How to program stairwell lights

[rominejc]

I'm new to the forum and new to ISY programming.  I could use some suggestions on getting started with my home automation project using my ISY994i and Insteon/X10 devices.

 

I've started with what I considered a simple task.  I want to automatically turn on the lights in my basement stairwell when going up or down the stairs, and then have them turn off when no one's using the stairs.

 

I put an Insteon Open/Close sensor on the door at the top of the stairs and an Insteon wireless motion sensor at the bottom of the stairs (no door there).  I've been able to program the "lights on" functionality such that opening the door at the top or starting up the stairs at the bottom will turn on the lights.   But it is harder to figure out how to turn them off, and I could use some programming logic suggestions.

 

One other point is that I'm using an old X10 controller on the lights.  It was installed long ago.  The ISY program allows for turning X10 on and off, but I've noticed that the lag time between sensor activation and the lights coming on is very long.  In fact, if the lights have not been on and, for instance, I open the stairway door, I could be half way down the stairs before the lights come on.  Interestingly, if I turn the lights off and then reactivate the sensor right away, there's no lag time.  It's as if the ISY unit temporarily found the X10 controller.  Any thoughts on this circumstance?   I'm likely to replace the X10 controller with Insteon switches, but I'm wondering if that will solve the lag time problem.

 

Thanks for any suggestions and help.

 

[LeeG]

When the X10 device is replaced with a Insteon device the Open Close Sensor and Motion Sensor can turn light(s) On directly with a Scene without any delay going through a Program.   Program logic can be used to turn Off the light(s) where any delay is not an issue.  A Dual Band Insteon device should be used to control the light(s).

 

It is unusual for a delay to exist in Program execution of more than 1 to 1.5 seconds.  The Motion Sensor can be slow to react based on Options chosen but would not expect a long delay from Open Close Sensor unless poor RF reception requires multiple attempts by Open Close Sensor to get a response from a Dual Band device.  Suggest running Tools | Diagnostics | Event Viewer at LEVEL 3 to trace Insteon/X10 activity.  Post the event trace for analysis. 

[Brian H]

If the X10 controller is still being used.

It is also possible it is also sending an X10 power line command and stepping on the X10 command from the ISY controller.

[oberkc]

I am also curious as to what you mean by an "x-10 controller".  Is this nothing more than an x-10 switch that powers the lights?

 

The program side of this should be pretty simple.  It sounds as if you want something like:

 

if

control door sensor is turned on

or

control motion sensor is turned on

then

send x-10 command ON

wait a little bit

send x-10 command OFF

else

do nothing

 

I am unaware of any condition where the ISY can find or lose a controller.  It simply sends out X-10 commands. 

[rominejc]

Thanks folks.

 

Yes, I meant an X-10 switch. It's not "lost" to the ISY, just slow to respond.  So, I'll upgrade the lighting switches to Insteon.

 

On the matter of the program, the solution suggested by Oberkc is exactly the program I'm using.  The problem is that if the door is left open at the top of the stairs, then the program cycles between on --> delay --> off --> and back on again etc.  Obviously,this is because the open/close sensor remains open (and therefore on). I'm trying to think of a cleave way to trigger the on/off cycle once and then, if the door is left open, stop the program. 

 

Any thoughts will be appreciated

[stusviews]

A program using "Control" should not do that unless the command is resent. Post your program (right click on the program, select Copy to Clipboard and paste here).

[larryllix]

Thanks folks.

 

Yes, I meant an X-10 switch. It's not "lost" to the ISY, just slow to respond.  So, I'll upgrade the lighting switches to Insteon.

 

On the matter of the program, the solution suggested by Oberkc is exactly the program I'm using.  The problem is that if the door is left open at the top of the stairs, then the program cycles between on --> delay --> off --> and back on again etc.  Obviously,this is because the open/close sensor remains open (and therefore on). I'm trying to think of a cleave way to trigger the on/off cycle once and then, if the door is left open, stop the program. 

 

Any thoughts will be appreciated

X10 becomes way too slow for a stairwell just for the reason you stated. The PLM seems to have problem coordinating Insteon and X10 signals so they don't interfere with each other.

 

I have Insteon MS and SwitchLincs connected together by an ISY setup scene and no delay can be detected, I have only two X10 MS units left out of about 11 units. I am so glad to see them go after witnessing Insteon.

[LeeG]

rominejc

 

"Obviously,this is because the open/close sensor remains open (and therefore on)."

 

Unfortunately that is not how the Open Close Sensor works.  As was stated by Stusviews the On command is sent once from the Open Close Sensor.   The Motion Sensor will send multiple On commands, once each time motion is sensed.  How often this happens depends on the Options set in the Motion Sensor.  Suggest you indicate how you have configured the Motion Sensor.  Also indicate what should happen under the various conditions; door opened and closed, door opened and left open, door already open.  This covers a trip down the stairs.

 

Then explain what you want to happen when traffic is going up stairs;  motion sensor starts process, what stops it?.   When door is opened, what if door is already open when trip up stairs starts.  Does door have to be closed to turn Off lights?

 

It does not help to offer a suggestion (probably two Programs at least) without knowing how the logic should perform to meet your requirements. 

[larryllix]

The door sensor at the top of the stairs is always going to be problematic in this scenario. The door could be left open.

 

If the door is left open, any timer, to turn the lights off, will eventually turn the lights off. Now the person at the top of the stairs will not be able to turn the light on again without shutting the door and reopening it to trigger a light cycle again. Not intuitive.

 

The MS needs to see the person at the top and the bottom of the staircase. The door sensor seems useless for this logic.

 

  or

 

a door closer but they are not recommended at the top of stairs for pushing kids down the staircase.