Lost All RF Devices after PLM Replacement

[bradshawkyle]

About 18 months ago my PLM died and I replaced it following the instructions provided on the forums.  Last week, my system started acting up, I checked the PLM links table, saw it was dying again (arg) and ordered another.  I did the replacement yesterday (using a backup from July when everything was healthy) and everything came back up except the RF devices.  No big deal, I had this happen the first time, so I pulled the devices off the wall and out of the doors, put them all in programming mode, and proceeded to get error after error when trying to 'Write Updates to Device'.  I also multiple 'Restore Device' efforts and even tried writing updates when the devices were out of Programming mode. No luck at all.  I have spent 4+ hours poking around the forums , trying everything I can find, and the only sign of hope is the console can see status of each RF device (despite it needing updates) and somehow my lone TriggerLinc on my sliding door seems to have taken the update.  No idea why, and I tried replicating the steps on another device with no luck.

 

At this point, I'm about ready to nuke the entire system and start from scratch, but I though I'd try posting here to see if there are any suggestions.  I have Insteon 45 devices, so I'm not looking forward to a complete rebuild, but I'm at a point of such diminished return it's about the only other option I can come up with.  FWIW, I have a 994i running v.4.6.2.

 

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks,

-Kyle

[Brian H]

Long Shot as I have only seen this with older RF devices. Like the original RemoteLinc. Or a new Siren Module and manual linking for now as the firmware still does not support it in the ISY994i.

You may want to try one RF device.

As far away from the PLM as possible. Then try and add it. Forcing the PLM to go through the power line to another Dual Band Module to process the RF signals.

[Teken]

About 18 months ago my PLM died and I replaced it following the instructions provided on the forums.  Last week, my system started acting up, I checked the PLM links table, saw it was dying again (arg) and ordered another.  I did the replacement yesterday (using a backup from July when everything was healthy) and everything came back up except the RF devices.  No big deal, I had this happen the first time, so I pulled the devices off the wall and out of the doors, put them all in programming mode, and proceeded to get error after error when trying to 'Write Updates to Device'.  I also multiple 'Restore Device' efforts and even tried writing updates when the devices were out of Programming mode. No luck at all.  I have spent 4+ hours poking around the forums , trying everything I can find, and the only sign of hope is the console can see status of each RF device (despite it needing updates) and somehow my lone TriggerLinc on my sliding door seems to have taken the update.  No idea why, and I tried replicating the steps on another device with no luck.

 

At this point, I'm about ready to nuke the entire system and start from scratch, but I though I'd try posting here to see if there are any suggestions.  I have Insteon 45 devices, so I'm not looking forward to a complete rebuild, but I'm at a point of such diminished return it's about the only other option I can come up with.  FWIW, I have a 994i running v.4.6.2.

 

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks,

-Kyle

 

Hello Kyle,

 

If you have a ISY Series Controller Pro you have the ability to disable battery writes. When this is enabled you can update a single device instead of the system trying to update all of them in sequence. Another option which takes a considerable amount of time and may / may not work is to use the programs tab and create a new program that watches for the update to the heart beat.

 

Once it see's the heart beat the selection to *Write Update* will commence . . .

 

Please note this obviously only works on devices which have a heart beat. Older motion sensors don't along with the remote lincs. You can craft a single program to do this on one device you know has a heart beat: hidden door sensor, open-close sensor (new ones), leak sensor, etc.

 

You have nothing to lose in this regard as nothing works now so its really a matter of sweat equity and investment of time.

 

Let me know if you require more insight or feedback ~ Good luck!  

[Teken]

About 18 months ago my PLM died and I replaced it following the instructions provided on the forums.  Last week, my system started acting up, I checked the PLM links table, saw it was dying again (arg) and ordered another.  I did the replacement yesterday (using a backup from July when everything was healthy) and everything came back up except the RF devices.  No big deal, I had this happen the first time, so I pulled the devices off the wall and out of the doors, put them all in programming mode, and proceeded to get error after error when trying to 'Write Updates to Device'.  I also multiple 'Restore Device' efforts and even tried writing updates when the devices were out of Programming mode. No luck at all.  I have spent 4+ hours poking around the forums , trying everything I can find, and the only sign of hope is the console can see status of each RF device (despite it needing updates) and somehow my lone TriggerLinc on my sliding door seems to have taken the update.  No idea why, and I tried replicating the steps on another device with no luck.

 

At this point, I'm about ready to nuke the entire system and start from scratch, but I though I'd try posting here to see if there are any suggestions.  I have Insteon 45 devices, so I'm not looking forward to a complete rebuild, but I'm at a point of such diminished return it's about the only other option I can come up with.  FWIW, I have a 994i running v.4.6.2.

 

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks,

-Kyle

 

Kyle,

 

Just in case that was a typo be aware only one single battery device can be in programming mode. If you place them all into programming mode you will either cancel each one out or link them together. So ensure you only place a single device into programming mode and right mouse click and select write updates.

[Brian H]

Teken made a good point. That didn't dawn on me.

Only one RF Module being updated at a time or things go wrong.

[bradshawkyle]

This is all very helpful, thanks guys.  I did not know you could only update a single RF device at a time, somehow I missed/forgot that along the way.  I thought I was being clever by rounding them all up and trying to update at once.  Based on the suggestions above, I tried a couple things and have some follow-up questions:

• Did I corrupt or otherwise mess-up my RF devices by attempting to update them all at once?  If so, what steps need to be taken to resolve?
• I tried to move devices to the other end of the house, but no change in programming behavior. 
• I did, however, successfully program one hidden door sensor and three v.41 motion sensors.  I'm still stuck with one hidden door sensor and four motion sensors that will not accept programming.
• Of the RF devices still acting up, four of the five are showing the red exclamation point, while the fifth shows the greyed out "1011" icon.  That item is a v.41 motion sensor like all the others, BTW.
• I also am experiencing various dimmers falling off (showing the red exclamation point) and coming back after an air gap and restore.
• I can see status change on all devices when tapping the programming button or pressing the door sensor closed.
• Thanks Teken, for the suggestion about upgrading to Pro.  I had decided it wasn't for me based on the number of nodes and devices, but it sounds like there are other benefits. The option to disable battery writes could have given me back about an hour of my life over the past day, which would have been nice.   I see a $30 upgrade via the Admin console to purchase a module, and what appears to be a hardware upgrade on the UDI website for $122, which would I need to run Pro on my 994i?

Any other thoughts or suggestions?  Again, thanks for the help.

-k

[Teken]

Hello Kyle,

 

Honestly the most direct route is to delete the battery operated devices from the controller. Next hard reset them per the full users manual. Once complete add back one single device until all are enrolled back to the system.

 

RE: Pro -> normally the pro comes with the IR module and increases the programs etc. If there is actually a choice to just upgrade to pro without the IR and you don't need it $30.00 is indeed the best value.

 

Your call as to what makes sense long term.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[bradshawkyle]

Thanks again for the support, I have self-taught myself through the the past 3 1/2 years (originally built my system as a DIY security system, which later evolved into lighting and HVAC automation) and this is the first time I have needed help from the experts. That said, maybe I should have gotten help sooner and saved myself some time.

 

Good News: All my devices are back up and running, no devices require updates!

Not-so-good-news: I really don't understand why.  As a reminder, I had 5 RF devices that would not accept an update, even after a factory reset and a "Restore Device" command.  I upgraded to Pro per Teken's advice and disabled battery writes (which is awesome, BTW), and deleted my first motion detector from the controller and performed a factory reset.  Added it back to the controller and programs and it worked perfectly.  Then, because I'm equal parts curious and lazy, I put the next device in programming mode and tried one last time to write updates and viola! Worked perfectly.  I updated the remaining motion detectors and hidden door sensor with no further difficulty, and did not have to delete + re-add them, saving me a bunch of time.

 

Again, I'm not sure why this approach worked, but it did and I guess that's the most important thing.  I was running the latest firmware and had experienced no issues with the controller or system functionality until my PLM did what PLMs do and crapped out.  Bottom line is this system rocks, my wife and kids don't know how to turn on lights or arm the alarm because it does everything for them.  I have managed to create HVAC, Lighting and security functionality that responds to actions and presence of the people in my house, rather than being directly controlled by them.  I am once again a happy camper.  My only wish is for Insteon to figure out how to make a PLM that doesn't suck after 18-24 months.....

 

Thanks again!

-k

[Brian H]

In the mostly bad reviews for the 2413S PLM on Smarthome web site.

They replied saying a component was identified as a possible issue and was changed to a better one at V2.3.

I know the RS232 chip on the serial daughter board was changed and the capacitors again where changed to ones with a higher voltage in the power supply. That now are mounted parallel to the main board and component glued. As they are too large to fit vertically on the board.

Personally I would have ratter seen them spend a few extra cents for a known brand switching supply capacitor.

[Teken]

Thanks again for the support, I have self-taught myself through the the past 3 1/2 years (originally built my system as a DIY security system, which later evolved into lighting and HVAC automation) and this is the first time I have needed help from the experts. That said, maybe I should have gotten help sooner and saved myself some time.

 

Good News: All my devices are back up and running, no devices require updates!

Not-so-good-news: I really don't understand why.  As a reminder, I had 5 RF devices that would not accept an update, even after a factory reset and a "Restore Device" command.  I upgraded to Pro per Teken's advice and disabled battery writes (which is awesome, BTW), and deleted my first motion detector from the controller and performed a factory reset.  Added it back to the controller and programs and it worked perfectly.  Then, because I'm equal parts curious and lazy, I put the next device in programming mode and tried one last time to write updates and viola! Worked perfectly.  I updated the remaining motion detectors and hidden door sensor with no further difficulty, and did not have to delete + re-add them, saving me a bunch of time.

 

Again, I'm not sure why this approach worked, but it did and I guess that's the most important thing.  I was running the latest firmware and had experienced no issues with the controller or system functionality until my PLM did what PLMs do and crapped out.  Bottom line is this system rocks, my wife and kids don't know how to turn on lights or arm the alarm because it does everything for them.  I have managed to create HVAC, Lighting and security functionality that responds to actions and presence of the people in my house, rather than being directly controlled by them.  I am once again a happy camper.  My only wish is for Insteon to figure out how to make a PLM that doesn't suck after 18-24 months.....

 

Thanks again!

-k

 

Hello Kyle,

 

For the benefit of others when you have time can you provide us the production date of the new 2413S PLM and what the ISY Series Controller indicates as the firmware in use for that device? The hardware revision and production date is on the back of the 2413S PLM. Glad everything is up and running ~ ensure you make a good back up and store it in a few places: USB Drive, Network Drive, Cloud Drive.