Pre-purchase application questions

[kpfeif]

Hello.

 

I'm nearing the end of building out my basement area. and it's time for the fun - the electronics. I'm considering adding some home automation in the house, and I'd like to smart small and grow. The ISY-99i looks very interesting.

 

I'd like you to tell me if Insteon and the ISY-99i are a good solution for me.

 

1. Home Theatre lighting. I'll first have two banks of lights that I want to control via an infrared remote control - a Logitech Harmony. I want to trigger scenes, etc., from that remote.

 

2. In addition to the remote, I'd like a keypad on the wall that controls the scenes, as well. From what I understand, this Insteon keypad will control its "local" lights via the internal dimmer, as well as the scenes, etc. of other dimmers.

 

3. Upstairs, near the top of the stairs, I want a keypad that will control the lights downstairs - "All Off", etc. The switch I'd replace is a 3-way switch that controls the lights going downstairs. It's counterpart is at the bottom of the stairs. While this keypad will only be able to control the 3 sets of lights - the 2 home theatre banks and the stairs - someday I'll expand the lights that I can control downstairs. I may even want to do trigger the thermostat down there to turn down (using a future Insteon thermostat).

 

4. I want to have a bedsite keypad in our bedroom that tells us the status of the 2 garage doors via its LED lights. If they're open, I'd trigger them to close (or get up and go close them, probably the safer option).

 

5. In the future, I want to have insteon dimmers on our hall/path lighting upstairs. I'll have motion detectors in these areas, so if somebody gets up AND it's DARK out, the lights will come on very faintly. After a certain amount of time, they'll fade back to off...

 

6. Water detection...I'd like, in the future, to trigger some sort of even if there's water detected in the basement - email, SMS message, etc. I'm not sure if there are water detection systems out there, but I'd like it to happen.

 

What would I purchase to being? The ISY-99i, a PLM, a phase-coupler, and, at first, the 4 Insteon switches (one for each bank of home theatre lights, 2 for the 3-way stairs lights). Anything else?

 

Thanks,

Kris

[LeeG]

Kris

 

One – I’m sure this can be done but I’ll leave this to someone who has experience with IR stuff.

Two – Correct. Since you are planning a dimmer here, be sure of the load type. Incandescent loads are the type Smarthome supports. Some CFLs will dim to some degree. Some CFLs and low voltage lights should not be dimmed. Also some CFLs generate noise on the powerline which interferes with powerline communication.

Three – keep in mind that both switches in a 3 way circuit must be insteon. One can be a KeypadLinc, one can be a SwitchLinc (or ICON). They do not have to be the same type of Insteon device and only the load control device needs to be a dimmer.

Four – I have this arrangement with my garage doors. I can close them from the KeypadLinc.

Five – Easily done with the ISY.

Six – the only problem with water detection is the water sensor itself. Smarthome had a water sensor that was unreliable and withdrew it. I feel certain a reliable sensor can be found.

 

The ISY PLM will likely be a Dual Band device which has the ability to send/receive RF as well as powerline. In theory that means only one other Dual Band device is needed to accomplish 120V leg coupling. However, I recommend using 2 Access Points for coupling in addition to any other Dual Band devices you may have.

 

For the initial install you can probably start without an ISY and do the device linking manually. However, if the budget allows I recommend including an ISY from the beginning because of the device link management capability that can be done from a computer when an ISY is available. It is a great device which you will find more and more uses for as your Insteon usage grows.

 

Pick up a couple of FilterLincs. Devices such as UPSs and PCs may have power supplies which attenuate Insteon signals, particularly where the ISY PLM will be plugged in. Other devices such as some cell phone charges, flat screen TVs, etc can generate noise on the powerline that interferes with Insteon signals. FilterLincs are inexpensive compared to the total Insteon investment and are worth having on hand to resolve powerline issues.

 

Lee

[oberkc]

one - I (and many here) have done this. I don't believe harmony has built-in insteon RF signals (unless recently added) so this leave a couple of options....X-10 signals to the ISY, use one of the insteon IR receivers and learn one of the harmony codes, or make sure you get the ISY-99IR. This works well. This will be no problem.

[jtara92101]

2. If you have the space, I'd recommend not using the built-in dimmer on KeypadLincs in rooms with multiple independent loads. It complicates and restricts scene set-up and the ability to fade the entire scene up or down. But I have done this where I simply didn't have room for another switch.

 

For example, in my bathrooms, I can only fit a 4-gang, because that is all the space there is between the studs at the switch location near the door.

 

It's kinda annoying that Smarthome doesn't make reduced-cost KPLs and SWLs with just the switch(s) and no dimmer...

 

So, I have a KPL whose dimmer controls a track light. Next position is a Switchlinc on/off to control the fan, then a SWL for the light over the sink, and a SWL for the shower light. I have shower and shave scenes assigned to A and B. The big "on" button activates a "dramatic" scene, so when guests hit the big on button they get hit with the wow factor - track up, everything else low. (Which includes a framing projector illuminating the square lav basin, and framing projectors illuminating two prints.) D on every KPL in the house indicates on the LED if there are lights on in other parts of the house. Pressing D turns off all of the "other lights".

 

To balance the lights for a scene, I need to first set the track level to where I want it, and then adjust the other lights. This is because the level of the ON button controls BOTH the level of the track AND the over-all level of the scene. In tandem. I need to make sure that I've used appropriate wattages in the track fixtures so that I have some headroom to adjust the scene up or down. (I then read the values from the isy99 control panel, and set those values in the scene.)

 

It's a lot easier of you just don't use the dimmer on the KPL. So, in my kitchen, bedroom, and office, each has a KPL where the load isn't used. Bedroom for example has a KPL, SWL for track, SWL for overhead, and a Lamplinc plugged into the wall for a floor lamp.

 

Kitchen has 6 switches in two locations. I mean, a 6-gang would have been ridiculous! So, loadless KPL, perimeter, overhead, island in a 4-gang at the entrance. Countertop and in-cabinet lighting along with an outlet in a 3-gang on the other side of the room above the counter. Kitchen has a default scene on the big on button, plus cooking, eating, reading scenes (I sometimes read at the island.)

 

If it's not too late, provide enough gangs for a loadless KPL in each room.

 

The isy99 makes creating complex scenes much easier, but I have to say it is not a snap. It can be a painful, slow process. There's a "pro" upgrade that "batches" commands when you change a whole bunch of stuff at once, and, frankly I find the fact that that's an extra cost pretty annoying. It's a ploy to extract more money from installers, because as a practical matter, they HAVE to have that upgrade, because not having it is going to cost them mucho bucks in their time. Without the pro option (which I don't have) you spend a lot of time waiting for the Control Panel to program the switches after every little change that you make. There's no rational reason for the upgrade fee for this, other than to extract the extra bucks from the installers. It's really just the way the software ought to work in the first place!

 

That said, the isy is an essential accessory, IMO, for any Insteon installation that goes beyond simple three-way switches and VERY simple room scenes. It is VERY painful to set-up using just the switches themselves. But you'd get some good exercise running around the house tap-taping buttons!

[Sub-Routine]

You have some great ideas jtara92101.

 

One point I wish to differ on is the Pro upgrade.

 

.

 

The isy99 makes creating complex scenes much easier, but I have to say it is not a snap. It can be a painful, slow process. There's a "pro" upgrade that "batches" commands when you change a whole bunch of stuff at once, and, frankly I find the fact that that's an extra cost pretty annoying. It's a ploy to extract more money from installers, because as a practical matter, they HAVE to have that upgrade, because not having it is going to cost them mucho bucks in their time. Without the pro option (which I don't have) you spend a lot of time waiting for the Control Panel to program the switches after every little change that you make. There's no rational reason for the upgrade fee for this, other than to extract the extra bucks from the installers. It's really just the way the software ought to work in the first place!

 

 

If you find your system to be slow then that is an issue with your system. We will be happy to work with you to resolve these issues at no extra cost to you.

 

While it may appear to be trivial to you we do have to hire a programmer and supply a useful environment to said programmer. It does not cost us nothing.

 

We could include the Pro upgrade in every ISY but, honestly, most users do not need the batch functions, more than 300 programs, and more than 300 scenes. We try to keep the initial cost lower for a basic unit and allow for an upgrade ($30US) as users expand their system.

 

Rand

[mattavila]

Kris - As most have been answered, Ill focus on #6. Im personally doing all that youve outlined and am very happy with the results of the system.

 

Water detection was a HUGE priority for me - Last February I had a drain line freeze on the washer that resulted in a flood - and cost me a few bucks (and several weeks of "wife aggravation" to get remedied. At any rate, that was about the time that Smarthome removed their flood detector from the market. What I did was build a similar system using 3 devices - a little pricey but does get the job done and take it a step further in my opinion. I bought a "floodstoper washing machine" device with an extra sensor. Thats is a nifty little device that will immediately turn OFF the water supply - but does nothing as far as Insteon notification goes. Its has two outputs, one that I feed into a IO Linc - thats the Inteon trigger. I also have an appliance link thats plugged into this (or linked) that will shut off the power to the washer if its triggered. Essentially if the floodstopper senses water, the supply is shut off immediately - thats great except that my issue was not the supply byt rather the washer spitting out water on the drain cycle, hence the ability to kill power to the washer as well.... I dont want to take ANY chances if Im away, so shut down the entire system.

 

I also opened up the floodstopper and added connections to the open/close buttons that allows me control of the combination from a Keypad (and program) "away button"... that simply triggers the "close" of the supply, and shuts off the washer power. The reverse is true when I de-select the AWAY button, power is restored and the water supply is again re-opened.

 

As I said, this approach was a little expensive, and Floodstopper, IO Linc and Appliance Linc... but still far cheaper than the amount I spend fixing the mess in the first place. (for what its worth, my laundry is now on the second floor and I lost my kitchen ceiling in the flood, not to mention the friggin mess it made last winter while I had guests at the house) If you have any interest Ill create a drawing and post the actual program (its quite simple) at a later time.