Communication failures on a fairly large install

[Thom]

I have 57 devices installed, a combination of switchlincs, kepadlincs, lampLincs and applianceLincs.

 

The house is new. There is a main circuit panel on the outside of the house that feeds 4 panels inside the house. One of the panels has nothing but AC equipment another has another AC plus a few new circuits with switchlincs that I just installed.. I have 4 access points, and I believe that I have them on each phase of the main two panels inside the house.

 

Most of my automation works most of the time. But whenever the ISY boots or when I do a query of My Lighting. I get communication failures. A few circuits fail more than other, but if I query twice in a row, I am likely to get different results. When a device fails to communicate, I can usually turn it on and off several times from the admin console and get it communicating (for a while).

 

I tried moving the ISY to a different location in the house on a different circuit. No difference.

Moving the access points around has improved reliability some what.. I am down from 4 or 5 devices failing to communicate on a query of My Lighting to 1 or 2.

 

When I do a query on my lighting, and I get a communication failure, I can go to that device and query it individually and it will work. Right now I have a lamplinc in my bathroom that is turned on by a timer. It always turns on correctly, but often appears as a communication failure. It always responds correctly to an individual query.

 

I have some devices that appear to be working, but I cannot add them to a scene. I get a failure report. Often, if I wait, the device will go into the scene without a problem.

 

Today, I attempted to swap a switchlinc and a keypadlinc. I could wire in the switchlinc, and it would work. I could then wire in the keypadlinc, and it was not recognized by the ISY, either linking or add a new device.

 

So, it seems that whatever I do, it is a crap shoot. It may work, and it may not.

[MikeB]

Hey Thom -

 

Sounds like your Insteon communication is just a bit shaky.

 

Do you have AccessPoints installed to bridge your phases? If you do, throw one on top of your PLM (then make sure the other one is still on an opposite phase).

 

If you don't have AccessPoints, you should purchase 2 or 3 and install them. I'd personally go with 3 (2 to bridge your phases, the 3rd to throw on the PLM).

[Thom]

I have 4 access points right now on different phases of different panels. I am considering adding a couple of receptacles right where the service comes into the house. I think that two of the access points right there would have the most effect.

 

I have been talking to another user who had a similar set of problems. He believes that I am having noise issues and recommends some filterlincs and Leviton Noise filters.

That makes sense, I did a couple of experiments. It seems that turning on an LED TV increase the failure rate. I went from the rare case of zero failures on a my lighting query to 4 or 5 when my wife cranked up the TV and some other electronics.

I may have found the clue.

[MikeB]

Yeah, I'm sure FilterLincs in the right place would help. BUT - be sure to throw one of your AccessPoints onto your PLM as well.

 

If you don't already have one there, that change alone might be enough to overcome any noise issues.

 

Please let me know your results.

[Thom]

Thanks again Mike, I already have one Access point on the PLM.

 

I had a good talk with Steve Lee this morning.

 

My house and equipment were specifically designed to interfere with Insteon signals.

 

I have UPSes and Monster power strips on all my electronics, and I have a lot of computers and electronic equipment. Those act as sinks for the Insteon signals. Steve describes them as black holes sucking up the signals.

I have a large numbers of low voltage lights. Any one of those transformers could generate a lot of noise.

I have a bunch of fluorescent fixtures. Any one of the ballasts could be interfering.

I have two whole house electrostatic air cleaners that could be injecting noise.

 

The house would have been a disaster for X10. It is a testimony to Insteon that it is working as well as it is.

 

I have ordered a pile of filterlincs. I am going to hope that the electronics are what is pushing the system over the edge. That is the easiest to fix. After that, it is a matter of shutting down parts of the house and seeing if reliability changes. Installing the noise filters would be more of a pain.

 

Thom

[MikeB]

Hey Thom -

 

Good luck! There is hope. I may not have as many as you, but I have surge strips everywhere, 5 UPSs throughout the house, a Monster line conditioner, a dozen or so CFLs, a bunch of fluorescents, 9 PCs, a bunch of servers, outdoor low voltage landscape lighting, etc.... and my reliability has been great.

 

Once I got a decent amount of Insteon installed my reliability has been almost perfect. I had ONE KPL that intermittently did not receive a command, and it turned out to be a cheap surge strip causing noise on my line. Go figure. I ended up just ditching and replacing it.

 

I do have a few FilterLincs installed in key places "just in case".

 

Good luck, and please let us know how you make out.

[linuxguy]

Thom,

 

Just want to add a testimonial to the success of FilterLinc's. I have about 30 devices and had severe comm problems. I recently found my Verizon Fios box and the associated Verizon wireless router were putting out a ton of noise. Feeding them with a FilterLinc changed my comm success rate from about 1% to about 99%. I have now ordered more FilterLinc's, and am going to put the squeeze on that last 1%.

 

Linuxguy