SteveSBE Posted January 20, 2016 Posted January 20, 2016 Can I change the scene's on level based on the time of day for a scene that contains one Switchlinc and one Motion Sensor (MS) and is triggered directly by the MS rather than a program? I know I can use an ISY program to set the Swichlinc to the desired on level and then set the scene on. But I would prefer to have the programming only set the scene on level based on time of day and then have the linked MS/Switchlinc come on to that level when motion is detected. Below are my 4 programs that I hoped would adjust the scene on level at specific times of day. I've tried this with boththe MS and Switchlinc as controllers and also tried it with the MS as a controller and Switchlinc as a responder. No matter what I do the scene turns on at 100% (which was what the scene was at when I added the Switchlinc and MS to the scene). When I manually adjust the scene on level in the ISY admin console, click on the MS in the scene, and then click on button "Copy Scene Attributes from <the scene>" it will turn on at that rate from that point on. But no matter what I do the programs will not change the scene so that the MS triggers the Switchlinc to turn on at the desired level . What am I not understanding or doing wrong? Thanks, Steve p MBR Bath am Sunrise 80% On If Time is 5:00:00AM Then In Scene 'sf MBR Bath / sc MBR Bath' Set 'swl MBR Bath 2477D' 80% (On Level) In Scene 'sf MBR Bath / sc MBR Bath' Set 'swl MBR Bath 2477D' 1.0 Min (Ramp Rate) Else - No Actions - p MBR Bath am Sunrise-Sunset 40% On If Time is Sunrise + 30 minutes Then In Scene 'sf MBR Bath / sc MBR Bath' Set 'swl MBR Bath 2477D' 40% (On Level) In Scene 'sf MBR Bath / sc MBR Bath' Set 'swl MBR Bath 2477D' 0.3 Sec (Ramp Rate) Else - No Actions - p MBR Bath pm 09-10 pm 30% On If Time is 9:00:01PM Then In Scene 'sf MBR Bath / sc MBR Bath' Set 'swl MBR Bath 2477D' 30% (On Level) In Scene 'sf MBR Bath / sc MBR Bath' Set 'swl MBR Bath 2477D' 0.3 Sec (Ramp Rate) Else - No Actions - p MBR Bath pm 10-12 pm 17% On If Time is 10:00:00PM Then In Scene 'sf MBR Bath / sc MBR Bath' Set 'swl MBR Bath 2477D' 17% (On Level) In Scene 'sf MBR Bath / sc MBR Bath' Set 'swl MBR Bath 2477D' 0.3 Sec (Ramp Rate) Else - No Actions -
LeeG Posted January 21, 2016 Posted January 21, 2016 The first parameter of In Scene must be Motion Sensor - Sensor. The second parameter is the SwitchLinc On Level setting or SwitchLinc Ramp Rate setting
SteveSBE Posted January 21, 2016 Author Posted January 21, 2016 Thanks once again, Lee. This was exactly what I was looking for. Why is the MS-Sensor put into the first parameter...which I thought had to be the scene name (based on the "In Scene" before the parameter)? For me that is counter intuitive. Are techniques like this documented somewhere so I can look them up? Thanks for your help again. Steve
LeeG Posted January 21, 2016 Posted January 21, 2016 I'll have to do some searching to find where this is spelled out. The first parameter is the Controller which is the Motion Sensor - Sensor in this case. This device is not altered. It provides the Insteon address of the Controller which is used to identify the Responder link record to be changed. If the ISY Scene was used in a Program then an In Scene statement with the ISY Scene name would be required. This actually provides the PLM Insteon address as the Controller which would be used to identify the Responder link record. The second parameter identifies the Responder device where the Responder link record is located. The In Scene statement uses the Controller Insteon address from first parameter to locate Responder link record where the On Level and/or Ramp Rate value is changed.
LeeG Posted January 21, 2016 Posted January 21, 2016 The UDI Wiki has some information on Adjust Scene. It does describe using a Controller. Scroll down to Adjust Scene info http://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=ISY-99i/ISY-26_INSTEON:Action
SteveSBE Posted January 21, 2016 Author Posted January 21, 2016 I'll have to do some searching to find where this is spelled out. The first parameter is the Controller which is the Motion Sensor - Sensor in this case. This device is not altered. It provides the Insteon address of the Controller which is used to identify the Responder link record to be changed. If the ISY Scene was used in a Program then an In Scene statement with the ISY Scene name would be required. This actually provides the PLM Insteon address as the Controller which would be used to identify the Responder link record. The second parameter identifies the Responder device where the Responder link record is located. The In Scene statement uses the Controller Insteon address from first parameter to locate Responder link record where the On Level and/or Ramp Rate value is changed. Lee, I want to make sure that I understand clearly what the implications are of using the Motion Sensor - Sensor vs. using the ISY Scene name as the first parameter and so I have a follow up questions... What do you mean by "If the ISY Scene was used in a Program..."? The "In Scene" statement that I use is part of a program so I consider that "used in a Program". Is the following statement correct? If not, please let me know how to better state it. When the first parameter is the Controller (the Motion Sensor - Sensor in this case) it changes the On Level or Ramp Rate for the particular controller/responder combination. From that point on this combination will be used whenever the scene is switched to on by either MS motion detection or an ISY program command. I'm not clear of what a similar statement would be when the ISY Scene name is the first parameter. Could you help me out there? I want to make sure I understand the practical use for placing the ISY Scene name as the first parameter. I hope you can help out this slow learner. Thanks for your help. Steve
oberkc Posted January 21, 2016 Posted January 21, 2016 For any given scene, there will be "controllers" and "responders". Furthermore, for any given scene, the PLM is ALWAYS, by definition, a "contoller". In your scene, therefore, you have two controllers. One is the motion sensor. The other controller is the PLM. Your scene has one responder device: the switchlinc. Remember also, with insteon, the response (ramp rates, ON levels) can be unique to each controller device. In your case, therefore, you can define a different switch respnse if your switch is responding to the PLM compared to the response to the motion sensor. Whan an insteon program commands a scene to turn on, the responders in that scene will respond at the levels defined for when the PLM is controller. When a defined scene controller (motion sensor, in this case) commands a scene to be on, the responder devices will respond based on the defined level for that specific controller which can be different than the levels for the PLM. So, construct for the given command is: In scene <scene controller> set <scene responder> xx%
SteveSBE Posted January 21, 2016 Author Posted January 21, 2016 For any given scene, there will be "controllers" and "responders". Furthermore, for any given scene, the PLM is ALWAYS, by definition, a "contoller". In your scene, therefore, you have two controllers. One is the motion sensor. The other controller is the PLM. Your scene has one responder device: the switchlinc. Remember also, with insteon, the response (ramp rates, ON levels) can be unique to each controller device. In your case, therefore, you can define a different switch respnse if your switch is responding to the PLM compared to the response to the motion sensor. Whan an insteon program commands a scene to turn on, the responders in that scene will respond at the levels defined for when the PLM is controller. When a defined scene controller (motion sensor, in this case) commands a scene to be on, the responder devices will respond based on the defined level for that specific controller which can be different than the levels for the PLM. So, construct for the given command is: In scene <scene controller> set <scene responder> xx% Thanks, oberkc. Your explanation is just what I was looking for. LeeG and you continue to be very helpful to me. Great jobs!
LeeG Posted January 21, 2016 Posted January 21, 2016 " When the first parameter is the Controller (the Motion Sensor - Sensor in this case) it changes the On Level or Ramp Rate for the particular controller/responder combination. From that point on this combination will be used whenever the scene is switched to on by either MS motion detection or an ISY program command. " NO. When using the ISY Scene in a Program Then Set Scene 'xxxx' On the PLM is the Controller. Using an Adjust Scene to set the On Level and Ramp Rate for the PLM is a different Responder link record in SwitchLinc than the Responder link record the Motion Sensor -,Sensor uses. If you were using the ISY Scene in a Program it would take 2 Adjust Scene statements to set the SwitchLinc Responder link record On Level and Ramp Rate the PLM uses. This would have no affect on what the Motion Sensor - Sensor does as there is a separate Responder link record in the SwitchLinc for the Motion Sensor - Sensor. ISY Scene - PLM is Controller - SwitchLinc has Responder link record for PLM Motion Sensor - Sensor - Controller - SwitchLinc has Responder link record for Motion Sensor - Sensor
SteveSBE Posted January 21, 2016 Author Posted January 21, 2016 " When the first parameter is the Controller (the Motion Sensor - Sensor in this case) it changes the On Level or Ramp Rate for the particular controller/responder combination. From that point on this combination will be used whenever the scene is switched to on by either MS motion detection or an ISY program command. " NO. When using the ISY Scene in a Program Then Set Scene 'xxxx' On the PLM is the Controller. Using an Adjust Scene to set the On Level and Ramp Rate for the PLM is a different Responder link record in SwitchLinc than the Responder link record the Motion Sensor -,Sensor uses. If you were using the ISY Scene in a Program it would take 2 Adjust Scene statements to set the SwitchLinc Responder link record On Level and Ramp Rate the PLM uses. This would have no affect on what the Motion Sensor - Sensor does as there is a separate Responder link record in the SwitchLinc for the Motion Sensor - Sensor. ISY Scene - PLM is Controller - SwitchLinc has Responder link record for PLM Motion Sensor - Sensor - Controller - SwitchLinc has Responder link record for Motion Sensor - Sensor LeeG - Thanks for pointing that out. That makes sense to me now that I know that in this case there are two separate controllers (MS and PLM) for the scene. BTW...I wanted to see this in action. So I coded two programs to perform "In Scene..." command. One program had the Motion Sensor - Sensor as the 1st parameter and the other program had the ISY Scene name as the 1st parameter. They both modified the On Level and Ramp Rate the same. I then opened up the Event Viewer on level 3 and ran each of the programs. The event viewer information (I posted at link http://screencast.com/t/gOCPrG22QCW) was interesting and I could see the differences of when the MS was the controller and the Scene was the controller. However the information was plentiful and I could find only some of the information to decode the information provided for the steps the Event Viewer. Is there a more comprehensive list of the format of Event Viewer steps than I found in the Wiki? Thanks again for you explanations. Steve
LeeG Posted January 21, 2016 Posted January 21, 2016 (edited) The format of a Responder link record is not unique to a SwitchLinc A2 01 13 EF AC 7F 1D 01 A2 - Responder link record -- E2 Controller link record 01 - Group number of Controller - Motion Sensor - Sensor node Group number = 01 13 EF AC - Insteon address of Controller - Motion Sensor Insteon address 7F - On Level - 00 - FF - 0x7F (dec 127) = 50% 1D - Ramp Rate - 00 - 1F - 01 = slowest Ramp Rate 8 minutes - 1F = Fastest Ramp Rate 01 - Group number of Responder - 8 button KPL has 8 Group numbers 01 = button A - 08 = button H The Ramp Rate has evolved. Very old devices - 00 is slowest ramp rate 9 minutes; now 00 = 0.2 second ramp rate Edited January 21, 2016 by LeeG
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