Solving the Wall-wart Problem.

[sanders2222]

I am installing an ELK M1 Gold and decided now is the time to address my power supply issues. It appears the panel, M1EXP and IP-232 add 3 new wall-warts. I also want to replace my aging 2412s with one of the new fangled dual band things. That requires another wall-wart for the ISY. I've searched this forum and Smarthome site and cannot seem to find anywhere what the ISY power supply requirement is. UGH!

 

Any one out there have good a solution?

 

Here is my particular dilemma, varying voltage requirements:

Location	Item	  Power Supply Voltage	Amps
Security ELK M1 Gold    Xformer  16.5VAC  0.48
Security ELK M1XEP	   Xformer	12VAC	1.5
Closet	ISY-99IR        ????		
Closet	Router      	Xformer   12VAC	0.5
Closet	IP Switch   	Xformer   5VDC	 2.8
Closet	UR RF Receiver Xformer	9V   	0.3
Media	 ELK IP232   	Xformer	12VAC	1.5
Media 	UR RF Receiver Xformer	9V	
Media	 Exhaust Fans   Xformer	???	

I have to crawl back into my media cabinet and pull the transformer that runs my fans, but I seem to recall it was 12 volts also. I can also run wires between the 3 locations, so my first choice would be one unit, feeding the needs of all 3 locations.

[LeeG]

The ISY User Guide indicates 5-30V DC 300 mA minimum.

[Brian H]

As LeeG said not overly critical.

The old 2412S was around 18 volts DC into the ISY99i.

My forum question on the subject is here.

viewtopic.php?t=3593

[apostolakisl]

I took an ATX power supply from an old computer and hooked it up to two terminal blocks, one for 5v and one for 12v.

 

I cut the wall warts off of everyting that was either 5 or 12v and ran them directly into the terminal blocks. The 9v stuff is SOL. Had to keep the wall warts.

 

I did this a month or two ago. My stuff has never run so well. I never have problems with anything needing reboots anymore. This confirms my suspicions that stuff like routers and whatnot getting screwy on you is from poor voltage regulation from crummy wall warts. The 5/12v status of the ATX power supply is within .05v every time I have tested it. And it doesn't fluctuate as loads come on and go off. I am sure if I took it up to it's max rating, I would start seeing fluctuation, but that shouldn't happen.

 

I got rid of 15 wall warts in my control room. My poor power strips look so lonely now.

 

The ISY is running off of 5v.

[iostream212]

Can you provide a little more info on your setup? Terminal blocks used and was it just one lead that you inputed into those blocks? I am very interested in this post cause my can is over loaded with wall warts. Isy, two routers, lighting, bnc to ip converters, cameras, etc..... Thanks!

 

Sent from my SCH-I510 using Tapatalk

[sanders2222]

Thanks for the feedback guys.

The ISY User Guide indicates 5-30V DC 300 mA minimum.

That is quite a range, I noticed one post by Michel suggesting 12V and apostolakisl stated he runs his off 5V. Is there an advantage/disadvantage to lower/higher voltages?

 

I would like more detail of the ATX setup. Something like that could certainly clean things up for my 5V and 12V needs.

 

Assuming I will still need my ELK M1 wart (16.5V), if I plug this wart in my closet, what gauge wire would I need to run to the ELK panel (roughly 10 feet)? Would stranded be better than solid?

[apostolakisl]

I used two of these, one for 5v and one for 12v. http://www.ebay.com/itm/180588155864?ss ... 1497.l2649 One side is positive, the other negative. I ended up using every slot on the 12v one and about 2/3 of the 5v.

 

There is someone on cocoontech.com forum who is selling much nicer ones for $10/ea. They are "used". His have fuses on each slot. The ATX supply has a breaker in it to protect against shorts (it works, I accidentally tripped it twice hooking it all up) but if it trips, everything shuts off. I also plugged the ATX into a UPS so power failures don't mess with my system.

 

The ATX supply should list on it all the different specs on the wires. There will be one main color wire for 12v and one for 5v. The amps/volts for each color wire will be written in those specs. There are some 3v leads and some neg voltage leads but they are spec'd at minimal amps. You will also need to short the signal wire to ground. Again, this should be listed on the unit. But you can also go to wikipedia and it lays it out there too. The signal wire is how you turn it on. There is also one wire that provides minimal current even when off. This is what would power your computers clock maybe and give it enough power to have stuff like wake on lan active. You shouldn't need that for this job.

 

As far as the large voltage range on ISY. I can only assume it has a 5v regulator in there (haven't opened it). If so, these devices dump extra energy as heat. If you have a good 5v supply that doesn't dip when current draw goes up, then you should stick with the lower voltage since there is less heat.

 

EDIT: And yes, I left my Elk wall wart intact. But I did power a bunch of the accessories off of the ATX like the XEP and Relay boards.

[sanders2222]

The ATX supply (wires) will be ... for 12v and for 5v...

Just one more idiot question, the warts I have say 12VAC 1.5A or 12VAC 500mA. Does that mean the output is 12 volts alternating current? In other words, an ATX or other power supply that produces 12VDC (direct current) would not work?

 

Also, isn't the amperage shown the maximum draw on the wart (not necessarily the actual draw for the unit)? But to be safe, I would need to add up the amps for those warts I can eliminate and make sure whatever PS I substitute allows at least equal to that?

[Brian H]

The ISY99i needs DC.

Are your AC wall warts are for different devices?

Some devices do use an AC Wall Wart and generate their needed DC voltages internally.

One of my Routers uses an AC wall wart.

[sanders2222]

The ISY99i needs DC. ...Some devices do use an AC Wall Wart and generate their needed DC voltages internally.

Thanks for pointing this out Brian. Your post made me look at my wall warts with more scrutiny and they either show 9VDC, or 5V/12V (followed by a solid horizontal line on top of a dashed line). I believe that symbol is for direct current. At any rate, I think I was looking at the 120VAC (input) and only saw "12VAC". Sorry for my confusion.

[apostolakisl]

The ISY99i needs DC. ...Some devices do use an AC Wall Wart and generate their needed DC voltages internally.

Thanks for pointing this out Brian. Your post made me look at my wall warts with more scrutiny and they either show 9VDC, or 5V/12V (followed by a solid horizontal line on top of a dashed line). I believe that symbol is for direct current. At any rate, I think I was looking at the 120VAC (input) and only saw "12VAC". Sorry for my confusion.

 

Yes, the solid line and the dashed line is the symbol for dc. A solid line and a wavy line over it is AC. And there are very few things that use 12vac or 5vac. While I will not deny they exist, they are few and far between.

 

As far as total amps. You are very unlikely to exceed an ATX power supply unless you put a rediculous amount of stuff on it.

 

I suggest getting yourself a $10 multimeter with a current meter on it and test things out. You are correct to say that the number on the wall wart is the max rating for that wall wart. I would expect that most of your devices will be under that number.

[Brian H]

The solid and dashed lines may indicate which wire is +.

If you look at the wire you may see one of them has dashes on it.

You may want to also verify the center pin is + as I have seen some wall warts with - on the center pin.

You may find a small diagram on the label or a symbol molded on the case showing polarity.

[apostolakisl]

The solid and dashed lines may indicate which wire is +.

If you look at the wire you may see one of them has dashes on it.

You may want to also verify the center pin is + as I have seen some wall warts with - on the center pin.

You may find a small diagram on the label or a symbol molded on the case showing polarity.

 

 

Another reason to buy a multimeter.

 

Just make sure not to try to test something that is more than milliamps on the milliamp side. The stupid fuses cost more than a new multimeter almost!

[Brian H]

That is why I have spare meter fuses.

[apostolakisl]

That is why I have spare meter fuses.

 

As of yesterday I now have extras too. I bought a 5 pack on ebay so hopefully I will be set for a while. You just have to remember to switch the wire to the high amp side first!

[Brian H]

My fairly inexpensive Radio Shack meter. Uses fairly inexpensive fuses.

Now at work the FLUKE Fuses are Big Bucks.

[TJF1960]

apostolakisl,

 

Are you still a fan of using an old ATX power supply instead of all the wall-warts? Have you made any changes or additions since changing over? I am ready to do the same thing and looking for any extra tips or suggestions - along the lines of "I should have...." etc.

 

Thanks,

Tim

[sanders2222]

Are you still a fan of using an old ATX power supply instead of all the wall-warts?

I would also like to know how that is working. I bought one of those PS units over a year ago, but never connected it up. Instead, I still have a mess of power strips, wall warts and a tangled mess of wires!

Also, how would a UPS unit work with one of those ATX units? We get a lot of power outages in the Northwest.