ISY having intermittent issues - is PLM going bad?

[Naptown]

I've been reworking a lot of my home network with the addition of new cameras and new network switches.  I've made some changes to my ISY lately by adding some motion sensors and door sensors.  I'm starting to wonder if my PLM is going bad.  I've read they are good for about 2 years and I'm a little beyond that.  Specifically, I'm having trouble with a garage door open/close sensor, a dimmerlinc, and a keypadlinc.  The garage door sensor just always shows that it is open.  I've noticed that a keypad linc has the green pentagon shape by it on the UD aministrative console.

 

Also, this morning (the final straw before creating this post), my flood lights didn't pop on when I left the house.  I have a program that utilizes a motion sensor and pops on the floods when motion is detected.  But, when I looked at mobilinc on my phone, it showed the floods scene was 'ON'.

 

What am I missing?  If it is time for a new PLM, where is the best place to purchase?  Or, what version(s) should I purchase / avoid?

 

Edit - it's behaving similar to the time when a baby monitor was giving me fits.  No baby monitors now (although we will need a new baby monitor in October!  )

[jerlands]

All your symptoms could be related to comm issues so you might open Event Viewer to Level 3, activate a couple devices, copy to clipboard (clipboard icon lower toolbar) and paste into message.  You'll be looking at Hops Left=(x) where 3 or 2 indicate good and less is poor.

 

Losing device status can indicate loss of PLM links which could be sign of failing PLM.  Running Show PLM Links Table and if count is extremely low then PLM could be failing.  (when running test it's best to pick a period of inactivity or plug the PLM into a filtered outlet because network traffic can interfere with record.  also.. run test a number of times to verify.)  A two year old PLM puts you in the time frame of those with bad caps.  in admin console Tools > Diagnostics > PLM Info/Status and info from back of PLM (have to unplug PLM... first unplug power to ISY, unplug PLM and take reading, plug PLM and wait to stabilize, plug power into ISY.)

 

I'm unfamiliar with green pentagon shape?  green 1011 icon indicates write to device pending.  If you post a screen shot it'll help.

 

Also, which model of ISY do you have Help > About > Product and what does the Firmware and UI version show?

 

 

Jon...

[Naptown]

OK, I'll start working on this.  Looks like the hops are in the poor range.  I'll post another reply with some of your other diagnostic questions / answers.  Thanks in advance!

 

Thu 04/07/2016 02:08:10 PM : [iNST-TX-I1  ] 02 62 1D 54 71 0F 11 FF
Thu 04/07/2016 02:08:10 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 1D.54.71 0F 11 FF 06          LTONRR (FF)
Thu 04/07/2016 02:08:10 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 1D.54.71 1F.23.B4 23 11 FF    LTONRR (FF)
Thu 04/07/2016 02:08:10 PM : [std-Direct Ack] 1D.54.71-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=0
Thu 04/07/2016 02:08:10 PM : [D2D EVENT   ] Event [1D 54 71 1] [sT] [255] uom=0 prec=-1
Thu 04/07/2016 02:08:10 PM : [  1D 54 71 1]       ST 255
Thu 04/07/2016 02:08:13 PM : [iNST-TX-I1  ] 02 62 1D 54 71 0F 13 00
Thu 04/07/2016 02:08:13 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 1D.54.71 0F 13 00 06          LTOFFRR(00)
Thu 04/07/2016 02:08:13 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 1D.54.71 1F.23.B4 27 13 00    LTOFFRR(00)
Thu 04/07/2016 02:08:13 PM : [std-Direct Ack] 1D.54.71-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=1
Thu 04/07/2016 02:08:13 PM : [D2D EVENT   ] Event [1D 54 71 1] [sT] [0] uom=0 prec=-1
Thu 04/07/2016 02:08:13 PM : [  1D 54 71 1]       ST   0
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:12 PM : [iNST-TX-I1  ] 02 62 1F 1F 81 0F 11 FF
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:12 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 1F.1F.81 0F 11 FF 06          LTONRR (FF)
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:12 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 1F.1F.81 1F.23.B4 27 11 FF    LTONRR (FF)
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:12 PM : [std-Direct Ack] 1F.1F.81-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=1
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:12 PM : [D2D EVENT   ] Event [1F 1F 81 1] [sT] [255] uom=0 prec=-1
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:12 PM : [  1F 1F 81 1]       ST 255
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:56 PM : [iNST-TX-I1  ] 02 62 1F 1D CF 0F 11 FF
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:56 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 1F.1D.CF 0F 11 FF 06          LTONRR (FF)
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:56 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 1F.1D.CF 1F.23.B4 27 11 FF    LTONRR (FF)
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:56 PM : [std-Direct Ack] 1F.1D.CF-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=1
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:56 PM : [D2D EVENT   ] Event [1F 1D CF 1] [sT] [255] uom=0 prec=-1
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:56 PM : [  1F 1D CF 1]       ST 255
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:56 PM : [D2D-CMP 0008] STS [1F 1D CF 1] ST op=1 Event(val=255 uom=0 prec=-1) is Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> false
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:58 PM : [iNST-TX-I1  ] 02 62 1F 1D CF 0F 13 00
Thu 04/07/2016 02:09:58 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 1F.1D.CF 0F 13 00 06          LTOFFRR(00)
Thu 04/07/2016 02:10:00 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 1F.1D.CF 1F.23.B4 27 13 00    LTOFFRR(00)
Thu 04/07/2016 02:10:00 PM : [std-Direct Ack] 1F.1D.CF-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=1
Thu 04/07/2016 02:10:00 PM : [D2D EVENT   ] Event [1F 1D CF 1] [sT] [0] uom=0 prec=-1
Thu 04/07/2016 02:10:00 PM : [  1F 1D CF 1]       ST   0
Thu 04/07/2016 02:10:00 PM : [D2D-CMP 0008] STS [1F 1D CF 1] ST op=1 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) is Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true
 

[jerlands]

Yes, Hops Left=1 indicates comm issues.  Things that cause this other than improper bridging of legs are devices that create noise on powerline (CFL's, electronics or failing devices) or devices that absorb signals like UPS.  In either case use FilterLinc on outlet devices are plugged into and remove all CFL's.

 

Best way to improve comms and bridge legs is use of Range Extenders / LampLincs or On/Off Modules.  One on either leg and perform Beacon (4 tap test) to verify.

 

 

Jon...

[Naptown]

OK, I just did the 'Show PLM Links Table' and the count was 115.  No idea what that means!

 

PLM Info/Status:    1F.23.B4 v9B / Connected   (I'll have to get the info from the back of the PLM tonight)

 

It's a ISY 994i (1120) - OpenADR (21010).  Firmware and UI are both Insteon_UD994 v.4.3.26 (2015-10-13-11:35:11)

[Naptown]

Yes, Hops Left=1 indicates comm issues.  Things that cause this other than improper bridging of legs are devices that create noise on powerline (CFL's, electronics or failing devices) or devices that absorb signals like UPS.  In either case use FilterLinc on outlet devices are plugged into and remove all CFL's.

 

Best way to improve comms and bridge legs is use of Range Extenders / LampLincs or On/Off Modules.  One on either leg and perform Beacon (4 tap test) to verify.

 

 

Jon...

 

I do have a lamp with CFL bulbs and I noticed the bulbs looked like they were failing.  This could be the problem of the communication issues?

[jerlands]

Seems you do not have the Pro model and this limits the number of ISY links to 256 for devices and scenes.  You may not have to worry about this depending on number of devices.

 

PLM v9B <<-- Pretty certain this version is among those reported with failing capacitor issues.  You should probably get a replacement ordered anyway.

 

I do have a lamp with CFL bulbs and I noticed the bulbs looked like they were failing.  This could be the problem of the communication issues?

 

Yes, replace them with LED's or Halogen

 

 

 

Jon...

[jerlands]

OK, I just did the 'Show PLM Links Table' and the count was 115.  No idea what that means!

 

Depending on number of devices and scenes this count could be in range.

 

This calculator will provide an approximation of what you should be seeing.

 

Edit: just noticed the calculator incorrectly lists the number of max links in PLM @ 417 which may be what the 2412 held.  The 2413s holds over 900 (992?)

 

 

 

Jon...

[Brian H]

Another thing to check on.

Are there any new electronic devices in the home or an existing electronic device moved to a new location?

Chargers for portable electronics can also be a problem sometimes.

 

On the back of the 2413S PLM are some stickers.

They will give a date code and hardware revision.

[stusviews]

Best way to improve comms and bridge legs is use of Range Extenders / LampLincs or On/Off Modules.  One on either leg and perform Beacon (4 tap test) to verify.

 

The best way (although by far not the easiest) is to find the source of the problem and eliminate or filter it. Using a dual-band device instead is a band-aid (but easiest)

[Naptown]

PLU is #2413S V1.A 1239

[stusviews]

Your PLM is nearly 4 years old. That alone makes it suspect.

[Naptown]

Question - I know the best solution would to be replace the PLM with a NEW one from a reputable source, but would the capacitor repair apply to this unit?  I have read most of the content from this thread:   http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/13866-repair-of-2413s-plm-when-the-power-supply-fails/

 

Not sure if the capacitors could be the issue or if it's something else.  I have replaced capacitors on a flat screen tv in the past and have a convenient local source for capacitors.

[Naptown]

Your PLM is nearly 4 years old. That alone makes it suspect.

 

Also, can you explain the date code to me?

 

1239 - could that possibly be 2012, 39th week?

[Techman]

1239 = 39th week of 2012

 

The current versions of the PLM's have updated hardware and firmware. It's best to buy directly from Smarthome to be guaranteed that you'll have the most current release, and you'll also get the 2 year warranty.

[plm.repair]

I recently re-capped my 4 year old 2413S Dual-band Powerlinc.  On the suggestion of another user I put together a kit that contains the necessary components, instructions, and pictures.  

 

If you would like to order a kit and do the repair yourself just email me at plm.repair at gmail dot com

 

The kit is $18.45

 

Free shipping to the lower 48.

Contact me for shipping outside the U.S.

 

 

PLM Repair.pdf

[Naptown]

OK, this is probably taboo but I bought a replacement 2413s on Amazon (warehouse).  It's a november 2015 model, so I hope to make it work.  installed it and did the 'restore PLM'.  I chased the battery operated devices (MS, door sensors, and leak sensors) and almost everything is working.  I have 8 button keypad linc that has the red (!).  I tried the restore device, the query device, and write updates to device but it's still got the red (!).  I get the 'Cannot Communicat With Basement.... Please check connections."  What is best to do at this point?  New PLM seems to be working well outside of my one keypadlinc....  Maybe it's bad?

[paulbates]

 

 What is best to do at this point?  New PLM seems to be working well outside of my one keypadlinc.... 

 

 

Try the airgap procedure to reset it and try again. If that doesn't work, factory reset the keypadlinc and do a restore device. I've had similar issues replacing PLMs

 

Paul

[Naptown]

 

 

 

 

Try the airgap procedure to reset it and try again. If that doesn't work, factory reset the keypadlinc and do a restore device. I've had similar issues replacing PLMs

 

Paul

 

 

Airgap worked, thanks.