apostolakisl Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 Do you have other Insteon dual band devices besides the PLM? Having a mesh of dual band devices (switchlincs and lamplincs being most common) will greatly increase com reliability, especially having one fairly close to the thermostat (thermostat is only RF so it needs a radio fairly close by). Also, could there be some appliance/device that runs in the morning that is putting noise into your system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tango Posted January 7, 2018 Author Share Posted January 7, 2018 All my Insteon devices: - 2 thermostats - PLM - I/O Linc for the garage door - In-wall Light dimmerAnd that's it. I've looked over timing to see if something could be creating problems in the morning. It's possible my wife might use the microwave in the morning, but I question whether she'd be using it every morning just at the time commands are being sent - I doubt that exact a consistency and know she doesn't use it much for breakfast.Do you use Insteon only, or Insteon and Z-Wave or other systems as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oberkc Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 That is not a lot of insteon devices, and the IOLInc is, certainly, not dual band (I don't know if the thermostats repeat commands and can be used for phase bridging.) I certainly wonder whether you have good communications between the legs of your electrical system. Have you ever performed the phase bridge test? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tango Posted January 7, 2018 Author Share Posted January 7, 2018 That is not a lot of insteon devices, and the IOLInc is, certainly, not dual band (I don't know if the thermostats repeat commands and can be used for phase bridging.) I certainly wonder whether you have good communications between the legs of your electrical system. Have you ever performed the phase bridge test? No. We moved in during late September, had a wedding here about 10 days later and since then I've been working non-stop on all the little things. It took me weeks before I could even install the Insteon thermostats. (It's a new house and I was very intimately involved in the construction and site work - there's still a lot to do, like filling in trenches, landscaping, erosion prevention, and so on.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apostolakisl Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 You should get yourself maybe 4 lamplincs. Even if you don't have any lamps, they make great repeaters and can be bought for $25 pretty easily. SH just had them on sale, 2 for 1, maybe still do. I would put one of the lamplincs close to each of your thermostats (like within 25 feet) and the other two I would put fairly close to your plm, makeing sure you have at least one of them on the leg of power that your PLM is not on. You could of course do the similar thing with switchlincs, but of course that requires installation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apostolakisl Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 I have been looking at making a program that tracks how fast the furnace is heating things up. This would be a useful parameter as to whether you need aux heat. I have not tested this program, but I believe it will tell you how much the temp changed every 10 minutes. The answer would be a negative number. So if it went from 65 to 68, then it would be -3. This is completed untested, so I may have missed something, but here it is anyway. hvac speed - [iD 0083][Parent 0082] hvac speed - [ID 0083][Parent 0082] If 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall / 39.3C.E2 - Heat Ctl' is switched On And 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall / 39.3C.E2 - Heat Ctl' is not switched Off Then Set 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Query Wait 10 seconds $i.temp.progress2 = 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Temperature ° Wait 10 minutes Repeat Every 10 minutes Set 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Query Wait 10 seconds $i.temp.progress1 = $i.temp.progress2 $i.temp.progress2 = 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Temperature ° $i.temp.progress1 -= 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Temperature ° $s.temp.difference = $i.temp.progress1 Else $s.temp.difference = -1000 (something out of range so that it for changes after the first 10 minutes to trigger the next program) turn off aux heat For example, you want to see at least 1 degree every 10 minutes, or if it is below 20 outside when it flips on aux tirgger - [ID 0085][Parent 0082] If ( 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall / 39.3C.E2 - Heat Ctl' is switched On And $i.Outdoor.Temperature < 20 ) Or ( $s.temp.difference > -1 And $i.Outdoor.Temperature < 40 ) Then turn on aux heat Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrojanHorse Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 Tango, You say 40% of your Insteon install is thermostats? In my book that equates to 100% frustration. Insteon Thermostats are junk, I hate to say it. In my opinion their switches are good. I wouldn’t abandon Insteon based on their thermostats. You asked a question that I will ask again of the forum - what thermostats, Z wave or other, are good options with the ISY? Personally I’m interested to hear any good options since one of my five-year-old “stand-alone with WiFi” Honeywell thermostats appears to be starting to die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrojanHorse Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 I have been looking at making a program that tracks how fast the furnace is heating things up. This would be a useful parameter as to whether you need aux heat. I have not tested this program, but I believe it will tell you how much the temp changed every 10 minutes. The answer would be a negative number. So if it went from 65 to 68, then it would be -3. This is completed untested, so I may have missed something, but here it is anyway. hvac speed - [ID 0083][Parent 0082] If 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall / 39.3C.E2 - Heat Ctl' is switched On And 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall / 39.3C.E2 - Heat Ctl' is not switched Off Then Set 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Query Wait 10 seconds $i.temp.progress2 = 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Temperature ° Wait 10 minutes Repeat Every 10 minutes Set 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Query Wait 10 seconds $i.temp.progress1 = $i.temp.progress2 $i.temp.progress2 = 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Temperature ° $i.temp.progress1 -= 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Temperature ° $s.temp.difference = $i.temp.progress1 Else turn off aux heat $s.temp.difference = 10000 (something out of range so that it for changes after the first 10 minutes to trigger the next program) For example, if you wanted to trigger aux heat if the temp didn't go up by at least one degree, you would say aux tirgger - [ID 0085][Parent 0082] If $s.temp.difference > -1 Then - turn on aux heat Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') apostolakisl, your programs are interesting. Do they require V5x? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apostolakisl Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 apostolakisl, your programs are interesting. Do they require V5x? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk No, this should all be in older versions. Please note, I made some changes to it while you were composing your post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apostolakisl Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 Watching my above programs run. It looks good. On this program, I realized you would also want to include that there is a significant difference between set temp and actual temp before turning on Aux heat. So added one new program to track the difference and added a new condition to the aux heat activation. Below measures the difference between actual and set and puts into a variable every time the actual temp or set temp changes. temp dif from set - [ID 0086][Parent 0082] If 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Temperature is not -50.0° Or 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Heat Setpoint is not 0° Then $i.temp.dif.from.set = 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Heat Setpoint ° $i.temp.dif.from.set -= 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall' Temperature ° Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') Now the change to the aux activation program. aux tirgger - [ID 0085][Parent 0082] If $i.temp.dif.from.set > 3 And ( ( 'HVAC Mt. Tabor / Mt. Tabor-Hall-Back Wall / 39.3C.E2 - Heat Ctl' is switched On And $i.Outdoor.Temperature < 20 ) Or ( $s.temp.change.last.10.minutes > -1 And $i.Outdoor.Temperature < 40 ) ) Then turn on aux heat Else turn off aux heat $s.temp.difference = -10000 (something out of range so that it for changes after the first 10 minutes to trigger the next program) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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