Controlling Insteon I/O Module with Change of State with of Go-Control Z-Wave Thermostat

[Tom Carmody]

I have a Go Control Model Model #GC-TBZ48 that I installed on my eisy network and it works beautifully.  I have a simple program to turn on an Insteon I/O Module when the Heat/Cool State changes from Idle to Heating.  Here's the If/then statement: If Thermostat Heat/Cool State is "Heating", then Set I/O Relay "On"  

I have another program that turns off the I/O Module.  After the thermostat reaches it's set point the state changes to "Pending Heat" and then a few minutes later the state is switches over to "Idle".  Here's the If/then statement: If Thermostat Heat/Cool State is "Idle" or "Pending Heat", the Set I/O Relay "Off".

It works great unless the time it takes for the thermostat takes longer than 10 to 20 minutes.  If it takes longer than just going up a degree or two, out of the blue, the I/O Module receives a command to turn "Off".  I can't figure out why.  The amount of time is somewhat random.  Sometimes it's 10 minutes and other times, it's different.  

I have a second thermostat that has a similar program and it's controlling an Insteon ON/Off Module.  It doesn't have the same problem.

I have attached two screen-shots of my Event Viewer on one PNG file.  The top shot is the second thermostat.  It was a successful operation when the setpoint was reached.  The bottom shot shows the error.  The ZY037 was not yet up to set point and 2:13:07PM, something happened to trigger the I/O Module (Insteon: 15.BC,3F).

Is there a better way to write the program?  If so, why do I not get an error on the "On/Off" Module?.

I'm not a Z-wave expert and I have no idea what 80& of it means.

Thanks for any input.

 

[IndyMike]

Hello @Tom Carmody,

I looked up the installation instructions for your GC-TBZ48.  The thermostat is completely capable of controlling the Furnace heat/cool cycles through it's hardwired interface.  Since you are trying to control the appliance (Heat/Cool) using Insteon, I am assuming that you are using the GC-TBZ48 in battery mode with no hardwired interface to the appliance. 

PLEASE DO NOT DO THIS - There are many failure modes that can erroneously turn your appliance off or (Worse) turn it on and leave it on.

It sounds like you are using a Insteon 2450 I/O Linc to activate the appliance.  The 2450 is a powerline only device (not dual band) that is susceptible to erroneous turn on/off (search spontaneous All-On).  

There is no automation device that I would trust for this application.  Please run the wiring, and install the thermostat as it was designed to be used.

I'll apologize in advance if I'm incorrect in my assumptions above.  Please post back and clarify if that is the case.

IM

[Tom Carmody]

I came online to update my post and found your reply.  Thanks for your response.  I'm not using batteries with my thermostat and the purpose for the I/O module is to turn on an additional wall heater when the main heater is on.  The I/O module was working beautifully with the old Insteon thermostat, so I gave it a try.   The update I came online to make was that I found the culprit.  I assumed there was something in the thermostat that was causing the premature command to off.  Among other features, what the Go Control thermostat does that the Insteon thermostat doesn't do, is report a change in temperature measurement with each degree. I had a secondary program that used an else statement and in the if statement, I had, If temperature >75 degrees and the wall heater was on to turn off the I/O module.  Since the Z-wave sends a temperature our with each change, the else statement picked it up, since it was under 75 degrees and shut off the I/O Module.  The Insteon Thermostat wouldn't trigger it for being under 75 degrees.  It was a bad program and I have deleted it and found a better way to prevent using the wall heater when it's above 75 degrees. 

Thanks, again.

[IndyMike]

Glad to hear that you are not using the IOLinc to operate your furnace. 

Hopefully, your wall heater has over temperature protection. 

Please do consider the consequences of the heater being left on due to a communication error, or activating without the EISY knowing about it (All-on phenomena).  This can be mitigated to a degree by polling the IOlinc regularly to test for an uncommanded on condition.

 

[GSpitale01]

On 2/16/2024 at 9:07 AM, IndyMike said:

Hello @Tom Carmody,

I looked up the installation instructions for your GC-TBZ48.  The thermostat is completely capable of controlling the Furnace heat/cool cycles through it's hardwired interface.  Since you are trying to control the appliance (Heat/Cool) using Insteon, I am assuming that you are using the GC-TBZ48 in battery mode with no hardwired interface to the appliance. 

PLEASE DO NOT DO THIS - There are many failure modes that can erroneously turn your appliance off or (Worse) turn it on and leave it on.

It sounds like you are using a Insteon 2450 I/O Linc to activate the appliance.  The 2450 is a powerline only device (not dual band) that is susceptible to erroneous turn on/off (search spontaneous All-On).  

There is no automation device that I would trust for this application.  Please run the wiring, and install the thermostat as it was designed to be used.

I'll apologize in advance if I'm incorrect in my assumptions above.  Please post back and clarify if that is the case.

IM

I'm interested in learning more about the 2450 behavior mentioned here, but my searches here don't return anything.  Can you point me to any resources on this spontaneous activation?

[Brian H]

Here is one I found.

It is a common issue with the I/OLinc as it was not updated (as far as I know) to remove the All On response.

https://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/42728-garage-door-opens-unexpectedly/page/2/#comment-379116