Anyone using an eGauge energy monitor?

[dgeist]

Hi, I've been using an ISY994 series for several years with my insteon and IP systems at home and love the flexibility. I'd like to start doing multi-circuit electric monitoring and possibly some renewable energy later. I've had my eye on the Brultech GEM for a while but have starting looking to see if there's any competition in the space worth looking at. I did a simple google search and found the eGauge eg3000 (and eg3010) which look like simpler, more streamlined versions of the Brrltech products. Here's the questions:

 

- Has anyone used the eGauge systems and how do you like them, specifically regarding the web API and built-in web service? 

- Any good comparison points between the products and the Brultech product line?

 

Thanks.

Dan

[Teken]

Hi, I've been using an ISY994 series for several years with my insteon and IP systems at home and love the flexibility. I'd like to start doing multi-circuit electric monitoring and possibly some renewable energy later. I've had my eye on the Brultech GEM for a while but have starting looking to see if there's any competition in the space worth looking at. I did a simple google search and found the eGauge eg3000 (and eg3010) which look like simpler, more streamlined versions of the Brrltech products. Here's the questions:

 

- Has anyone used the eGauge systems and how do you like them, specifically regarding the web API and built-in web service? 

- Any good comparison points between the products and the Brultech product line?

 

Thanks.

Dan

 

Hello Dan,

 

Out of all of the so called energy meters I have come across and played with first hand. The eGauge is probably less toy like then many of the ones I have seen in the past. The vendor seems to have a good handle on the hardware side but lacks a lot in the end user area with respect to development and access for the DIY crowd.

 

Keeping in mind some of the major bullet points listed below in no specific order.

 

1. No home automation integration with 3rd party devices like the 994 Series Controller.

2. Almost no charts and graphs besides what is provided in the limited view they provide.

3. Has no ability to customize rate(s) for those using base, tiered, ToU.

4. There is no open API or user base to foster development of the hardware, UI, etc

5. Price per CT to channels is still more than a GEM which offers 32 channels, 8 temp, 4 pulse.

 

If you're looking for a basic energy monitor this device may offer that for you. Since I am biased because I own a Brultech Green Eye Monitor (GEM) and their Dash Box (DB). Having played with many of the other toys on the market from Aeotech HEM, Smappy, Neurio, Sense, Curb, etc.

 

None of these companies even from the largest from Eaton, Hobo, Schneider Electric offer much in ways of value never mind actual user data that just makes sense.

 

In the last 25 years of being in this industry I have found either the product is geared to dumb to those who have almost no idea about how to render information so its useful. Some of the listed companies like to give you pretty graphs, charts, but when you go deeper and see what actual data is available its almost always lacking in detail to historic capture.

 

If you see a device that offers both detail and historic capture it will not offer you any method to render the data into more graphical charts and graphs. Ultimately 99% of these vendors will not work with a single user to add or expand on a feature in their product offering.

 

If you have tons of money and some kind of presence with them - they will be delighted to assist you for a FEE!

 

None of the major vendors are interested in Home Automation from a DIY perspective but push their internal HA platform and hardware instead which 99% of the time is many times more expensive then what you and I are using.

 

Its safe to say some of the toy like devices that have come to market via Kick Starter / Indigogo will be long gone in five years. Brultech has been in the Energy Monitoring business for more than 20 years. They don't make toasters, beer fridges, and certainly don't make toys.

 

They have been focused on making one of the best energy monitoring / energy management tools in the world. They have been the leader in development and inclusion of the user base since day one.

 

I can tell you from personal first hand experience working with them hand in hand for more than five years as a Alpha / Beta tester.

 

This Canadian company is open minded, agile, and committed.

 

They are committed to offering not only the best value but the most advanced system that the end user can use and have. They don't push their wares and often times offer a free solution for data aggregation before their humble Dash Box (DB).

 

One has to ask themselves why would any company offer in a public forum a solution that is free opposed to pushing their own hardware?!?!

 

Simply put from my point of view its because they are looking toward the future and long term. They know there are lots of DIY smart people willing and able to take the time to prop up a data server to store all of their data. Going this route requires lots of time, learning, patience, and ultimately costs you more and offers less capability.

 

When compared to the DB which is offered as a Plug & Play data storage device. Keeping in mind I use the phrase Plug & Play with some generalization as it does require some time to set up. But in no way is it like investing the amount of time to learn doing the same with the various free software platforms.

 

Which offer next to no support, guidance, or updates which have remained as so for years.

 

As you're probably aware you made a small investment in the 994 Series Controller which over the course of many years has continued to pay back major dividends in terms of constant updates and feature upgrades. All of this has been pretty much a one time purchase for you and I. We have continued to reap the rewards for such a one time investment.

 

You can purchase anything in the open market that suites your near term needs. But I can assure you from personal use and trials of many of these toy like monitors is that it will leave you wanting and frustrated of how limited they are.

 

If you're looking for a solid leader in Energy Monitoring / Energy Management -  Which integrates with the ISY Series Controller while also continues to listen to the customer in the development of said product.

 

There really is only one choice and that's Brultech . . .

Edited April 18, 2016 by Teken

[Scottmichaelj]

Hello Dan,

 

Out of all of the so called energy meters I have come across and played with first hand. The eGauge is probably less toy like then many of the ones I have seen in the past. The vendor seems to have a good handle on the hardware side but lacks a lot in the end user area with respect to development and access for the DIY crowd.

 

Keeping in mind some of the major bullet points listed below in no specific order.

 

1. No home automation integration with 3rd party devices like the 994 Series Controller.

2. Almost no charts and graphs besides what is provided in the limited view they provide.

3. Has no ability to customize rate(s) for those using base, tiered, ToU.

4. There is no open API or user base to foster development of the hardware, UI, etc

5. Price per CT to channels is still more than a GEM which offers 32 channels, 8 temp, 4 pulse.

 

If you're looking for a basic energy monitor this device may offer that for you. Since I am biased because I own a Brultech Green Eye Monitor (GEM) and their Dash Box (DB). Having played with many of the other toys on the market from Aeotech HEM, Smappy, Neurio, Sense, Curb, etc.

 

None of these companies even from the largest from Eaton, Hobo, Schneider Electric offer much in ways of value never mind actual user data that just makes sense.

 

In the last 25 years of being in this industry I have found either the product is geared to dumb to those who have almost no idea about how to render information so its useful. Some of the listed companies like to give you pretty graphs, charts, but when you go deeper and see what actual data is available its almost always lacking in detail to historic capture.

 

If you see a device that offers both detail and historic capture it will not offer you any method to render the data into more graphical charts and graphs. Ultimately 99% of these vendors will not work with a single user to add or expand on a feature in their product offering.

 

If you have tons of money and some kind of presence with them - they will be delighted to assist you for a FEE!

 

None of the major vendors are interested in Home Automation from a DIY perspective but push their internal HA platform and hardware instead which 99% of the time is many times more expensive then what you and I are using.

 

Its safe to say some of the toy like devices that have come to market via Kick Starter / Indigogo will be long gone in five years. Brultech has been in the Energy Monitoring business for more than 20 years. They don't make toasters, beer fridges, and certainly don't make toys.

 

They have been focused on making one of the best energy monitoring / energy management tools in the world. They have been the leader in development and inclusion of the user base since day one.

 

I can tell you from personal first hand experience working with them hand in hand for more than five years as a Alpha / Beta tester.

 

This Canadian company is open minded, agile, and committed.

 

They are committed to offering not only the best value but the most advanced system that the end user can use and have. They don't push their wares and often times offer a free solution for data aggregation before their humble Dash Box (DB).

 

One has to ask themselves why would any company offer in a public forum a solution that is free opposed to pushing their own hardware?!?!

 

Simply put from my point of view its because they are looking toward the future and long term. They know there are lots of DIY smart people willing and able to take the time to prop up a data server to store all of their data. Going this route requires lots of time, learning, patience, and ultimately costs you more and offers less capability.

 

When compared to the DB which is offered as a Plug & Play data storage device. Keeping in mind I use the phrase Plug & Play with some generalization as it does require some time to set up. But in no way is it like investing the amount of time to learn doing the same with the various free software platforms.

 

Which offer next to no support, guidance, or updates which have remained as so for years.

 

As you're probably aware you made a small investment in the 994 Series Controller which over the course of many years has continued to pay back major dividends in terms of constant updates and feature upgrades. All of this has been pretty much a one time purchase for you and I. We have continued to reap the rewards for such a one time investment.

 

You can purchase anything in the open market that suites your near term needs. But I can assure you from personal use and trials of many of these toy like monitors is that it will leave you wanting and frustrated of how limited they are.

 

If you're looking for a solid leader in Energy Monitoring / Energy Management - Which integrates with the ISY Series Controller while also continues to listen to the customer in the development of said product.

 

There really is only one choice and that's Brultech . . .

Teken should be sponsored by Brultech. LOL I agree though with Teken as I just put one in myself. However be prepared to fiddle with it and spend time setting it up. Depending how many circuits you have it could be hours. I still have to fiddle around with mine. Also the software on the Dashbox is a bit flakey, but tech support is very good. Some simple stuff like deleting my data took a email to tech support. Once you understand how things work it get much easier. It was very overwhelming for me at first for setup etc but Teken was a huge help. I still dont have any of the data going to my ISY but I really cant think of a reason for me personally to need that either.

[bgrubb1]

I use the data feed from the DB to the ISY for many things

If it is on peak hours and either the washer or dryer are pulling >50 watts, set off a zwave siren to turn tell wife / kids to turn it off

If the tv/stereo is on turn on the subwoofers (many) via insteon duplex outlets, else turn them off and save the power

If voltage is <> threshold, send me a text

etc

..Barry

[Scottmichaelj]

I use the data feed from the DB to the ISY for many things

If it is on peak hours and either the washer or dryer are pulling >50 watts, set off a zwave siren to turn tell wife / kids to turn it off

If the tv/stereo is on turn on the subwoofers (many) via insteon duplex outlets, else turn them off and save the power

If voltage is <> threshold, send me a text

etc

..Barry

Yup sounds great but that wouldn't fly in my home. Thankfully I don't have tiers or "cost saving timeframes" where I live (or kids!). The Brultech has been great for me though to know what circuits use what energy and therefore change habits if I can. So far the only real change I have made is to turn off the towel warmers from midnight to 6am since they were using 350w and running 24/7. Saved me about $20-30 a month. I thought my HVAC split system was using the energy and it was the towel warmers that used more in the day! That was an eye opener for sure.

[dgeist]

Thanks for the feedback, all (and for the novella, Tekken )

 

I'm an engineer / computer scientist by trade and education, so messing with things doesn't phase me. I do like solutions that do things simply and elegantly and with a minimum of fuss. Time is expensive, especially with lots of other stuff going on in life.

 

The thing that attracted me to the eg30xx series was the fact that is has a built-in web service with a well-documented API  https://www.egauge.net/docs/egauge-xml-api.pdf Perhaps the API isn't quite as capable as it looks or perhaps it's just more suited for large-scale commercial energy monitoring installations than for integration with HA.

 

I like ethernet. The one with 8 wires, not the multiple antennae. Does the GEM have any kind of on-board IP interface or do you have to have a dashbox to get web APIs ,etc.? I'm okay with something other than REST, but I'd really like to integrate with this directly over IP from my ISY (and everything else). I expect to pull some data for HA tasks, but I'd frankly rather render a web interface on a virtual machine in my existing server farm than have to support another little PC on the wall with another little wall-wart, etc.

 

If I can get to everything I need on a GEM via RJ45 TCP/IP then the pricepoint per monitored circuit seems to blow everything else out of the water, I just hate to get stuck with something that doesn't do what I need or that doesn't work with other stuff I have (like my TED interfering with my insteon...).

 

Dan

[Teken]

Thanks for the feedback, all (and for the novella, Tekken )

 

I'm an engineer / computer scientist by trade and education, so messing with things doesn't phase me. I do like solutions that do things simply and elegantly and with a minimum of fuss. Time is expensive, especially with lots of other stuff going on in life.

 

The thing that attracted me to the eg30xx series was the fact that is has a built-in web service with a well-documented API  https://www.egauge.net/docs/egauge-xml-api.pdf Perhaps the API isn't quite as capable as it looks or perhaps it's just more suited for large-scale commercial energy monitoring installations than for integration with HA.

 

I like ethernet. The one with 8 wires, not the multiple antennae. Does the GEM have any kind of on-board IP interface or do you have to have a dashbox to get web APIs ,etc.? I'm okay with something other than REST, but I'd really like to integrate with this directly over IP from my ISY (and everything else). I expect to pull some data for HA tasks, but I'd frankly rather render a web interface on a virtual machine in my existing server farm than have to support another little PC on the wall with another little wall-wart, etc.

 

If I can get to everything I need on a GEM via RJ45 TCP/IP then the pricepoint per monitored circuit seems to blow everything else out of the water, I just hate to get stuck with something that doesn't do what I need or that doesn't work with other stuff I have (like my TED interfering with my insteon...).

 

Dan

 

Hello Dan,

 

You can download the full users manual which clearly outlines what aspect of the API is accessible etc. I would highly suggest you create an account on the Brultech forum and pose any technical question you may have about the product.

 

Ben / Paul are always very quick to answer any pre-sales questions along with offering excellent service after the sale. The eGauge is definitely geared toward a more commercial audience with limited function and views.

 

In terms of cost per CT there isn't anything on the market that comes even close to the GEM. 

[jlegault]

When we installed solar panels, I decided to add a egauge E3000. I think I have spent far too much at this point on energy monitors. I started with a "One Meter" 10 years ago, then Ted, then Brultech, and now an eGauge. The eGauge is the first system I would call robust and stand alone. While the Brultech has more user accessible features, it is so brittle, has archaic software, and so dependant on other hardware to be useful. It has since stopped working and I can't find the motivation to keep it working (software). The eGauge on the other hand is a next generation solution in comparison, but unfortunately the DIY community has not really discovered it, so there is virtually zero support in the systems I use. Universal should take note of their architecture and aspire to make their systems as self contained and bullet proof.