Techman Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 I have several motion sensors, Rev 2.3, firmware v.41, that are using lithium batteries. When the battery voltage drops to about 7.8 volts the motion sensor(s) starts to send continuous false on commands. With one of the sensors the low battery node came on after awhile but the sensor sent false on commands first. I'm not sure if this is an issue with the sensor low battery node treating the lithium battery differently than alkaline batteries or if it's a device firmware issue with the low battery node not being triggered early enough. Has anyone else experienced anything similar? Link to comment
stusviews Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 I'm using a lithium battery in one motion sensor. Since May I've been getting occasional low battery alerts, but they're not continuous, once every few days or even a week or two apart, none in September. So far, the MS is fully functional--it's activated several times a day, every day. Link to comment
Teken Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 I have several motion sensors, Rev 2.3, firmware v.41, that are using lithium batteries. When the battery voltage drops to about 7.8 volts the motion sensor(s) starts to send continuous false on commands. With one of the sensors the low battery node came on after awhile but the sensor sent false on commands first. I'm not sure if this is an issue with the sensor low battery node treating the lithium battery differently than alkaline batteries or if it's a device firmware issue with the low battery node not being triggered early enough. Has anyone else experienced anything similar? Yes . . . Ideals are peaceful - History is violent Link to comment
Techman Posted November 11, 2015 Author Share Posted November 11, 2015 I'm using a lithium battery in one motion sensor. Since May I've been getting occasional low battery alerts, but they're not continuous, once every few days or even a week or two apart, none in September. So far, the MS is fully functional--it's activated several times a day, every day. In my case the node that's falsely triggering is the motion node not the low battery node Link to comment
Techman Posted November 11, 2015 Author Share Posted November 11, 2015 Yes . . . Ideals are peaceful - History is violent So do you think it's a firmware issue with the MS or a compatibility issue with lithium batteries? Link to comment
paulbates Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 I have that behavior too, on and off over 4 years of using insteon MSs. Not necessarily lithium, but associated with battery changes. I think once the voltage gets low enough, they "flip out" Factory resetting, putting it in link mode, restoring the device and checking settings usually makes it stop. Paul Link to comment
Teken Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 It's both actually as some firmware does not activate a link to a ON position when a low battery condition is presented. By default lithium batteries have a lower VDC when compared to standard alkaline cells. This is why fresh cells and those that offer higher current output is important to have and use. I've been using rechargeable lithium cells with 750 mAh output for a few years now with great success. Ideals are peaceful - History is violent Link to comment
jerlands Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 An issue I find common with all my motion sensors is the terminal connections don't make properly. I've replaced several and am waiting on another dead battery for more surgery Jon... Link to comment
Teken Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 An issue I find common with all my motion sensors is the terminal connections don't make properly. I've replaced several and am waiting on another dead battery for more surgery Jon... That was a great step by step and excellent way to repurpose a used 9 volt battery cell. I know from personal experience that once in awhile pulling apart the cheap terminals often times results in ripping the wires clean off of the connectors. This happen to me on my Liftmaster outdoor wall mount remote key pad. To be fair I can't fault Liftmaster on providing a poor quality connector because the battery was actually fused and rusted together when it broke loose. Link to comment
jerlands Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 I know from personal experience that once in awhile pulling apart the cheap terminals often times results in ripping the wires clean off of the connectors. I'm careful when removing the connector with a screwdriver and not pulling it off but I've come to the conclusion they're cheaply made. Jon... Link to comment
Techman Posted November 12, 2015 Author Share Posted November 12, 2015 It's both actually as some firmware does not activate a link to a ON position when a low battery condition is presented. Teken, what's the firmware version, and hardware version if you have it, of the MS that you had had false on signals from when the battery voltage got low? Link to comment
Teken Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 One of them has the following information, revision 2.0 production date 1810. Unfortunately the ISY does not show the firmware because it was added to my system long ago before the polling feature was made available in later firmware which shows the common v.00 Ideals are peaceful - History is violent Link to comment
maxnorth Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 It's both actually as some firmware does not activate a link to a ON position when a low battery condition is presented. By default lithium batteries have a lower VDC when compared to standard alkaline cells. This is why fresh cells and those that offer higher current output is important to have and use. I've been using rechargeable lithium cells with 750 mAh output for a few years now with great success. Ideals are peaceful - History is violent Teken, I know this post is a bit old, but can you tell me how many months you get out of a rechargeable on a motion sensor, roughly? Also, is there a brand you've had good luck with? Link to comment
Teken Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 Hello, On average for low traffic areas exceeds 18-24 months. For high traffic areas with hits of 60-80 detection count the lowest has been 14 months but average 15-16 months normally. The brand in use is EBL but should be noted this product has extreme variability and quality control issues. I bought them knowing it was going to be a huge gamble but they were intended as a test bed and proof of concept for a few short / long term projects I had underway. I used them in a 25 foot plus PTZ mounted camera system which monitors the perimeter of the grounds. It was connected to a solar array with a charging circuit I built. That battery served me well for about 3.5 extreme cold winters in the north. The battery has now been replaced with a super capacitor which is tied to the solar array. As a back up the system is connected to a mini relay to power it via a modified POE power supply. This was added in as a measure of fail over in case the battery / make shift PSU exploded while in operation. All of the parts are enclosed in a metal insulated project box to contain fire and debris. One might ask why? As I stated extreme quality issues were seen and I had several 9 volt cells explode with great fan fair! Thus the need for fire / debris protection. ☹️ The cells that work have been running perfectly fine for about 4-5 years now though. Please keep in mind the Insteon MS is not intended to be installed and used in extreme weather. The fact it has survived 7 plus years up on a poll is impressive. The fact the battery exploded could have been a combination of extreme heat so I can't really blame that specific incident with the maker. However many of the batteries were wired backwards and upon charging exploded in a sealed chamber I placed them in. For the average person I would probably say go with name brand companies even if they offer lower AH. Full disclosure I received these batteries as a test sample from a vendor for the purpose of real world testing. I honestly can't say I would buy the product or recommend them to others in this forum though. ========================= The highest calling in life is to serve ones country faithfully - Teach others what can be. Do what is right and not what is popular. Link to comment
stusviews Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 I have a Duracell Contractor Pack Lithium battery in an Insteon motion sensor that senses several motions every night (only). The sensor is linked an Insteon KPL that controls the light in small hall that leads to a bathroom. The sensor is set to On-only. A program turns off the scene. It's been there since early 2015!!! Sensing is checked. LED is set to 10. Sensitivity is set to 5. Link to comment
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