New Wiring for Insteon - Best Practices?

[Guitartexan01]

As a recommendation not pertaining to Insteon, now is the time to install eave receptacles for Christmas lights, floor receptacles if you might need/want them, provide conduits under driveways and sidewalks, brace boxes for ceiling fans, provide plenty of attic lighting and several garage light fixture locations. Other things include built in vacuums, under/over cabinet lighting, wiring for whole house audio, provide plenty of garage and exterior GFI circuits, exterior lighting circuits switched from inside (can't tell you how many homes I've been called to to add these items after the fact).

 

 

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[paulbates]

I wanted to fill in a little more on what Stu said a few posts up:

 

An additional planning item for N-ways... when you sell the house eventually, do you

1. plan to leave insteon switches in place for N-ways...  or
2. remove insteon and convert to conventional N-way switches?

If its 1), you will have less complicated and less expensive wiring. You won't need specific N-way wiring for switches. Run hot, neutral and ground run to each box: switch, outlet or fixture. I've got virtual circuits for both interior and exterior wiring that would be a significant project to wire conventionally, but relatively simply done with insteon. While the ISY programmed the scenes to make the N-way work, it has a secondary role behind actual physical switching.. the PLM and ISY can both die or be removed when i sell, and manual switching would keep working. 

 

If its 2), the wiring will be more complex and therefore expensive. N-way wiring would have to be planned and installed, but not used with insteon.

 

I've thought about 1) if I were to build a new place.

 

I know its been said a number of times here, but be sure you follow national and local codes, and clear all plans with the local authority before settling on one, and find an electrician you can work with. I've replaced my own devices, but also worked with an electrician with a floor plan after device programming.. put device A) here,..etc.

 

Paul

[stusviews]

Running a 3-wire cable is not much more costly than running a 2-wire cable, adding maybe an additional $10. The main cost is labor. I'd never wire for HA only where there is no possibility to not use HA devices.

[Teken]

Running a 3-wire cable is not much more costly than running a 2-wire cable, adding maybe an additional $10. The main cost is labor. I'd never wire for HA only where there is no possibility to not use HA devices.

 

Sadly, this is becoming quite the norm for many people who either build new or start a retro fit of the home. I just have to shake my head in disbelief as to why anyone would believe using virtual switching as the primary method to control load(s) is the correct path to take.

 

As I noted in another related thread I was on site to complete a Insteon install and the home owner took the whole virtual switching to the Nth degree. It came as no great surprise to me he saw some hardware failures or where they needed to hard reset many devices.

 

When he realized more than 30 devices would need to be accessed by a 25 foot ladder at the fixture(s). Along with zero possibility to actually turn the load on / off at ground level due to the virtual switching he insisted upon. The WAF went into the toilet might quick and now has to eat hundreds of dollars in replacement costs and labor time to complete the tasks.

 

People should never sacrifice expected and common sense load control on the ground just to clean up a wall to reduce the amount of switches in the home!

 

The only thing that made this guys home stand out as being the worst designed and conceived idea is the fact he actually has a maintenance room with home run Insteon DIN relays controlling what ever. Its great the DIN relays are on the ground and accessible in a central location.

 

But you get a huge (F) for being stupid in having no local control with real wires in the freaking room!

 

This is the epitome of someone with more money than brains and lacking common sense . . .

[jtara92101]

^ What Teken said. Please don't make whoever buys your home when you eventually sell it hate you!

 

(My real pet peeve, though, is all the *&^%$! people do to their homes just before they sell it to make it "more attractive". Please do not do the buyer any "favors" hiring hack painters to slap on garbage paint that buyer will have to remediate with special primer, please do not put in low-end stainless steel appliances and "smell new" cheap apartment carpeting which the new owner will just replace anyway, etc. etc. etc. This trash just costs the buyer more money when they realize what a bad job was done... And please leave out the ugly staged furniture, everybody knows why you put that cheap sofa right where it is, so that the buyer won't walk over the squeak in the floor.... Maybe I think different, but every one of these last-minute "fix-ups" SUBTRACTS from the attractiveness of the property. Enough of it is a disqualification. But it's done, because I guess most people don't think different.)

 

EXTRA BIG BOXES would be a huge +. My place has a mix of metal boxes. Some of them are a real squeeze with Insteon devices, because they have no room around the edges, and the BX fittings intrude. I FINALLY got two Insteon devices into my kitchen box without any need for modification with a Dremel after replacing wire nuts with push-in strip connectors (shoot me, but they are much more compact, and easy to verify solid contact as they have clear bodies).

 

The good boxes have "pockets" all around that provide maybe an inch around all sides where connections can be stuffed out of the way, as well as preventing the BX fittings from intruding into the device space. The only negative I see to these is that you won't be able to gang them together (would be too wide) e.g. to put a low-voltage switch next to line voltage. Note that the front opening is conventional size - you won't need over-sized plates, they are boxed-in in the front.

 

I also have some with plaster rings, and they are trouble, because the corners are round rather than square, and make a VERY close fit for Insteon devices.

[jtara92101]

Somebody mentioned conduit for low-voltage stuff.

 

ORANGE plastic flex conduit, so as not to ever be confused with line-voltage conduit!

 

It would be good to run a bundle of whatever wires make sense in 2017 home-run to a wiring closet from each room (at least one per room) along with an empty conduit for future changes. No need to put the bundle in conduit.

 

Put a pull line in the conduit. But a good nylon reel will fish it easily so long as you are generous with corner radii.

[Teken]

To add further to the list of *Rough In / Future Prep* do NOT ever use or install CCA Ethernet cable. It's not in wall rated and can become a fire hazard - Never mind doesn't meet code.

 

Copper Clad Aluminum has saturated the Interwebs like head lice . . .

 

If you see a 1000 foot box of CAT6 cable going out the door for sub $49.XX its CCA cable. You only want to buy pure solid / stranded copper wire as it offers certified power and data transfer rates. Never use unshielded cable where it must be used because you're just asking for trouble and injected noise will be present.

 

Then again I see so many so called *Professionals* which run 120 / 240 VAC wiring in parallel with low voltage wiring I just shake my head.

 

If you intend to use Ethernet cable for POE ensure you purchase 23 AWG cable as CAT5e, CAT6, CAT7 comes in 23, 24, 26 AWG. 

 

If you expect to be powering a *Real* PTZ camera using 24 AWG Ethernet cable and believe the cable won't vaporize you have a lot of reading to do. Everyone and their dog is in a rage to use CAT cable to supply power but don't ever take a few moments to fully understand the current / amperage requirements and the ampacity the wire can actually handle.

 

This is why anyone who is serious will run both CAT-X cable along with 16-2 16-4 / 18-2 18-4 power cable.