bmiller

Yes they are on the same breaker. Since i removed load sensing from the newest outlet, i can't seem to replicate the problem. The older one still has load sensing active. That's the way they both came. Thanks for looking at the data. At least that confirms there is no unwanted linking involved. Brad

The other capped white is then the light neutral. Is it run directly from the panel? That would mean that is the only device on the whole circuit. Quite an unconventional method of wiring, and wasting a whole circuit for one light is not the best use of circuits. I suspect the hot black and capped neutral are coming from another light or outlet. If you can shut off the breaker for that light and see if there is something else that goes out also, that will prove it doesn't come directly from the panel, but from another device. It's hard to trace this stuff in any house. Sometimes the shortest route is not always the best. Good luck

Here it is. Brad

I just ran a one minute timer for the test again, and then afterwards, turned the test lamp switch on and off, unplugged the test lamp, plugged it back in. After a couple of times doing these operations, the living room light stayed on as it should. I turned the kpl button for the Christmas tree lights off, and the test lamp came on as per the program, and the other lamp stayed on as it should. I performed the same routine with the living room lamp off. It stayed off. By all appearances, it was related to the load sense being on. Load sense is still on on the living room light. I can't seem to replicate the problem since i disabled load sensing on the Christmas tree outlet. I don't know if that makes any sense to you experts.

This morning i set up another test lamp with a different bulb. I had the Living Room lamp on, and plugged in the new test lamp and turned it on and off a few times, and the other lamp stayed on as i expected it to. I then let the Christmas light program run it's morning routine while i was out for a bit, and when i came home, the Christmas lights were out, and the other lamp was still on as it should be. I then turned the test lamp on from it's switch, and the other lamp went out, and the test lamp came on. It's a new switch on the Christmas lights, and load sensing is supposed to be disabled, but it appears it isn't. Regardlerss, that shouldn't affect the other light, at least i don't think it should. The summary shows the lights shut of at 8:30 AM as they should, and the next scheduled run is at dusk 6:16 PM. I turned the Christmas tree test lamp on using it's switch at about 9:00am. The living room light only shows up in the away program. Right now i use it and the kitchen lights from a scene using 2 separate kpl buttons. I disabled load sensing on the New Christmas light outlet linc. Weird though when i pressed the set button on the outlet, the Living Room light went out. I had to double tap the kpl button to get it back on. Now when i try to turn the test lamp on, it stays off, and the other lamp stays on as it should. I have a feeling something is still amiss, it just hasn't shown up yet. I added photos of the device links table for the Christmas lights, along with a list of devices. This may help figuring out if there is some unwanted link between the 2.

I left the test lamp unplugged, and let the program run anyway, and the second lamp stayed on until it was manually turned off via it's own kpl button. Weird why turning on a lamp with no on command from the isy will then turn itself on and another unassociated light off and on, or unplugging a lamp will do the same thing. After they are plugged in and turned on they both work as they should. Could this be load sensing in enabled on the one i just added? It was brand new, and is supposed to come disabled. Why would it affect the other switch. Something to look at today.

I have a lamp hooked up to the plug for testing out the Christmas light program. On the same circuit i have another lamp that has been plugged into another outlet linc for a few months and is operated from a kpl button, or from a vacation program. A couple of times now i've turned the switch on the test lamp. and although the isy shows Christmas lights off, the lamp will come on and shut the other lamp off, or turn it on depending on which state it is in. Both are cfl's. I ran a test a few times with the older lamp on, and the Christmas lights running through a few timed programs. All worked ok those times. When i physically turn the test lamp on or off, it turns both on and off without a command from the isy. Is this a normal condition for cfl's, or is this some spooky Halloween thing. Last night when the Christmas lights should have turned off, the other lamp turned off and the Christmas test lamp stayed on. Tests i ran again today were ok. I ran a scene test and all was ok, at least it said successful when finished, and i did see the isy change, and the light change. Note. I thought it might be the tri-light lamp i was using with a single way cfl bulb for testing the Christmas light circuit,, so i got another lamp, and just unplugged the lamp i was using. The other lamp turned off, and when i plugged the replacement test lamp in, both lamps turned on. The isy still showed off, so i toggled the light on and off from the isy, and now both lights are in the sate they should be. I didn't think unplugging a lamp should have an affect on another device. Brad

I see what you are saying. I gather then that i can remove that statement, and just leave when kpl is turned off, turn Christmas tree on ie. keep the outlet active to use as normal, until the the following Christmas. I use that statement in my vacation program to end a currently running program if i return home before it's finish time. I assumed i needed it here also, but i it isn't needed in this case. Thanks for the clarification everyone. Everything so far is working as programed with the test lamp. Brad

In order to have a random shut off time you must have a wait. You are terminating a wait. As I mentioned, "stop program" only affects a program that is currently executing a "then" or "else" clause. The only way to have an "else" or "then" clause that lasts more than a split second (and thus has opportunity for a stop to be interjected) is during a "wait" or "repeat". . . mostly just "wait" since "repeats" without "waits" don't take very long either. Maybe future execution of the program is a better statement then stop program. I see what you mean about about a momentary command to stop a running program. In my case the program will never run until the kpl is on, at least that's the way my vacation scene is working. I'm not sure about the Christmas lights, but i've got a lamp setup, so i'll see how that works this weekend. They all have a wait, and shut off at random times. I gather the "wait" is the key. Thanks for your patience everyone. It's a giant learning curve. Brad

I have a vacation scene with 4 lights that come on at dusk, and turn off at various, random times to simulate someone at home. Mine are activated from a KPL button, and deactivated from the same button. When the button is on the lights come on as they should, and off at various random times as they should through the program.. If i come home, and the program is still running, i can turn off the kpl button, and all the lights go off as they should. This is done with a stop program command when the kpl is turned off. The program never runs again until i turn the associated kpl button on. The only caveat is if it is past dusk, and i activate the program, it won't run until the next instance of dusk the following day. It also works from mobilinc from a scene. I have the Christmas tree lights set up the same way through a kpl button. It has tested alright so far. It will be tested again when i hook up the led strings. apostolakisl, i'm not sure if this it was you are pointing too, but everything seems to work fine for me. Maybe it's the fact that it is activated from a KPL that is the difference, but i've had no problem since i set the program for my vacation scene. I think i have the Christmas lights setup the same way, and the tests work ok. I forgot to mention, i added if KPL button is on to the " if " of the Christmas lights program. I'm not sure if it is needed, as i have it linked with the scene, but it's there and it appears to be working. I'll test on the weekend with a lamp to verify the setup works.

If you did this, then the outletlinc will turn on and off with the keypad button. Effects from programs will be in addition to this. I am not familiar with the statement "stop program". Does this stop any ongoing execution of a program, or more broadly disable the program? My assumption is the former, in which case, this may not do what you expect. What are you expecting to happen when "keypad linc D" is switched on, if anything? It stops execution of the program(s). When the KPL is on, it will run the lights as in the program. When it is switched off, it will stop the program, turn the outlet on and leave active like a regular outlet until the KPL is turned on again. The advantage of this over setting a specific date is i never know when my wife wants the tree setup. This way i turn the program on with the push of a button, and disable it the same way no matter what the day is.

Thanks, you are correct. I was using an led potential tester. There was enough passing through to keep the light on. That's a good one to remember. Now i believe the strings of Christmas lights are small led, but the string is long enough, it shouldn't matter, i hope.

Yes. That's the one i have a test light plugged into. I just performed a scene test, and it came back successful.

Thanks, i'l do that. I'll get this working with the KPL first. I've programed as the jpegs and when i press the KPL button on and off, i can here the outletlinc clicking on and off, but the light i have hooked up stays on all the time. The isy shows the kpl turning off and on and the outlet turning on and off as it should, but the outlet itself stays active all the time. Is this a defective outlet?

I just had an idea. It hurts, but i have them every now and again. I have a spare keypadlinc button. I made a scene with the keypadlinc button and the Christmas Lights outletlinc. I then made a program with the time of day that i want the lights on and off, which will be activated with the button on. I made another program "if KPL button is off" then stop christmas tree program and turn lights on which in this case will be to activate the outlet when the lights are removed. Sorry to keep adding jpegs, but sometimes a picture is worth a thousand words. Thanks again Brad

I see what you mean by the or instead of and in the first program. That program would be ok. I just wanted the outlet to be active all the time starting Jan. 4. I was hoping the second program would take over during the holiday season each year to avoid reprogramming the holiday schedule, but it appears that is what i'll be doing. I'll just have one program to activate the outlet on each Jan. and another to do the lights on a yearly basis. The variable program looks a bit daunting. Thanks for the help. Brad

I have installed one outlet link for the lights for the Christmas tree, and may install one for the outside lights. I would like to have the lights go off and on daily from the middle of Dec. until say Jan. 3, and then have the outlet stay on, as would a regular outlet, for the rest of the year. I would also like this to be continuous, ie. i don't want to have to reprogram every year, so i made it run until 2030. The only way i could think of doing it was to create two programs for the outletlinc. Will this work? Thanks Brad

Here are some screen shots of the way things are. More to be added later, but not to the away folder, just outletlincs for Christmas lights etc. The away folder has slightly different off times under "if" and different random wait times under "else for each light. There may be better or easier ways to do this, but this is working for me, so i'll keep it the way it is. I'm glad it's helping others. The programing language can be interpreted differently than you expect.

A couple of days ago i rearranged things a bit. I took the vacation off scene out of the mix. I moved the off program out of the away folder and left it on it's own. The off program now states "if" control kpl c is switched off, then end all 4 light programs and shutoff all 4 lights. I then added a test time to the existing lights on at dusk program so i can run a test without waiting. I redid the test time through the day 3 times, and all the lights went off as expected every time. I removed the test part of the program and ran the program as designed at dusk. All the lights came on, and shutoff as expected for the last 3 days. That's a total of 6 tests and all passed. I'd say that's a wrap. Anything that prevents the normal operation from this point on must be some sort of interference. In a real situation, coming home and shutting the program off, there should be nothing running, except maybe a furnace or air-conditioning unit. Coulld these have an affect on the isy?

Tested setup tonight. Didn't work. After program started at dusk, kpl c was turned off, and only 1 light shut off. The test which worked earlier was before dusk, and the activation of the away folder and programs. There is a problem activating the off when the away program has started. I'll keep plugging away at it, but it sure isn't easy.

I turned kpl c "away" button to the on position. I Then moved the "off" program out of the folder away, and turned on 3 of the four lights i have programmed with kpl and remotelinc buttons. I then physically turned kpl c off and all 3 lights went out. I gather this proves that the "off" program will in fact shutoff the lights as desired. I'll run the vacation at dusk program tonight, and see how it works.

I have my away folder with the staus kpl c is on, and all the lights turn on at dusk. Is it better to have the "off" program in the same folder as the on, or in it's own folder. When the lights turn on at dusk, and i switch the kpl c off to end the programs and turn the lights off, it doesn't always work. It did at first, but i guess that was coincidence. I have the program "off" in the same folder as the "on", but i had control kpl c is switched off, and i gather it should be status kpl c is off. I'm thinking now it may be better to make a new folder with the status kpl c is off to end the light programs and turn lights off. I'm the type that learns better from examples, so when i see a working setup, as opposed to a non- working setup, and have the errors explained, it becomes much clearer. I added a couple of captures. A capture is worth a thousand of my explanations. The off program did have control instead of status. I changed that, as it sounds like control was the wrong statement. Thanks Brad

So in my case, i have an away folder with status kplc is on. This is evaluated at dusk, and when found to be true, or the kpl c is infact in the on position, the light programs associated with this will turn on/off at the programmed time. There was no change in status at the time of evaluation, but the statement was found to be true. If that had said control kpl c is on, and was in fact true at the time of evaluaion, or dusk in this case, the lights would also work as per the program. I also have an off folder that states control kpl c off, which i gather is a trigger to turn the lights off after the program has started.It works as stated. if it said status kplc off, then turn lights off, i gather it would not work, as there is no evalution of the statement after the programs have started. 2 words creating so much confusion. Let me know if i'm getting anywhere near the correct interpretation.

I'm still trying to get my head around using status or control in an "if" statement. I can be a little slow that way. Status is a condition that a device is in at a certain time that will trigger an operation when something else occurs. Control is a momentary command that will trigger an action at that moment only, and cannot be used to setup a future action. Am i in left field with these statements. Both words sound like they can be interchangeable in some program statements. Thanks again for your endless patience. Brad

This may not be the ideal way of doing things, but i ended up creating 2 scenes. One is called vacation, with the kpl button in it to start the programs in an associated folder, and another scene called off with the 4 lights in the scene. I then created a folder called "away" with the "if" status kpl c button is on, and then added the 4 lights as programs to the folder. Each program has a different off time, and also randon wait times. Also in the folder is an off program where the "if" kplc is switched off, "then" end program.... for all 4 lights. It also has set scene off to off. This allows me to come home before the program times out, push the kpl c button to shut the lights off and end the program for that night. It is likely a more complex way of doing things, but it works. Creating the scenes allow for mobilinc to control everything. One question. The "if' for the folder away states "status kpl c on", and the off folder has " control kpl c switched off. What is the best statement for this, status or control. It works the way it is, but i'm sure they should both be the same.