paulbates

There is some "you get what you pay for" involved. I started with X10. The oldest switches in my house are X10 brand. They still work x10 wise, but from a construction / operation point of view are showing their age. The decora style seem to suffer the most, and always had a cheap feel to them when operating them. I have one for the lights on my stairs; the signal seems to work all time when controlled, but it can take several presses to get it to register. It gets used every day, and I hear about it. I have keypad lincs to replace them soon. I would recommend against x10 for daily, high traffic areas. Having said that, its been a long time since I bought any x10 brand items, so others may have a more optimistic view on build quality. Another factor is how insteon affects X10 signalling. (as Brian pointed out) The more insteon you install, the more it impacts and reduces x10's signal ability to get around on your network. If the x10 switches are further away from the panel, or on a circuit with lots of insteon, they may not communicate 100%. Or over time, as you install more insteon, it might work less and less consistently. Or install devices like Brian discussed. Not a straight answer to your question, but I think you're going to find that the design and build of insteon, though not perfect, buys you something. One thing to look for is "refurb" sales at Smarthome. It means "open box return". I buy as much as I can that way.

Welcome Sandpiper- I moved from HomeSeer Connected via Hub to the ISY which is similar to what you are doing. I recommend the build from scratch method, asking the ISY to remove what links it finds. Steve assisted me with my migration which was great. You'll want to understand the impact to your operations, ISY is different than the hub and requires more learning. You can start simple with schedules and work your way up. I had 33 devices at the time. Using "remove links", that's about 2 hours to add devices and think though how to group them with the ISY's folders. Another 6 hours to define and thoroughly test all scenes (I have keypad links, those take time to configure), and then review it all again. If you have help with a walkie talkie, it should speed that up. If you use the hub's mobile apps or windows 8 app, you';ll need to think through how you replace the remote control aspect of the hub. There are some third party products here to try, however I don't know them. Also give yourself time to learn ISY' programming. Its great, I love it... and it takes time to work your way from simpler things to more complex things. One thing I think you will enjoy is the ISYs ability to send emails based on lights and thermostats, etc being on. Even though you're remote, you'll feel close to what's going on Good luck, I believe you will glad you switched over to ISY

The Hydreon RG-11 is a non-mechanical, optical rain sensor. Its reliable, rugged and unbreakable. Based on a post by jrainey,(See post #3) I bought and installed a Hydreon sensor to emulate Tipping Bucket and measure rainfall on my property directly. Like many, I was getting mixed results by counting on results from local net based WX. It was good, but observation said it could be a lot better. This tutorial is what's needed and how to install it. It ends with a sample program to calculate rainfall. What the Hydreon does It closes or opens (NO/NC) contacts in response to a certain amount of rain drops falling across its optics Each close represents a certain amount of rain fall: .01", .001" or .0001" (There's metric too) The clicks are intercepted by a contact module, IO Linc Those clicks can be counted up, calculated into rainfall and acted on by ISY Programs Hydreon Requirements 12 Volts to 30 Volts AC or DC A device to receive the contact clicks Open space to mount it My Parts list Hydreon RG-11 Insteon IO Linc 2450 Enercell 12vdc 300ma Adapter (Radio Shack 273-315)Plugs into IO Linc open outlet Strong 4 conductor project wire. I prefer Thermostat wire How to do it (See pictures and diagrams) Hydreon Set the dip switches for sensitivity. I used the default, .01" per closure Feed project wire through the nut on the bottom of the Hydreon Connect wire colors for power that will help you remember positive and negative The positive terminal is on the far right as you connect it The Normal Open (NO) and ground are on the left. Contacts don't care which wire hooks to which the IO linc Mount it, clean the hydreon, and string the wire to the IOlinc location IOLinc and Power Connect the to contact wires to IO linc's Sense and ground (see pic) Cut the Enercel cable to fit. The lead with the black stripe is negative Solder/Wire nut the connections from the power supply cable to the Hydreon cable ISY (See pic) Add the IO Linc if you haven't already and name it Mine is "Garage Hydreon Sensor" Click options and set up per pic The contact closure (NO/NC) of the IOLinc are not used for the Hydreon, they are available ISY Progam Here is a sample, it will let you see it in action. Based on the program counting up, you can set a variable and cancel your sprinkler routine If Status 'Yard / Sprinklers / Garage Hydreon Sensor' is On Then $Rain_Count += 1 Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') Results I've been getting good results with mine. I've been through 2 rainstorms and it seems to be close. I know exactly how much water I've been getting. My local WX stations are all over the place. My previous WX based weather saved money, but I could observe things not working right. Here are other things the Hydreon can do. It can perform a number of applications together with ISY: "It's Raining"-- Close a skylight at the first sign of rain, and open it when it stops raining. Condensation / Frost Sensing Wiper control Irrigation Control-- Turn off water if raining Drop Detection

Good point. They do run in a sequence on Ezflora #1, from 1 - 7, and then hop to Ezflora 2 for the rest. I can put a Set Off for Zone 7 when hopping over. Thanks

Thanks Lee, that is the kind of help i was looking for with the ezflora. My existing package on hs is spinkler controller brand/type 'agnostic', and provids a 5 second spread to cover the needs of a variety of controllers. This includes controllers that don't automatically shut running zones off when switching. In doing anual 'blow outs' of the system and testing / working on the system, i noticed that the ezflora seems to close the current non-master down before starting the next. Glad its ok to move from one zone to the next.

I'm working on sprinkler programs, wanted a sanity check, both on approach and handling of the EZflora. I want to have three programs that work together There will be a (1) sprinkler program to run all the zones for a cycle, It will have a time of day condition to start it, and 'enough rainfall' condition to prevent it from running Turn on a variable the sprinkler cycle is active turn zone one on wait x minutes turn zone one off wait 5 seconds turn zone two on ...... Turn off the sprinkler cycle variable There will be a (2) 'enough rainfall' program that will set a variable when enough rain has fallen. Possibly a companion program to turn it back off. I pretty much have this worked out. The issue is that the "enough rainfall" condition does come up during the 4 hour sprinkler cycle. If it does, the "enough rainfall" variable controlling the sprinkler program would become true. I would like the sprinkling to stop then. The final program is a (3) "Mid Cycle shutdown program" that is triggered on "Sprinkler Cycle" and "enough rainfall" becomes true. In this program, when true, I'm thinking: Stop (Sprinkler Program)' ... this will probably leave a zone running .. Shut off the master valve on both EZFloras, 5 second pause between. That will stop watering Step through all the non-master sprinkler valves and shut them off / known state. Leave 5 seconds between off commands. Index a Mid Cycle shut down counter to monitor effectiveness Thoughts, comments on this approach? Paul

Thanks Michel Wednesday was the poster child for this WX station struggle: In calibrating my new hydreon sensor yesterday, I logged and compared its readings to 6 local WeatherBug and WeatherUnderground stations. As it rained all day, it was a great sample. My mistake was thinking i could calibrate against other 'net weather stations. They were all within 5 miles of me, 4 within 2 miles. The total for the day spanned from 0.5" to 2.2" across those 6 WU/WB stations !!?? This rainstorm was massive and spanned my half of MI, there is not good explanation for that much variance. I'm going to calibrate against a plastic gauge. These 'net weather challenges are not new or unique to HA or UD alone. I would happily take heat, wind and other readings from Climate module, they have been close enough in WB over time. Paul Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

I am working on programming my sprinklers with the ISY. One of my longer term challenges is getting local rain amount "just right". Having tried Weatherbug and WeatherUnderground, I get ok results, but not the results I am looking for. I just put into the hydreon sensor, and today's day long rain here in MI proves that it is working consistently and accurately once calibrated. My question is, can I calculate a rain value (whatever units are needed) as an input to the Irrigation module?

The trick is finding the most effective outlets to plugin them in. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

That was sold as benefit to my family. The reality is it has worked out that way. There is not a clear view to the driveway area, and the click lets you know something is going on. Even the dog gives a gruff when it clicks. The flip side is the kitchen table is between both relay keypads. We have a euchre group over and people sit there. I've never had comments to me / wife about it. You can hear it but is not a heavy "clunk" like supersockets or other x10 relays.

I have two relay KPLs, converted to 8 button with the A button load controlling outside yardlights. They work great on the ISY. Because they are higher up than appliancelincs, the slight "click" is a little more noticeable. 2 should fit in a standard 2 gang construction box.

Jack, Thanks, yes that does help. It turns out I am working on this today, ironically waiting for it to stop raining Paul

Hi "Fan On" is set when someone opens the door of the thermostat and manually presses the fan On button (or you send "Fan On" from the ISY). However, it does not show "Fan On" if your HVAC unit turns on the fan in response to heating or cooling. The HVAC unit physically turns the fan on locally in the unit itself. There might be other ways to get the results you are looking for. Could you provide more information on what you want to do, eg measure run time?

I'm in the same boat bernieb, was a HS user from 2004 and went through HS1, 2 and 3. I am now fully migrating to ISY. Its easier for me to organize my work and no windows server to care for. WAF has been better as ISY programming makes it faster for me to create things that work. I've an occasional windows server hang up with HS, and now that I travel I can't wonder about that any more. I just went through a long brown out last week. Server and ISY plugged into the same spot. ISY came right back up, server didn't like the brown out and had to be visited and restarted. I also could not find myself in HS3. I have a hydreon sensor to set up to move my sprinkers over and I will be 100% ISY.

Teken - I had "Release the Kraken" on my button wish list. Think it would fit?

Several options * print your own and place them under the keys - they make a color key change kit * smarthome sells a kit of i think 50 common imprinted buttons (Garage, Kitchen, etc) * smarthome will custom print 8 buttons for $20. You say what you want (within limits) I did the last one and it really finished the project off. After 4 years I can say that they last Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Hi Teken, Good point, I was talking from a switch perspective but didn't clarify that. It should be: Power source --> insteon switch --> filter --> controlled device It goes between the insteon switch and the thing its controlling, and its better the closer it is the the controlled device Paul Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

agreed, do not install at breaker. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Hi RD The way the filter works is blocking out everything around the frequency used to send the powerline signal. Insteon's frequency in the powerline is 136mhz and x10 is 120mhz. They are very close and within the tolerance of the filter. Filtering out junk outside of these frequencies should help if this is the problem It may not work 100% of the time, but for me things significantly improved to where its rare for it be a problem. Its worth testing first to make sure this is really the problem. If you go with it, you'll need two filters for each 220 device, one for each hot back to the neutral. The need to install them in the device or at a minimum on the load side of the switch, going directly to the device. The pdf here gives a good overview of what to do http://kbase.x10.com/wiki/XPNR Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

So plugging the access point right in the inlinelinc didn't do it. I would say moving the access point causing a behavior change says that there is a noise problem on your powerline. Make sure the PLM is close to the panel and not near noise sources like motors or UPS. Unplug the access points and find the closest outlet you can close to the panel and on the opposite phase. Use linking mode as described in the document link below and make sure you have a good connection across phases. Then experiment with the location for other access point. Metal furnaces, ducts, pipes, breaker panels, etc will block the rf signal. It will take some trial and error to get the signal right on your powerline. If you have a spare lamplinc, use it to go around your house and test signal as you try locations for your access points. Its a slow, not fun process, but eventually you figure it out Kids with walkie talkies make this a lot easier if you have both. Mine thought this was fun. http://www.insteon.com/pdf/2443.pdf Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Hi RD Yes, try pulling the 24 volt transformer and testing too. Streetlights, depending what they are, can be pretty noisy too. Depending what you find, some XPNRs can probably wiggle in there. They need to right to the feed of whatever it is, on load side of the switch and switches red wire. If possible put them in the streetlight housing, etc. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Hi Teken This was all a while ago, no pictures and this stuff is kinda hard to get to. Its best that it be next to the actual device. In the case of the furnaces, i took the covers off, attached the XPNR to the main power terminals and tiewrapped the XPNR inside of a service box with other electrical connections. In the case of low voltage lighting, the standard box was there. I tucked an inlinelinc and one of these in the box. It was "comfy", but fit without force and they had room to breath. It never would have happened if it had to share the space with a switchlinc. I'm thinking for things like pool heaters and pumps there would be room in the chassises, if not, attach an electrical box to it . If its a light fixture, you should be able to put the XPNR on top where the fixture wires to the house. What are you trying to silence? Paul Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

I was just talking to Orchestrated Home. They have 2 EZIOs in stock. Unless I really needed the features of the EZIO8sa, I think this would be a simpler solution. I got my ISY from them and have been very happy with them.

Based on what you have I would guess that the EZIO is more sensitive to some noise source than the other devices. You have a number of suspects on your list. I would suggest some testing. Come up with a baseline of failures as it sits right now. Start with the EZIO itself: The EZIOsa connects to the PLM with a a Cat 5 patch to the PLM, Can a longer cable be tried and move the PLM to other locations? See if that helps, if its possible at all. You will want to try it with all of the stuff running, pumps, dimmers, lights, etc. Whatever might be noisy. If nothing comes of that, it's find the noise and filter it. Start with everything off and work your way up to turning on everything that makes noise (motors, yard lights and other transformers). See if its chronic, or if it happens only in the presence of certain things being on. It would be good to know what the dimmers are dimming... good old incandescent? LEDs? If it ends up being something noisy, use a plugin filter if you can, or an XPNR. If it were me, I would find the noise and filter it. I know from experience that PLMs don't like noise. I have my own version of this quest. Its not fun, but this is the only way I know how to kill it

The ISY is an integration point where you weave these things together. It will treat each sensor and switch at separate devices; insteon or or zwave. So yes, they do operate the same internally and you can write programs on the ISY to include both. One subtlety, insteon and zwave as individual technologies have "scene" capability. Send one Scene command to a bunch of insteon devices and they all come on. Same is true for zwave. Automated lighting has a slight delay as its signal is sent. Scenes make this a short a time a possible. The issue becomes these are exclusive technologies.... Insteon scenes won't turn on zwave devices directly and vice versa. While an ISY program can make it cross technology events happen, you might see a delay as it does one, and then the other. The suggestion is grouping lighting technologies with a particular function. Let's say you were going to automate 3 lights with one switch. I would make the switch and lights all one technology- zwave or insteon.. don't mix and match. If you have another unrelated function, use whatever technology is best / lowest cost One other concept is SAF (spouse approval factor). If things are too different for simple things like different types of light switches, they can give a lower approval rating