Remote control of 240v garage heater?

[windrockwater]

Not sure if this is a good place for this post but here goes....

Currently i am insulating and finishing off my detached 2 car garage. I am going to install a 240 volt electric space heater on the ceiling. My entire house and garage are already filled with Insteon Switches that i program and control with the ISY. Love it.

I would love some remote control ability of the garage heater so i can easily turn it on/off from inside the house. To warm up the garage workshop ahead of walking out to it. 

I see there used to be an Insteon 240 load center. But its no longer available.Kind of clueless as to my options for this. Any ideas/suggestions?

[epfunke]

You can use just about any insteon switch to turn on an appropriately sized contactor to turn on your heat.  Just choose a contactor that has a 120v coil 

 

I have just that setup on my shop dust collector.  Mounted the micro module right in large junction box with contactor.  works like a charm

[Brian H]

ELK makes an ELK9200 240VAC control in an electrical box. Has a 120VAC power cord on it and you can control it with a On/Off module.

A 120VAC contractor and Insteon relay type switch or plug in module as pointed out. Could be another good way to go.

[io_guy]

I use an Aube RC840T-240 hanging off the side of my electrical panel.  It can be controlled by any dry contact relay (such as an IOLinc) since it has a built-in 24V transformer to power it's contactor. 

[Brian H]

2 hours ago, io_guy said:

I use an Aube RC840T-240 hanging off the side of my electrical panel.  It can be controlled by any dry contact relay (such as an IOLinc) since it has a built-in 24V transformer to power it's contactor. 

That sounds like a very good choice. It is made for controlling 240VAC heating units and has 24VAC control built in.

[windrockwater]

On 10/27/2020 at 7:36 AM, io_guy said:

I use an Aube RC840T-240 hanging off the side of my electrical panel.  It can be controlled by any dry contact relay (such as an IOLinc) since it has a built-in 24V transformer to power it's contactor. 

I will trying to install the Aube that you suggested on the Farenheat Electric Garage heater . I also like the idea of using the IOlink. I currently have one on the garage door opener that works well.

Can you provide any tips/tricks/directions for wiring the Aube - Heater - IO Linc? Seems like a winner.

[io_guy]

The contacts on the Aube just need to be closed to enable it.  Connect the two lines across a relay of the IOLinc.

[Brian H]

Use the R and W terminals of the AUBE and connect to the NO and Common relay output terminals. If you used NC and Common then the heat would normally be on and off when you turned On the relay in the IO/Linc

The C terminal on the AUBE is not used in this case. It could provide power to a thermostat that used the 24VAC common for power.

[windrockwater]

Thanks both. Will monkey with this shortly when the heater gets installed. Running the wiring to start.

[windrockwater]

So now i am waffling between connecting the AUBE to an Ecobee thermstat or connecting the Aube to an Insteon ioLinc.  My goal is to create a way that i can turn on the electric heater in the garage when i want to work in there (we currently use Alexa to control our insteon devices which is wonderful...so, saying something like "Alexa turn on the garage heater for an hour").

But i want to make it where the heater will always 'timeout' and turn itself off in case i forget to turn it off. Almost like putting it on a timer switch.  Basically if I or my wife forget to turn it off, i don't want it running endlessly and driving up huge electric bills.

So i suppose if i use the ioLinc then i can create a program in the ISY to check if its on every hour and if so then turn it off? Or something like that? But then there would be no thermostat. Which might be okay.

Thoughts?

[epfunke]

If you go the route of the iolink control, I would at least have an old school thermostat in line with the heater, set to your desired temperature.  save energy by not overheating the room, and if something failed and the iolink did not turn off at least the themostat would limit the room temperature to a nominal temp and not a runaway temperature.

 

 

[simplextech]

41 minutes ago, windrockwater said:

So now i am waffling between connecting the AUBE to an Ecobee thermstat or connecting the Aube to an Insteon ioLinc.  My goal is to create a way that i can turn on the electric heater in the garage when i want to work in there (we currently use Alexa to control our insteon devices which is wonderful...so, saying something like "Alexa turn on the garage heater for an hour").

But i want to make it where the heater will always 'timeout' and turn itself off in case i forget to turn it off. Almost like putting it on a timer switch.  Basically if I or my wife forget to turn it off, i don't want it running endlessly and driving up huge electric bills.

So i suppose if i use the ioLinc then i can create a program in the ISY to check if its on every hour and if so then turn it off? Or something like that? But then there would be no thermostat. Which might be okay.

Thoughts?

Why not use a Thermostat that works with 240v electric heating?

[windrockwater]

2 minutes ago, epfunke said:

If you go the route of the iolink control, I would at least have an old school thermostat in line with the heater, set to your desired temperature.  save energy by not overheating the room, and if something failed and the iolink did not turn off at least the themostat would limit the room temperature to a nominal temp and not a runaway temperature.

 

 

I like this thinking.

 

I understand most thermostats will kick on and start at a set base temp. However, i do not want this heater going on unless i tell it to go on. There will be many below freezing days that i do not want it to turn on. So i am not sure a thermostat can do that for me? 

[epfunke]

If you connect the output of the contactor (controlled by iolinc)to the input of the thermostat (can be old school mechanical) and the output of the thermostat to the heater....

 

In order for the Heater to receive power,  1.  The contactor controlled by iolinc must be on.  AND  the room has to be below your set temperature.  

 

This configuration will only apply power when you want it, and the room is actually cold enough to need heat

 

 

[windrockwater]

1 hour ago, epfunke said:

If you connect the output of the contactor (controlled by iolinc)to the input of the thermostat (can be old school mechanical) and the output of the thermostat to the heater....

 

In order for the Heater to receive power,  1.  The contactor controlled by iolinc must be on.  AND  the room has to be below your set temperature.  

 

This configuration will only apply power when you want it, and the room is actually cold enough to need heat

 

 

Makes sense. May i ask what type of thermostat you suggest? Do you mean any old one like this?

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Honeywell-Home-Horizontal-Non-Programmable-Thermostat-with-Digital-Backlit-Display-RTH111B/203539510

[epfunke]

It is my understanding that your heater is a 240 electric heater.  so you will need a line voltage thermostat like https://www.homedepot.com/p/Cadet-Double-Pole-22-Amp-120-Volt-240-Volt-Wall-Mount-Mechanical-Non-programmable-Thermostat-in-White-T522-W/303733757

does the heater have a built in thermostat?  what is the model of your heater

 

[windrockwater]

12 minutes ago, epfunke said:

It is my understanding that your heater is a 240 electric heater.  so you will need a line voltage thermostat like https://www.homedepot.com/p/Cadet-Double-Pole-22-Amp-120-Volt-240-Volt-Wall-Mount-Mechanical-Non-programmable-Thermostat-in-White-T522-W/303733757

does the heater have a built in thermostat?  what is the model of your heater

 

It is a Farenheat Electric one. I bought the Aube thing since its a low voltage to 240 contactor (? might be getting terms confused). I believe i can simply wire the Aube direct to the i/o Linc (or an Ecobee for example). Basically the I/O link triggers the Aube which then turns on the heater.

[epfunke]

just looked at the aube unit.  that has the 24volt transformer built in.  so you can use that themostat you quoted, and hook that between the iolinc and the aube.

 

Aube low voltage side (screw terminals) W to IOlinc Common,  IOlink NO  to thermostat W,  Thermostat R to aube R.

thermostat and heat active when the IOlinc is on

Then connect the heater to the 240 side of the aube as labled on the device

 

 

[windrockwater]

39 minutes ago, epfunke said:

just looked at the aube unit.  that has the 24volt transformer built in.  so you can use that themostat you quoted, and hook that between the iolinc and the aube.

 

Aube low voltage side (screw terminals) W to IOlinc Common,  IOlink NO  to thermostat W,  Thermostat R to aube R.

thermostat and heat active when the IOlinc is on

Then connect the heater to the 240 side of the aube as labled on the device

 

 

Thank you. That makes sense (in print at least). I shall see how it goes in practice! Cheers.

[agoltz]

I use this - its the same as the old 240V Insteon controller

 

https://innovativehomesys.com/collections/b-wired-in-devices/products/heavy-duty-120-277v-insteon-load-controller-assembly-1470

 

 

[windrockwater]

Got everything wired up and so far so good!  Thanks for the tips.  The ioLinc is controlling the Aube which is turning the electric heater on and off.

Now i can try use the ISY to create a program to operate the iOLinc. Specifically, i want the heater to automatically turn itself off after a period of time. My concern is that i forget i turned it on and it runs for days before i notice and has a huge electric bill. So, i am thinking of a program that just sends an OFF command to the iOlinc every 2-4 hours or so? 

Right now you enter the garage and click the little 'set' button on the ioLink to turn the heater on (or tell Alexa to turn it on). So then the ISY program would turn it off on some repeating cycle. And if i am in there and still want the heater on, i just click the ioLinc again.  At least thats my idea....I also have an extra motionlinc so i suppose the OFF program could delay itself if it has senses motion?  Seems like a few ways to skin this cat....

[Brian H]

Thank you for the update. Good to see it is functioning OK.

This is from an I/OLinc Hardware Revision V2.3, firmware 41. If yours is newer it could be different.

On mine pushing the Set button to toggle the relay. Does not send a signal back to the ISY994i. So it will have no idea you used the local Set Button. To trigger any program.

[windrockwater]

3 hours ago, Brian H said:

Thank you for the update. Good to see it is functioning OK.

This is from an I/OLinc Hardware Revision V2.3, firmware 41. If yours is newer it could be different.

On mine pushing the Set button to toggle the relay. Does not send a signal back to the ISY994i. So it will have no idea you used the local Set Button. To trigger any program.

I think you are correct about the i/oLinc. I am still considering how to set this up. I could also swap out the i/olinc with an Ecobee which i use in the rest my house. But i would prefer to have the heater function ON/OFF instead of using the thermostat function of the Ecobee.  I sort of want it to work like a bathroom fan timer (but with remote control ability).