ISY linking to INSTEON I/O Linc 2450

[Samson]

I have been trying to add my Insteon I/O Linc 2450 to my ISY and can't seem to get it done. The problem I have is when I attempt to do this after unlinking and doing a factory reset on the 2450 several times, I can only populate the 2450  to the program tab which shows the garage door sensor and the garage door open close. I can't populate it to Main-Network-ISY. The 2450 is part of the Insteon Garage Door Control Kit 74551. 

[paulbates]

Hi and welcome to the UDI forums.

 

Let's start with the basics:

• How did you add your iolinc to the ISY?
  • Link management menu, Start Linking (and put the device in linking mode) .... or....
  • Link management menu, New INSTEON Device (where you type in the Insteon Address)
• I would try it both ways
• What messages do you get back from the ISY when trying either method?

Paul

•  

[stusviews]

Click on Network, click on Address (to sort by Insteon ID) or click on Type. Does the I/O Linc appear in the list of devices?

[lbudler]

I have a very similar problem.   I attempted to link my 2450 (garage door Monitor).   It seemed to work for a short period but then it could not communicate with the 2450 (relay and sensor).   So I decided to delete the relay and the sensor.    I have no longer be able to link the device at all.    I assume some how the original link is not fully removed, or the garage door monitor is somehow scrambled.    How can I get things reset and the link reestablished?   I have a 994i zw  Larry

[Teken]

I have a very similar problem.   I attempted to link my 2450 (garage door Monitor).   It seemed to work for a short period but then it could not communicate with the 2450 (relay and sensor).   So I decided to delete the relay and the sensor.    I have no longer be able to link the device at all.    I assume some how the original link is not fully removed, or the garage door monitor is somehow scrambled.    How can I get things reset and the link reestablished?   I have a 994i zw  Larry

 

Hello Larry,

 

First step is to hard reset the I/O Linc per the full users manual. Next, plug the device into the same outlet as the 2413S PLM it should add fine from there. Then, you can bring it back to the garage keeping in mind the I/O Linc is a single band Insteon device so you need to ensure your network is properly bridged / coupled. You can confirm for proper coupling / bridging via the 4 tap beacon test outlined in any full users manual for (dual band devices).

[Techman]

Being that the IOLinc is an Powerline only device you should try adding a dual band device in close proximity to the IOLinc to improve communications..

[Teken]

Bein that the IOLinc is an RF only device you should try adding a dual band device in close proximity to the IOLinc to improve communications..

 

I believe you meant to say its a power line only device. That CA heat is getting to you my friend!

[Techman]

I believe you meant to say its a power line only device. That CA heat is getting to you my friend!

 

You could be  right, thanks, I fixed it.

[lbudler]

Hello Larry,

 

First step is to hard reset the I/O Linc per the full users manual. Next, plug the device into the same outlet as the 2413S PLM it should add fine from there. Then, you can bring it back to the garage keeping in mind the I/O Linc is a single band Insteon device so you need to ensure your network is properly bridged / coupled. You can confirm for proper coupling / bridging via the 4 tap beacon test outlined in any full users manual for (dual band devices).

 

I have searched for hard reset in user manual.   All I come up with is this!   Is what you are referring to?   Are you saying that I need to remove the device from garage and bring it to isy in the home?   Would a long extension cord suffice?

 

Add Devices Found in Links and keep existing links

This option is the same as “Add Devices Found in Links” except it does not overwrite the device settings, manual or otherwise. It will bring all the links found in each discovered device, try to make scenes out of the relationships, and maintain a copy of all the settings the device already contains.

Depending on the number of devices linked and the type of devices, ISY’s reprogramming of the devices may take roughly 10 seconds to 1 minute per device. Please be patient while ISY reprograms the devices and do not perform any operations on your INSTEON devices.

[Teken]

I have searched for hard reset in user manual.   All I come up with is this!   Is what you are referring to?   Are you saying that I need to remove the device from garage and bring it to isy in the home?   Would a long extension cord suffice?

 

Add Devices Found in Links and keep existing links

This option is the same as “Add Devices Found in Links” except it does not overwrite the device settings, manual or otherwise. It will bring all the links found in each discovered device, try to make scenes out of the relationships, and maintain a copy of all the settings the device already contains.

Depending on the number of devices linked and the type of devices, ISY’s reprogramming of the devices may take roughly 10 seconds to 1 minute per device. Please be patient while ISY reprograms the devices and do not perform any operations on your INSTEON devices.

 

Hello Larry,

 

Absolutely, use an extension cord and plug it into the same outlet as the 2413S PLM. Your doing this because it will negate the whole *My Split Single Phase* electrical system isn't properly coupled / bridged. Also just to be doubly sure the hard reset is on page 12 of this PDF: http://cache-m2.smarthome.com/manuals/2450.pdf

[lbudler]

I used the long extension cord and it worked great!   The link is reestablished and seems to be okay.    Thanks for the help!  larry

[Teken]

I used the long extension cord and it worked great!   The link is reestablished and seems to be okay.    Thanks for the help!  larry

 

Perfect, now your next step is to confirm proper coupling of the split single phase electrical system in your home. Doing so will ensure a consistent and reliable Insteon network and user experience. If you need more details about the 4 tap (beacon) test once you have read the full Insteon manual please do ask. 

[lbudler]

I used the long extension cord and it worked great!   The link is reestablished and seems to be okay.    Thanks for the help!  larry

 

I never received a owners manual with my Insteon I/O linc.   I assumed this means the unit was returned from a previous owner and the manual was not sent along.   But it works now and I am completely satisfied.   

[Brian H]

The I/O Linc only comes with a Quick Guide.

As do all the Insteon modules.

You have to use the manuals tab on its sales page to download the full manual.

http://cache-m2.smarthome.com/manuals/2450.pdf

[stusviews]

If you don't have any dual-band devices in your garage, then plug a Range Extender into the I/O Linc pass-through outlet.

[paulbates]

If you don't have any dual-band devices in your garage, then plug a Range Extender into the I/O Linc pass-through outlet.

 

I did what Stu mentions. Since its an older device, you can use a Range Extender, or if you have an older access point that works and what I did. I put it on the same circuit in the detached garage, but in an outlet that's about level and in sight of a dual band device in the house. That was several years ago and its still works fine

 

Paul

[lbudler]

Perfect, now your next step is to confirm proper coupling of the split single phase electrical system in your home. Doing so will ensure a consistent and reliable Insteon network and user experience. If you need more details about the 4 tap (beacon) test once you have read the full Insteon manual please do ask. 

 

I am sorry but I find no reference in manual referring to split single phase or any details referring to coupling of the split single phase.   Can you please copy the test and put it into your reply.    I need to be able to find it, to implement it!   I definitely need it to be a reliable connection!   thanks!   Larry

[lbudler]

If you don't have any dual-band devices in your garage, then plug a Range Extender into the I/O Linc pass-through outlet.

 

How does this wifi range extender, (https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1089830-REG/tp_link_tl_wa860re_300_mb_s_wi_fi.html), my powerline carrier device  in the garage door monitor.    I don't see how the wifi range extender helps the split single phase powerline carrier!

[Teken]

I am sorry but I find no reference in manual referring to split single phase or any details referring to coupling of the split single phase.   Can you please copy the test and put it into your reply.    I need to be able to find it, to implement it!   I definitely need it to be a reliable connection!   thanks!   Larry

 

Hello Larry,

 

Here is a copy of one of the full users manuals for a switch linc relay. The 4 tap (beacon) test is outlined exactly the same for all current shipping devices: http://cache-m2.smarthome.com/manuals/2477s.pdf The details start at the bottom of page 12 called *Phase Detection Beacon*. Essentially you will tap the set button on any Insteon dual band band device 4 times very quickly.

 

You will know if this has been done correctly because the unit will beep and flash. If the unit does not beep and flash you haven't pressed the set button quick enough. Many find this easier on plugin devices because the button isn't so recessed. For any switch a small flat (standard) screw driver works fine. The basic principle is very simple if you see any other Insteon device in the home blinking green this means its on the opposite side of the electrical leg of the service panel. If the device in question is blinking red it means that hardware is on the same electrical leg as the initiating device.

 

All this is doing is confirming your homes Insteon network is bridged / coupled correctly via RF signaling.

 

It should be noted ideally there should be one dual band device on all four corners of the home on every level of the premises. Lastly, all the coupling / bridging in the world will not supersede the need to identify noise makers / signal suckers in the home. If found your choices are to filter, replace, remove.

 

Phase Detect Beacon SwitchLinc On/Off Switch Dual-Band automatically detects the electrical phases in your home (via communications with other dual-band devices on the other phase). This is only important if you have powerline-only products in a building with multiple phases (split-single or 3-phase).

 

1) Tap Set button 4 times quickly. SwitchLinc will start beeping once per second. LED will turn green.

 

2) Check the LED behavior of other dual-band devices. a. If the other dual-band device is blinking green, it is on the other phase. Device connects the phases to SwitchLinc. b. If the other dual-band device is blinking red, it is on the same phase. Device does not connect the phases to SwitchLinc. Relocate device if necessary (and where practical). c. If the “other” dual-band device is not blinking Device is not within RF range of SwitchLinc. Device does not connect the phases to SwitchLinc. Relocate device if necessary (and where practical).

 

3) Press Set button once. SwitchLinc will stop beeping. SwitchLinc LED will turn white. Other device LEDs will stop blinking

 

 

Please let me know if you have any further questions . . .

[Brian H]

How does this wifi range extender, (https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1089830-REG/tp_link_tl_wa860re_300_mb_s_wi_fi.html), my powerline carrier device  in the garage door monitor.    I don't see how the wifi range extender helps the split single phase powerline carrier!

That extender is for Wi-FI and will do nothing for Insteon.

https://www.smarthome.com/insteon-2992-222-range-extender.html

 

Most homes are wired for split phase. There are two incoming Lines and Neutral.

Between either  Line and Neutral is 120 volts AC. Between both Lines is 220 Volts AC.

The Insteon Power Line signals have a hard time getting from one Line to the other Line. From one Line back all the way to the street transformer and back to the other Line. The Range Extender or any other Dual Band device also use an Insteon RF signal to get signals to the installation. I suspect the Insteon Power Line signal are not making it reliably to your garage.

[lbudler]

If you don't have any dual-band devices in your garage, then plug a Range Extender into the I/O Linc pass-through outlet.

 

Okay I looked on my system and I have no insteon dual band switches.    The only switches I have are z-wave!   I do have four insteon motion detectors which are wireless and battery powered.   Do I have to add a dual band insteon  switch to make this work?   If so where do I put it?   I notice someone has commented that I need a range extender.   Please define what kind of range extender would fix this insteon.    Most of the range extenders I find are wireless and I simply can't figure out, how a wireless range extender helps with my power line carrier garage door monitor.   ​​But as it says I am a relative newbie,   Most of my additional devices are z-wave (thermostat, water valve and light switches).   I personally have a relative bias in the z-wave simply because that is what started me.   I have really appreciated all the  help thus far!   Larry

[mwester]

Gotta ask, then:  Why use an IOLinc for the garage door?  It's a horrible choice compared to the z-wave garage door devices.  I'll let others clue you in on all the things that can go wrong with the IOLinc garage door solution.

 

The range extender is an Insteon device -- Insteon devices are sort of like z-wave devices in that they will repeat the signal they hear to other devices.  Z-wave devices do so for other z-wave devices, and Insteon devices do so for other Insteon devices.  Just like z-wave devices, battery-powered Insteon devices do NOT repeat (they sleep).  Unlike z-wave, not all Insteon devices have RF interfaces, so those older units cannot repeat the signal via RF -- one such older device is the IOLinc.  If you're having trouble getting a signal via the power-line to the IOLinc, one possible solution is to plug an Insteon range-extender (or any other plug-in newer Insteon device, such as the plug-in ON/OFF device) into the IOLinc's socket -- this will hopefully get the IOLinc working.

[lbudler]

That extender is for Wi-FI and will do nothing for Insteon.

https://www.smarthome.com/insteon-2992-222-range-extender.html

 

Most homes are wired for split phase. There are two incoming Lines and Neutral.

Between either  Line and Neutral is 120 volts AC. Between both Lines is 220 Volts AC.

The Insteon Power Line signals have a hard time getting from one Line to the other Line. From one Line back all the way to the street transformer and back to the other Line. The Range Extender or any other Dual Band device also use an Insteon RF signal to get signals to the installation. I suspect the Insteon Power Line signal are not making it reliably to your garage.

 

Define exactly what kind of range extender will work when I have no insteon dual band devices (switches).  I do under stand the concept you portraying above,  I am a EE whose background is electric utility.   I don't have much background in insteon devices and systems.

[lbudler]

Gotta ask, then:  Why use an IOLinc for the garage door?  It's a horrible choice compared to the z-wave garage door devices.  I'll let others clue you in on all the things that can go wrong with the IOLinc garage door solution.

 

The range extender is an Insteon device -- Insteon devices are sort of like z-wave devices in that they will repeat the signal they hear to other devices.  Z-wave devices do so for other z-wave devices, and Insteon devices do so for other Insteon devices.  Just like z-wave devices, battery-powered Insteon devices do NOT repeat (they sleep).  Unlike z-wave, not all Insteon devices have RF interfaces, so those older units cannot repeat the signal via RF -- one such older device is the IOLinc.  If you're having trouble getting a signal via the power-line to the IOLinc, one possible solution is to plug an Insteon range-extender (or any other plug-in newer Insteon device, such as the plug-in ON/OFF device) into the IOLinc's socket -- this will hopefully get the IOLinc working.

 

I guess I was unaware of there are zwave garage door monitors?   The insteon garage door monitor was on sale is why I bought it.   Now that I have it I am inclined to stay with if it can be made reliable at a reasonable price.    Actually I am not sure I have any problem with the power line carrier,   So far it has only screwed up once, when I was initially programing and setting up.    I somehow got two of these controls on the same device, when I removed one them, it stopped working.    I had to completely wipe and start over.   So who know how much mitigation is needed. 

[stusviews]

Okay I looked on my system and I have no insteon dual band switches.    The only switches I have are z-wave!   I do have four insteon motion detectors which are wireless and battery powered. ... Please define what kind of range extender would fix this insteon.

You must have a dual-band Insteon device or the Motion Sensors couldn't communicate with anything at all. The dual-band device that you have is the PLM. There are a couple of reasons why the I/O Linc is not receiving an Insteon signal, but I won't go into that now. The only solution is to install an Insteon dual-band device in the garage. A switch may work but an Insteon Ranger Extender plugged into the I/O Linc pass-through outlet is the best choice at this time. It must be an Insteon Range Extender because, like Z-Wave, the Insteon RF band is not WiFi.