2413S vs 2413U connection to isy994 - $2 solution vs $80!

[scubaguyjohn]

I want to purchase an ISY994. I presently own a 2413U which is a USB-connected PLM. I understand the isy994 requires a 2413S which is a serial-connected PLM.

 

However, since the 2413U is nothing more than a 2413S with a serial to USB converter built in (all the protocols are the same from what i understand), wouldn't a $2 usb to rj45 or usb to serial converter allow my 2413U to operate with the isy994 and avoid another $80 expense for a 2413S?

 

Am i missing something?

 

thanks, John.

[LeeG]

I have seen that work on a PC but I have serious doubts with an ISY. Also all converters are not equal, even on a PC some work some do not. Some work some of the time but create intermittent PLM communication issues. Considering the total investment in Insteon I think you are asking for trouble for such a small savings. The convertor will always be an open question, is the convertor responsible for this symptom. It is NOT a supported ISY configuration.

[ELA]

A hub is over simplifying the issue. I would expect to pay $20 or more for a decent rs232 to USB converter.

Then the next thing you would be missing is one end to power the USB bus, as well as USB master to control the bus.

Buy a 2413s.

[scubaguyjohn]

good answers, thank you very much. is there a place here to sell a slightly used 2413U?

 

 

I have seen that work on a PC but I have serious doubts with an ISY. Also all converters are not equal, even on a PC some work some do not. Some work some of the time but create intermittent PLM communication issues. Considering the total investment in Insteon I think you are asking for trouble for such a small savings. The convertor will always be an open question, is the convertor responsible for this symptom. It is NOT a supported ISY configuration.

[LeeG]

Ebay. You might consider keeping it. Smarthome is now providing HouseLinc free and it now supports any of the standard PLMs (no longer need the special PLM that ends in H). There is some Insteon network diagnostics that might be useful. There are issues trying to share a device between HL and the ISY so how useful this might be is an open question but it is an option. If you ever get a Simplehomenet/Smartenit device the USB PLM could be used with the free SHN Utility Suite to do some SHN device configuration the ISY does not support, such as setting the Relay timers on the EZIOxx devices so the relays can be used to control garage doors and the like.

[scubaguyjohn]

good input Lee.... I didn't think houselinc was free, last time I checked (yesterday) HL wouldn't work/recognize my 2413U. Previously, I had been told by Insteon support that i had to purchase a "special" 2413u to work with houselinc though i now see the Houselinc package they sell comes with a USB dongle of sorts. I will double check again.

 

Using HL v. 2.9.56 and when i try to manually set up the plm, i can select 2413u but the "next" button is greyed out.

 

John.

 

 

Ebay. You might consider keeping it. Smarthome is now providing HouseLinc free and it now supports any of the standard PLMs (no longer need the special PLM that ends in H). There is some Insteon network diagnostics that might be useful. There are issues trying to share a device between HL and the ISY so how useful this might be is an open question but it is an option. If you ever get a Simplehomenet/Smartenit device the USB PLM could be used with the free SHN Utility Suite to do some SHN device configuration the ISY does not support, such as setting the Relay timers on the EZIOxx devices so the relays can be used to control garage doors and the like.

[LeeG]

Might need 2.9.59 to get support for all the PLMs. I know some have tried using a 2412N SmartLinc which is also listed as supported now but it is not working. Expect support for that in a future drop but others have reported using standard PLMs successfully. Don't know what level HL was being used

[scubaguyjohn]

hmmm...can't get 2.9.59 at this time, latest update is 2.9.56....i tried updating device drivers too but no go.

 

 

Might need 2.9.59 to get support for all the PLMs. I know some have tried using a 2412N SmartLinc which is also listed as supported now but it is not working. Expect support for that in a future drop but others have reported using standard PLMs successfully. Don't know what level HL was being used

[LeeG]

Apparently Smarthome makes the latest update available to groups of users at a time, perhaps to avoid overloading their servers (only a guess). I've been on 2.9.59 for a few days, maybe more. Things have been hectic around here so it could be a week or more. Received Device Definition update to 2.9.50 today.

[scubaguyjohn]

thanks again, got it to work on a different computer...probably a device driver issue. Thank goodness i didn't buy it recently...

 

Apparently Smarthome makes the latest update available to groups of users at a time, perhaps to avoid overloading their servers (only a guess). I've been on 2.9.59 for a few days, maybe more. Things have been hectic around here so it could be a week or more. Received Device Definition update to 2.9.50 today.

[scubaguyjohn]

I know a lot of users rave about the isy and its flexibility. What are the key benefits of isy over houselinc other than the ability to leave the PC off and let the isy run any needed programs? I haven't done a lot with houselinc yet, but at first glance, it does appear powerful.

 

thanks. John.

[oberkc]

I have never used houselinc, but my perception is that the conditional logic in the ISY is a bit more powerful and flexible. ISY also includes ability to manage links and scenes and provide remote access to your system (i understand that this capability resides not in the houselinc, but in the smartlinc). Additionally, I suspect the ISY provides greater integration with other stuff, like weatherbug, security, many internet-enabled devices such as audio and video equipment. Some ISY models include IR capability.

 

By the time you purchase a smartlinc AND houselinc, the price difference becomes inconsequential, if there is one.

[scubaguyjohn]

thanks...i think the remote access would be good to have...since houselinc is now free, the price difference is substantial. I have an ir linc, is there any reason i should buy the isy with ir capabilities?

 

Can anyone talk about integrating ip cameras (or lack of integration) with isy... can ip camera motion detection trigger insteon events? It seems redundant to have insteon motion detectors everywhere i have an ip camera in order to then create an insteon action.

[oberkc]

If you already have an IRLinc, this seriously limits the value of the IR capability of the ISY. Still, much depends on where you intend to locate your ISY and what you intend to do with it.

 

There is no integration of video with the ISY. However, there are apps for use on tablets and phones that interface with ISY as well as show video. Personally, I have not seen much value in integration of video and lighting control. At some level, perhaps it would be nice to take advantage of motion sensing that is part of the IP cameras. I suspect this could be done if you wanted to get into the network module and REST interface. I have not.

[arw01]

Another thing that will be nice, is when the tv api's open up a bit with all the "skype" cameras they have to know if they think the rooms are occupied as well.

[Xathros]

There is no integration of video with the ISY. However, there are apps for use on tablets and phones that interface with ISY as well as show video. Personally, I have not seen much value in integration of video and lighting control. At some level, perhaps it would be nice to take advantage of motion sensing that is part of the IP cameras. I suspect this could be done if you wanted to get into the network module and REST interface. I have not.

 

At the moment, there is no way of sensing motion at the cam and notifying the ISY without a third party monitoring the cam and alerting the ISY via the rest interface. I tested this using my pogoplug. I configured the cams to upload images to the ftp running on my pogoplug. I have a script that watches for files in the ftp folders and issues a rest command to the ISY when files are detected. While this works, the lag from actual motion to ISY reaction was variable from 5 up to 15 seconds and I decided that was more or less useless. Now I just rely on standard motion sensors and other insteon traffic.

 

As for the integration of video and lighting, I have my ISY point my PTZ cams based on motion detected by motion sensors or when certain switches are controlled or garage doors open/close or triggerlincs turn on. If the house is in away mode or vacant mode the ISY enables the record on video motion feature of the cams and if after sunset , ISY brings up suitable lighting so that I can capture a good image of whats going on. If the house was just vacant and not in away mode, after a 2 minute delay, i stop capturing images on video motion detected otherwise I continue to capture until a manual reset.

 

-Xathros

[scubaguyjohn]

great feedback, thanks.

 

How do you use isy to control the camera? For me, a 5-15 second lag would be okay in the daytime as i believe some cameras can be set to ftp images that occur prior to motion being detected (they must be caching images on a continual basis to internal memory)....thoughts on the usefulness of this? Also, what is the isy rest command? i searched the manual to no avail.

 

JOhn.

 

 

There is no integration of video with the ISY. However, there are apps for use on tablets and phones that interface with ISY as well as show video. Personally, I have not seen much value in integration of video and lighting control. At some level, perhaps it would be nice to take advantage of motion sensing that is part of the IP cameras. I suspect this could be done if you wanted to get into the network module and REST interface. I have not.

 

At the moment, there is no way of sensing motion at the cam and notifying the ISY without a third party monitoring the cam and alerting the ISY via the rest interface. I tested this using my pogoplug. I configured the cams to upload images to the ftp running on my pogoplug. I have a script that watches for files in the ftp folders and issues a rest command to the ISY when files are detected. While this works, the lag from actual motion to ISY reaction was variable from 5 up to 15 seconds and I decided that was more or less useless. Now I just rely on standard motion sensors and other insteon traffic.

 

As for the integration of video and lighting, I have my ISY point my PTZ cams based on motion detected by motion sensors or when certain switches are controlled or garage doors open/close or triggerlincs turn on. If the house is in away mode or vacant mode the ISY enables the record on video motion feature of the cams and if after sunset , ISY brings up suitable lighting so that I can capture a good image of whats going on. If the house was just vacant and not in away mode, after a 2 minute delay, i stop capturing images on video motion detected otherwise I continue to capture until a manual reset.

 

-Xathros

[Xathros]

scubaguyjohn-

 

None of the 4 cam types that I own cache any images prior to an upload request and I don't remember that being listed as a feature on any that I have looked at so which gives me the impression that that is not a common feature.

 

The /REST interface is a method for communicating with the ISY via HTTP. You can turn On/Off/Brighten/Dim devices/scenes, get or set the values of variables, cause programs to run, get the current status of devices or programs all via http urls.

 

For controlling the cams, you would need to ISY Network module add-on. This allows you to send network commands from the ISY to other network devices like cameras. I used the Firefox's web developer tool to look at the command that the camera's web interface was sending to the cam when I asked it to point the camera to a preset then duplicated that with a network resource rule. Now when I call that rule, the cam turns to that position. I created a rule for each cam and position I wanted to use. Another rule for Enable upload on motion, one to disable, again for each camera.

 

Then its just a matter of writing ISY programs to watch for motion/activity and call the network resources as necessary.

 

-Xathros

[scubaguyjohn]

very clever! now I now know what the network module is for! thanks again.