc issue

[warrenpettit]

I have an eight key KeypadLinc which has some buttons that work (they way that I want) and some that do not. 

 

I have an ApplianceLinc that controls a lamp in my den.  I have a ToggleLinc that controls some lights in my kitchen.  I have an Insteon bulb in a bedroom and a LampLinc that controls a lamp in my living room. 

 

For each of these four devices, I have created a scene and each scene has a KeypadLinc button assigned as a controller. Besides being able to turn these lights on using the Keypad, each has an isy944i program that turns the scenes on and off.

 

When the scene for the den and the bedroom get turned on, the appropriate Keypad buttons light up.  But this does not happen for the living room and kitchen scenes.  Although the lights turn on in the kitchen and living room and although the admin console shows that the appropriate keypad buttons are on, the buttons, in fact, are not on.

 

Through the admin console, I turned off the living room scene and turned it back on. The living room light turned on and the appropriate keypad button lit up. My ToggleLinc in the kitchen, on the other hand, seems possessed. Using the admin console, turning the kitchen scene off, turned off the lights. Turning the scene back on, turned on neither the kitchen lights nor the keypad. (The admin console seemed to have a different idea as to what constitutes success.)  Pushing the keypad button for the kitchen did turn on the kitchen lights and the keypad light. 

 

I know that this last paragraph introduced an additional problem, which was not my intent, but I wanted to describe all of the screwy things that were happening. My main concern is that the keypad buttons respond properly for some scenes and not for others.

[stusviews]

Did you define the ToggleLinc to be a controller?

[warrenpettit]

Yes the ToggleLinc is defined as a controller to the Kitchen scene.

[stusviews]

There are four ways to toggle the scene:

 

1. ToggleLinc

2. KPL button

3. HTML interface

4. Administrative Console

 

Which methods function correctly for an errant device? (Lets concentrate on one specific device.)

Which do not?

[warrenpettit]

Sadly, I do not seem to find any sort of consistency.  This morning I did the testing with the ToggleLinc.

 

1) Pressed the keypad button to turn on my kitchen scene.  Light on the keypad turned on, the lights in the kitchen came on.  Pressed the keypad button again and all went off.

2) Flipped the toggle switch on and the lights in the kitchen came on and the light on the keypad came on. Flipped the toggle switch off and all turned off.

3) Via the admin console, I turned the kitchen scene on.  The lights in the kitchen came on and the light on the keypad came on.  Turned the scene off and all lights turned off.

4) (I am assuming that when you say HTML interface, you mean an isy944 program.)  Created a test program to turn the kitchen scene on at a specific time and then to turn it off.  That worked as well. (Why not?)   So what was failing last night worked fine this morning.

 

Now to make things a bit more interesting.  Last night, after the two keypad lights for the kitchen and living room did not turn on, I pressed those buttons to turn them on.  So now I had four keypad button on. (the den and the bedroom had come on like they were suppose to.)  When it came time for each of the four scenes to be turned off via their programs, three of the keypad buttons did turn off. And that included the two wayward kitchen and living room buttons. But the den button, which turned on as it was suppose to, did not turn off when the scene was set to off. (The den light did go out but the keypad button was still lit.) 

 

I just don't know what to do when things appear to work and not work randomly, except possibly just live with it. The fact that the appropriate lights turn on and off is more important than whether the keypad buttons are in sync.  Maybe I need to get in touch with an exorcist and have that person work on my possessed KeypadLinc. 

[LeeG]

Comm problems are often intermittent.   Verify the devices that are coupling the 120v legs are working.  Just had a case in the last few days where Access Points were moved and were no longer doing their job.

 

Next is see what appliances were active when comm was poor.

[warrenpettit]

The den, kitchen, living room and front bedroom are all on the same leg.  The master bedroom is on a separate leg. The keypad is in the master bedroom. I do have an access point in my hall way and one in the master bedroom. Normally, communication between the access points seems to be ok because I have a motion sensor in the master vanity that ultimately controls a night light in the vanity and in the master bedroom. I say ultimately because the lights are not directly linked to the MS but rather the MS sends notification to the isy944 that is in the den and then it sends signals to the night lights in the vanity and bedroom. This all works consistently. 

 

The TV, DirectTV box and amplifier might have been on when the scenes were to have been turned on and when the keypad buttons did not light up. The TV, sat box, and amplifier were on when the kitchen and living room scenes were turned off and when the keypad button were turned off.  The TV, etc were not on when the den scene was turned off and when the keypad button for the den failed to turn off.

 

Let me describe my den.  I have my TV, sat box, amplifier, and router plugged into a UPS. My isy944 and the PCM are located there as well. The UPS and the PCM are plugged into the same wall plug.  However, the UPS is plugged into a FilterLinc.  The FilterLinc and the PCM then share the same wall plug. I know that the UPS will suck up the comm signal hence the reason that I have the FilterLinc.  I guess that I could move the isy944 some place else but I wanted it to be plugged into a UPS for when we loose power.  But that may not be a requirement.

[stusviews]

1. The HTML interface is not a program. This is what the HTML interface looks like. See p 9 of the User's Manual, Figure 6.

 

2. How did you determine that, "the den, kitchen, living room and front bedroom are all on the same leg.  The master bedroom is on a separate leg," of the split, single-phase electric supply?

 

3. The MS is linked directly to the night light. That happens as soon as you use the ISY to create a scene. Once the scene is created, the ISY can be removed. Programs, however, do require the ISY.

 

4. If you lose power, then having the ISY on a UPS won't help because no other Insteon devices will have power.

[warrenpettit]

I have moved my ISY so that the PCM is not plugged into the same wall socket as a UPS even though the UPS was connected through a FilterLinc.  So I will have to wait until tonight to see if the same gremlins exist.  But to answer your questions:

 

1. The HTML interface is not a program. This is what the HTML interface looks like. See p 9 of the User's Manual, Figure 6.

 

OK, I did try kitchen scene using the HTML interface after having moved the ISY and it worked.  But as I said, tonight might tell a different story.

 

2. How did you determine that, "the den, kitchen, living room and front bedroom are all on the same leg.  The master bedroom is on a separate leg," of the split, single-phase electric supply?

 

My wife was fed up with losing power for several hours.  Seemed to happen when I was out of town.  I told her that I had power so at least half of us was happy.  She told me that it was the wrong half.  So two years ago we installed a backup generator which runs off of natural gas. All of the circuits that were to be handled by the generator had to be wired to a new panel box. At that time, none of my Insteon devices were dual mode.  I wanted to control the lights in the den, front bedroom, living room and kitchen.  So I made sure that those circuits were on the same leg. I was not using an ISY at that time. Since I bought the ISY, I also installed a second access point to bridge the legs and have added a few dual mode devices as well.

 

3. The MS is linked directly to the night light. That happens as soon as you use the ISY to create a scene. Once the scene is created, the ISY can be removed. Programs, however, do require the ISY.

 

OK

 

4. If you lose power, then having the ISY on a UPS won't help because no other Insteon devices will have power.

 

As I indicated in item 2, we have a backup generator. It has an automatic transfer switch so that if we loose power for more than ten seconds, the generator kicks in. Just thought that it would be less confusing if the ISY was plugged into a UPS. 

[fitzpatri8]

Satellite TV receivers and some TVs have come up several times here and in the Smarthome forum as sources of significant power line signal interference. The next time you have trouble, try unplugging them and immediately re-testing from the same controller that just failed. If signals succeed reliably with them unplugged, then start failing to respond once you plug them back in, it may be worthwhile to isolate them from the rest of your power line network with another FilterLinc.

[warrenpettit]

The Satellite box, TV and amp, to which I was referring, are all plugged into the same UPS / surge protector and that UPS is plugged into a FilterLinc.  So, to my understanding, they should be isolated. But I am basically clueless about all of this, so my assumption might very well be off base.

[warrenpettit]

Well, as I stated earlier, I have moved my ISY so that it is on a different circuit from where it was.  My four "programs" ran this evening and all four scenes not only turned on the appropriate lights but also lit up the appropriate button on the KeypadLinc. So I don't know yet if this is a one time occurrence or whether things are now running correctly.

[stusviews]

Achieving success by moving the ISY to a different circuit suggests communication problems, either something(s) interfering with the Insteon signal or inadequate coupling of the opposite legs of the split, single-phase electric supply.