ray6543 Posted February 6, 2017 Posted February 6, 2017 This is far more basic than the other positing in this forum as I am new to ISY994 and Z-Wave. I have evolved from Revolv - discontinued but supported Insteon and Z-Wave to an INSTEON hub, which sidelined my Z-Wave switches and receptacle, and then to the ISY994 ZW/IR Pro. I've had all my Insteon devices, mostly light switches and receptacles working for some time and now want to re-integrate my Z-Wave devices. I've wired an Evolve LOM-15 Receptacle and 2 GE/Jasco Z-Wave switches. All are in line of sight of the ISY994 and no more than 20 feet away. In the control console when I select "Add/Include a Z-Wave Device" the Device Discovery window opens, but then nothing happens. After many dozens of attempts and firmware updates, etc. none of the Z-wave devices were found. Then suddenly one of the 2 switches was recognized, I "believe" when I turned the light on and off. When I tried "Add/Include a Z-Wave Device" again, the second switch, in the same wall box, was never found. The same for the Evolve receptacle. 1. Do I need to, or should I have to, turn loads on and off for the Z-Wave devices to be discovered? 2. Is there any requirement for a large load to be present for the detection to occur or can the switches & receptacles simply be toggled? 3. Any other suggestions? New Sympton: When I turn the 2nd switch on, the "Add/Include a Z-Wave Device" window closes. ~Ray ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Teken Posted February 6, 2017 Posted February 6, 2017 This is far more basic than the other positing in this forum as I am new to ISY994 and Z-Wave. I have evolved from Revolv - discontinued but supported Insteon and Z-Wave to an INSTEON hub, which sidelined my Z-Wave switches and receptacle, and then to the ISY994 ZW/IR Pro. I've had all my Insteon devices, mostly light switches and receptacles working for some time and now want to re-integrate my Z-Wave devices. I've wired an Evolve LOM-15 Receptacle and 2 GE/Jasco Z-Wave switches. All are in line of sight of the ISY994 and no more than 20 feet away. In the control console when I select "Add/Include a Z-Wave Device" the Device Discovery window opens, but then nothing happens. After many dozens of attempts and firmware updates, etc. none of the Z-wave devices were found. Then suddenly one of the 2 switches was recognized, I "believe" when I turned the light on and off. When I tried "Add/Include a Z-Wave Device" again, the second switch, in the same wall box, was never found. The same for the Evolve receptacle. 1. Do I need to, or should I have to, turn loads on and off for the Z-Wave devices to be discovered? <- No 2. Is there any requirement for a large load to be present for the detection to occur or can the switches & receptacles simply be toggled? <- No 3. Any other suggestions? New Sympton: When I turn the 2nd switch on, the "Add/Include a Z-Wave Device" window closes. ~Ray ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Hello Ray, Answers in line - For what ever reason best practice and success to add a new piece of Z-Wave device requires a exclude than a include. Some members have seen where a lock set requires a repair along with completing a exclude than a include. Give that a try and report back success / failure . . . Keep in mind lots of this hinges upon having a strong Z-Wave RF mesh in relations to the ISY Series Controller.
MWareman Posted February 6, 2017 Posted February 6, 2017 Have you 'excluded' the devices first? You don't have to exclude on the revolve, but the devices will stay paired to it untill you tell them to disassociate. You can do this from ISY.
ray6543 Posted February 7, 2017 Author Posted February 7, 2017 Hello Ray, Answers in line - For what ever reason best practice and success to add a new piece of Z-Wave device requires a exclude than a include. Some members have seen where a lock set requires a repair along with completing a exclude than a include. Give that a try and report back success / failure . . . Keep in mind lots of this hinges upon having a strong Z-Wave RF mesh in relations to the ISY Series Controller. I did manage to Exclude then add the 2nd switch, but only after having toggled the switch. No such luck with the receptacle. How do you Exclude a device the ISY can't find? I "assumed" that you started the Remove/Exclude then toggled the device so the ISY would know which you wanted to exclude... Have you 'excluded' the devices first? You don't have to exclude on the revolve, but the devices will stay paired to it untill you tell them to disassociate. You can do this from ISY. See my reply & question to Teken above.
MWareman Posted February 7, 2017 Posted February 7, 2017 Yes you start 'Remove/Exclude' on ISY. Then, on the device you follow the manufacturer instruction. It's sometime not toggling it, sometimes there is a pair button. Sometimes it needs holding, sometime double clicking etc. It's all up to the device vendor as to the specific process.
stusviews Posted February 7, 2017 Posted February 7, 2017 Include/exclude is not adequate. You must use exclude first, preferably twice.
stusviews Posted February 8, 2017 Posted February 8, 2017 The ISY choices are add/include or remove/exclude. There is no include/exclude. Many Z-wave devices can be easily added. It's only when there's difficulty adding/including the device that the recommend solution is to exclude the device first, sometimes twice. Insteon devices sometimes need to be factory reset first, also, So the recommendation is to always exclude Z-Wave devices and factory reset Insteon devices first to avoid unanticipated results. It's a recommendation, not a rule
vjk Posted February 8, 2017 Posted February 8, 2017 This is far more basic than the other positing in this forum as I am new to ISY994 and Z-Wave. I have evolved from Revolv - discontinued but supported Insteon and Z-Wave to an INSTEON hub, which sidelined my Z-Wave switches and receptacle, and then to the ISY994 ZW/IR Pro. I've had all my Insteon devices, mostly light switches and receptacles working for some time and now want to re-integrate my Z-Wave devices. I've wired an Evolve LOM-15 Receptacle and 2 GE/Jasco Z-Wave switches. All are in line of sight of the ISY994 and no more than 20 feet away. In the control console when I select "Add/Include a Z-Wave Device" the Device Discovery window opens, but then nothing happens. After many dozens of attempts and firmware updates, etc. none of the Z-wave devices were found. Then suddenly one of the 2 switches was recognized, I "believe" when I turned the light on and off. When I tried "Add/Include a Z-Wave Device" again, the second switch, in the same wall box, was never found. The same for the Evolve receptacle. 1. Do I need to, or should I have to, turn loads on and off for the Z-Wave devices to be discovered? 2. Is there any requirement for a large load to be present for the detection to occur or can the switches & receptacles simply be toggled? 3. Any other suggestions? New Sympton: When I turn the 2nd switch on, the "Add/Include a Z-Wave Device" window closes. ~Ray ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ It works as follows. New zwave devices should have their network id(HomeId) set to zero at the factory. Otherwise, they won't be added because the controller would think the device belongs to a different network. Sometimes, new devices have their HomeId set to a value other than zero. Perhaps, because it was a return, who knows. I had to remove a device only once precisely for that reason, i.e. HomeId != zero. Usually, you do not need to remove a device before adding. So, in general, the process goes this way: You tell the controller to add a device. The controller start broadcasting a frame to initiate the add sequence. You press a button on the device to respond. If everything is ok, the device is added. With switches, you usually press the on/off button, with thermostats you select a menu item. I am not aware of zwave devices that would respond to add/remove requests without requiring some manual action. Removal works the same way, only you put the controller in the remove mode and operate your device to respond to the controller solicitations. A controller can remove any device, even already belonging to a different network, by setting its HomeId to zero.
ray6543 Posted February 8, 2017 Author Posted February 8, 2017 It works as follows. New zwave devices should have their network id(HomeId) set to zero at the factory. Otherwise, they won't be added because the controller would think the device belongs to a different network. Sometimes, new devices have their HomeId set to a value other than zero. Perhaps, because it was a return, who knows. I had to remove a device only once precisely for that reason, i.e. HomeId != zero. Usually, you do not need to remove a device before adding. So, in general, the process goes this way: You tell the controller to add a device. The controller start broadcasting a frame to initiate the add sequence. You press a button on the device to respond. If everything is ok, the device is added. With switches, you usually press the on/off button, with thermostats you select a menu item. I am not aware of zwave devices that would respond to add/remove requests without requiring some manual action. Removal works the same way, only you put the controller in the remove mode and operate your device to respond to the controller solicitations. A controller can remove any device, even already belonging to a different network, by setting its HomeId to zero. Thanks for the detail. As a Newnie, I appreciate it. By the way, when you do remove a device, is there any indication. When I do actually manage to add a device the Device Discovery/Add a Device" window closes and the device appears in the device list. How can I tell is I actually managed to remove a device that wasn't part of my network to start with?
vjk Posted February 9, 2017 Posted February 9, 2017 Thanks for the detail. As a Newnie, I appreciate it. By the way, when you do remove a device, is there any indication. When I do actually manage to add a device the Device Discovery/Add a Device" window closes and the device appears in the device list. How can I tell is I actually managed to remove a device that wasn't part of my network to start with? According to the Sigma serial API docs, the removal status should be provided even when removing "foreign" nodes (COMMAND_NODE_REMOVE_STATUS): http://z-wave.sigmadesigns.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/SDS12652-13-Z-Wave-Command-Class-Specification-N-Z.pdf Not sure if ISY provides foreign node removal status info, though. The only time I needed to reset the HomeId, I used an Aeon stick with Zwave Tool which does provide some feedback
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