sloop Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 once again, i did a setup from scratch - deleted all scenec and devices, factory reset of the isy and all devices - then added each device and recreated the scenes i tried without doing the factory reset on all the devices but got lots of errors (i only deleted the scenes and devices form the isy and did the factory reset on the isy) - the difference is dramatic when you reset all the devices i never am sure of the order to add the resources in a scene - i use several controlling buttons on keypads and these are usually secondary buttons - the load of one (maybe more) of the keypads is usually in the scene but i recall reading that a device restore will rewrite all the links to the device and place them in the correct order - so after i completed my setup, i performed a restore on each device (but not the plm) these restores can take a long time and seem to write lots to the device -(some take 30 minutes or more) - some take several retries before successful - and one is a particular problem my question is about the state of the link table if a restore fails - is that device the only one affected? how does a restore work? does it delete the link table and bebuild it? not asking for any secrets to be revealed - just curious Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 Hi sloop, I think at the end of your endeavor, most your devices will be so exhausted from so much programming that they'd have no more strength to do anything else! May I humbly suggest the following: When you get your setup full working the way you want it (it might be impossible), please do not start from scratch! Every time you have a problem, simply let us know and we'll work through it to figure out the cause and not cover up the symptoms. As far as your question: Restore Device restores all the links for that SPECIFIC device (the affected device upon which Restore is being performed). If write process fails, then the state of the device is depended upon what failed; if 3 retries fail, and if we cannot revert back, then the state of the link table is purely random. As such, it's always best if you could factory reset the device, and retry. This said, however, there are no reasons for the Restore to fail unless there are communication problems which we would have to find and fix. With kind regards, Michel once again, i did a setup from scratch - deleted all scenec and devices, factory reset of the isy and all devices - then added each device and recreated the scenes i tried without doing the factory reset on all the devices but got lots of errors (i only deleted the scenes and devices form the isy and did the factory reset on the isy) - the difference is dramatic when you reset all the devices i never am sure of the order to add the resources in a scene - i use several controlling buttons on keypads and these are usually secondary buttons - the load of one (maybe more) of the keypads is usually in the scene but i recall reading that a device restore will rewrite all the links to the device and place them in the correct order - so after i completed my setup, i performed a restore on each device (but not the plm) these restores can take a long time and seem to write lots to the device -(some take 30 minutes or more) - some take several retries before successful - and one is a particular problem my question is about the state of the link table if a restore fails - is that device the only one affected? how does a restore work? does it delete the link table and bebuild it? not asking for any secrets to be revealed - just curious Link to comment
sloop Posted March 31, 2008 Author Share Posted March 31, 2008 i had some inspiration for this restart - problems of my own making i bought 2 outletlincs to replace the lamplincs in my master bath - one was craplinc after 20 minutes but i get it replaced - i used those lamplincs on the last two lamps i had that were not controlled by insteon several months ago, i lost an entire circuit - it was the same circuit with the outletlincs - when trying to isolate the problem, i replaced several devices (including a freezer) - among the devices were my outside outlets - i finally gave up and called an electrician ($300) to isolate the problem - he found two problems - one was a deformed wire nut that came loose (heat) and the second was a wire i broke when replacing one of the outside outlets - he replaced the wire nut and left the broken wire for me (the outlet was switched by a relaylinc inside) one weekend i got motivated to install my undercabinet lights in the kitchen - 120v xenon because in my house, almost everything is on a dimmer and i wanted to avoid possible noise from a transformer i had one lamplinc that had failed so i got it replaced and robbed another from an upstairs bath to use for the undercabinet lights - as best i recall. i deleted the one i robbed from the isy and redefined it - the rma's unit i think i deleted it from all the scenes, did a swap and renamed it - in any event, i got them in but i noticed some odd stuff - the pedestal mounted keypad on my desk has a secondary button that controls the lamplinc for my desk light - i actually use that one (but very little else) - i noticed that when i pressed the button, one of the outletlincs in my master bath would come on - not back off - but it always came on - so i figured i honked up something in the mysterious link tables spring in texas - back to the lawn competition and fight against fireants - while edging the lawn, i was reminded of the broken wire - and somehow found the motivation to fix it - now my front low voltage wallwashers needed to be added to the appropriate scenes but i am thinking about how something is already hosed and adding the wallwasher relay to scenes would probably violate the rules of order (when creating a scene with keypads) so i thought what the hell - and started over probably prematurely because i am reworking the upstairs bath and will want to replace the lamplinc that i robbed from up there - probably with an outletlinc since i hate looking at wall warts - and since adding that will probably violate the order thing again...i figure i will screw something up again and need another fresh start on the upside, the baldwin hardware looks and feels rich - and my cousin out here has a commercial monogram machine so i can get the linens done free - and - the new rom i flashed on my 6800 enabled rev a and the internal chipset gps (in case edfinley is reading the thread) in trying to keep to my promise not to spend any money with smarthome, i remembered that automatedoutlet was a couple of burbs down the road - so i checked the website for the address and hours - when i did not see the hours of operation, i called the number thinking that at 23:00, there would be a recording giving the hours - but someone answered the phone - he checked the inventory and said he had an outletlinc - we talked awhile and he said i should attend one of their north texas home automation user group meetings - before his blurtooth headset cut out, he wanted to ask some questions about why i used insteon have you ever walked into a boatowners meeting, thinking you might get to talk to someone that has experience with a harkin wench you were contemplating - but you find the topic of conversation is about the problem of reserving some slip in an exotic port and how to deal with their hired crews? someone asks about your boat and you have to say yours is only a 45 footer - someone says something polite and you realize that you are way outta your league up in hera, so you sit beside the loner in the corner with the 52 footer and get shunned by him too i see myself sitting in the corner of a home automation users group with my smarthome catalog feeling that same way - lol anyway - i have all but one restored - its a dimmer in the center of a 3 gang box - the led is very dim which is annoying as hell - on one side is the relay that was out of service until a few days ago (the outside outlet i repaired) - another dimmer is on the other side - the plate is warm but i expect that - i tried a factory reset and retried the restore unsuccessfully - maybe i'll rma it - i paid for the extended warranty on all these craplincs thanks for the explanation - i think i should probably forget about my largest scene and try to accomplish the same thing programmatically with the isy Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted March 31, 2008 Share Posted March 31, 2008 sloop, As usual, quite enlightening ... Well, before you start on creating programs instead of scenes, please do the following: 1. Do a Query on the Network tree node. Write down the devices that have comm problems 2. Let's figure out why they have comm problems 3. Factory reset your PLM (if you hadn't done so before) 2. Do File->Restore Devices This makes sure that what you have in ISY is equal to whatever is already out there + we are not going to have network comm problems. After the above, PLEASE do go ahead and create your largest scene and not a program. I am very confident that creating a program instead of scene is going to make things much worse. Please trust me on this. Thanks and with kind regards, Michel Link to comment
sloop Posted March 31, 2008 Author Share Posted March 31, 2008 i am not exacely sure how to do the factory reset of the plm - i thought it was to unplug it - wait about 10 seconds - hold down the set buttom while plugging it back in and hold it 10 seconds - that is what i did before - i have that version 56 (or 58 ) plm and i recall something about waiting about 2 minutes after a factory reset for it to go through what it needs to do - i assume that since i am using the 99 that i need to unplug the cable from the plm when doing the plm reset - am i close to it? Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted March 31, 2008 Share Posted March 31, 2008 Sloop, You are right on. Also, have you considered getting the latest PLM (v. 2.75)? With kind regards, Michel i am not exacely sure how to do the factory reset of the plm - i thought it was to unplug it - wait about 10 seconds - hold down the set buttom while plugging it back in and hold it 10 seconds - that is what i did before - i have that version 56 (or 58 ) plm and i recall something about waiting about 2 minutes after a factory reset for it to go through what it needs to do - i assume that since i am using the 99 that i need to unplug the cable from the plm when doing the plm reset - am i close to it? Link to comment
sloop Posted March 31, 2008 Author Share Posted March 31, 2008 well smarthome has my 4a for 'testing' - they gave a progress report that all was fine a few months ago - but it seems to have been dropped - i was thinking they might send me a new one but was waiting for a few more releases before i called and asked i did that query - this is interesting - that device failed the query as did 4 others near it - no other devices failed i have suspected these signallincs were a sack of steaming craplincs (i have 4 but was using 3) - one was plugged in near these devices (on that circuit) - so i removed the signallinc and did the query again - all the devices on that circuit passed (one on another circuit failed) - so i retried the restore and it worked fine without the signallinc lemme try some of the scenes and see how they work i also generated a list of my scenes - i want to post them and let you see if i am pushing it too far Link to comment
sloop Posted March 31, 2008 Author Share Posted March 31, 2008 # Dining Room Lamps: DRO Dining Room Lamps: Controller Dining Room Lamps: Responder # Foyer Lamp: FO Foyer Lamp: Controller Foyer Lamp: Responder # Guest Bath Lamp: GBathS Guest Bath Lamp: Controller # Guest Bedroom Fan: Guest Bedroom Fan: Controller GBedP Guest Bedroom Fan: Controller # Guest Bedroom Lamp (Bedside: GBedP Guest Bedroom Lamp (Bed: Controller Guest Bedroom Lamp (Bedside): Responder # Guest Bedroom Lamp (Reading: GBedP Guest Bedroom Lamp (Rea: Controller Guest Bedroom Lamp (Reading): Responder # Guest Bedroom Lamps: GBedP Guest Bedroom Lamp (Rea: Responder GBedP Guest Bedroom Lamp (Bed: Responder GBedO Guest Bedroom Lamps: Controller Guest Bedroom Lamp (Reading): Responder Guest Bedroom Lamp (Bedside): Responder # Guest Bedroom Overhead: GBedP Guest Bedroom Overhead: Controller Guest Bedroom Overhead: Controller # Half Bath Lamp: HBathS Half Bath Lamp: Controller Half Bath Lamp: Responder # Kitchen Hallway Overhead: Kitchen Hallway Overhead: Controller KS Kitchen Hallway Overhead: Controller # Kitchen Overhead: Kitchen Overhead: Controller KS Kitchen Overhead: Controller Kitchen Overhead: Controller # Kitchen Under Cabinet: KS Kitchen Under Cabinet: Controller Kitchen U/C (Range): Responder OPatio Kitchen Under Cabinet: Controller Kitchen U/C (Sink): Responder # Living Room Lamp (Chair): Living Room Lamp (Chair): Controller LRP Living Room Lamp (Chair): Controller # Living Room Lamp (Sofa): LRP Living Room Lamp (Sofa): Controller Living Room Lamp (Sofa): Controller # Living Room Overhead: Living Room Overhead: Controller LRP Living Room Overhead: Controller # Living Room Spotlight: Living Room Spotlight: Controller LRP Living Room Spotlight: Controller # Loft Hallway Lamp: LHO Loft Hallway Lamp: Controller Loft Hallway Lamp: Responder # Loft Lamp (Accent): Loft Lamp (Accent): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Accent): Controller # Loft Lamp (Chairs): Loft Lamp (Chairs): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Chairs): Controller # Loft Lamp (Floor): LP Loft Lamp (Floor): Controller Loft Lamp (Floor): Responder # Loft Lamp (Sofa): Loft Lamp (Sofa): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Sofa): Controller # Loft Lamps: Loft Lamp (Sofa): Responder Loft Lamp (Chairs): Responder Loft Lamp (Accent): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Floor): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Accent): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Chairs): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Sofa): Responder LHO Loft Lamps: Controller Loft Lamp (Floor): Responder # Master Bath Closet: Master Bath Closet: Controller MBathS Master Bath Closet: Controller # Master Bath Lamp (Left): Master Bath Lamp (Left): Responder MBathS Master Bath Lamp (Left: Controller # Master Bath Lamp (Right): Master Bath Lamp (Right): Responder MBathS Master Bath Lamp (Righ: Controller # Master Bath Vent: MBathS Master Bath Vent: Controller Master Bath Vent: Controller # Master Bedroom Lamp (Accent: Master Bedroom Lamp (Accent): Responder MBedPB Master Bedroom Lamp (A: Controller MBedPD Master Bedroom Lamp (A: Controller MBedBL Master Bedroom Lamp (A: Controller # Master Bedroom Lamp (Desk): MBedPB Master Bedroom Lamp (D: Controller Master Bedroom Lamp (Desk): Responder MBedPD Master Bedroom Lamp (D: Controller MBedBL Master Bedroom Lamp (D: Controller # Master Bedroom Lamps (Bedsi: MBedPB Master Bedroom Lamps (: Controller MBedPD Master Bedroom Lamps (: Controller Master Bedroom Lamps (Bedside: Controller # Master Bedroom Overhead: MBedPB Master Bedroom Overhea: Controller MBedPD Master Bedroom Overhea: Controller Master Bedroom Overhead: Controller # Office Lamps: Office Lamp (Chair): Responder OO Office Lamps: Controller # Stairway Overhead: Stairway Overhead: Controller Stairway Overhead: Controller Dining Room: Dining Room Overhead: Responder DRO Dining Room Lamps: Responder DRO Dining Room: Controller FO Dining Room: Controller Dining Room Lamps: Responder LRP Dining Room: Controller Dusk: MBedPD Master Bedroom Overhea: Responder MBedPD Master Bedroom Lamps (: Responder Loft Lamp (Sofa): Responder MBedPD Master Bedroom: Responder MBedPD Master Bath: Responder Stairway Overhead: Responder MBedPD Dusk: Controller KS Kitchen Hallway Overhead: Responder MBedPD Night: Responder SO Loft: Responder MBedPD Master Bedroom Lamp (D: Responder MBedPD Master Bedroom Lamp (A: Responder Kitchen Sink: Responder Living Room Lamp (Chair): Responder Master Bedroom Lamp (Desk): Responder LHO Night: Responder LHO Dusk: Controller LHO Loft Hallway Lamp: Responder LHO Loft Lamps: Responder Loft Hallway Overhead: Responder LRP Living Room: Responder Foyer Overhead: Responder OPatio Night: Responder OPatio Dusk: Controller LP Loft: Responder FO Foyer Lamp: Responder OPatio Kitchen Under Cabinet: Responder Master Bath Lamp (Right): Responder FO Foyer: Responder OPatio Kitchen: Responder FO Living Room: Responder LRP Night: Responder FO Dining Room: Responder Outdoor Patio: Responder Master Bedroom Lamps (Bedside: Responder LRP Living Room Lamp (Sofa): Responder LRP Dusk: Controller MBedBL Night: Responder LRP Living Room Spotlight: Responder MBedBL Dusk: Controller LRP Living Room Lamp (Chair): Responder LRP Dining Room: Responder MBedBL Master Bedroom Lamp (D: Responder LRP Living Room Overhead: Responder MBedBL Master Bedroom Lamp (A: Responder MBedO Foyer: Responder MBedO Kitchen: Responder MBedO Master Bath: Responder MBedO Master Bedroom: Responder LP Loft Lamp (Floor): Responder Kitchen U/C (Sink): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Accent): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Chairs): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Sofa): Responder Master Bath Sinks: Responder Master Bedroom Overhead: Responder Half Bath Lamp: Responder MBathS Master Bath Lamp (Left: Responder LP Dusk: Controller MBathS Master Bath Lamp (Righ: Responder LP Night: Responder Kitchen Hallway Overhead: Responder KHO Kitchen: Responder KHO Dusk: Controller KHO Half Bath: Responder KHO Night: Responder Loft Hallway Lamp: Responder Outdoor Porch: Responder OPorch Kitchen: Responder OPorch Outdoor: Responder HBathS Half Bath: Responder HBathS Dusk: Controller HBathS Night: Responder OPorch Night: Responder HBathS Half Bath Lamp: Responder Half Bath Sink: Responder KS Kitchen: Responder KS Kitchen Under Cabinet: Responder MBathO Master Bath: Responder Master Bath Overhead: Responder MBathO Night: Responder MBathO Master Bedroom: Responder MBathO Dusk: Controller Living Room Overhead: Responder Loft Lamp (Floor): Responder Loft Lamp (Chairs): Responder Loft Overhead: Responder LO Loft: Responder Living Room Lamp (Sofa): Responder GBedP Night: Responder Outdoor Wallwashers (Back): Responder GBedP Dusk: Controller GO Master Bedroom: Responder Living Room Spotlight: Responder GO Kitchen: Responder GO Night: Responder GO Dusk: Controller Loft Lamp (Accent): Responder Stairway Overhead: Responder OO Loft: Responder Outdoor Wallwashers (Front): Responder MBedPB Master Bedroom Overhea: Responder Master Bedroom Lamp (Accent): Responder MBedPB Master Bedroom Lamps (: Responder MBedPB Master Bedroom Lamp (D: Responder MBedPB Master Bedroom Lamp (A: Responder MBedPB Master Bedroom: Responder MBedPB Master Bath: Responder MBedPB Dusk: Controller MBedPB Night: Responder Foyer Lamp: Responder Dining Room Lamps: Responder Master Bath Lamp (Left): Responder GBedO Loft: Responder Dining Room Overhead: Responder DRO Dining Room Lamps: Responder DRO Dining Room: Responder Kitchen U/C (Range): Responder DRO Dusk: Controller DRO Night: Responder Foyer: MBedO Foyer: Controller Foyer Overhead: Responder FO Foyer Lamp: Responder FO Foyer: Controller Foyer Lamp: Responder Guest Bath: LP Guest Bath: Controller GBathS Guest Bath Lamp: Responder GBathS Guest Bath: Controller GBedP Guest Bath: Controller Guest Bath Sink: Responder GBedO Guest Bath: Controller OO Guest Bath: Controller SO Guest Bath: Controller LO Guest Bath: Controller Guest Bedroom: GBedP Guest Bedroom Lamp (Rea: Responder GBathS Guest Bedroom: Controller GBedP Guest Bedroom Lamp (Bed: Responder GBedP Guest Bedroom Overhead: Responder GBedO Guest Bedroom: Controller GBedP Guest Bedroom: Controller GBedO Guest Bedroom Lamps: Responder Guest Bedroom Lamp (Reading): Responder Guest Bedroom Lamp (Bedside): Responder Guest Bedroom Overhead: Responder SO Guest Bedroom: Controller LO Guest Bedroom: Controller Half Bath: HBathS Half Bath Lamp: Responder Half Bath Sink: Responder HBathS Half Bath: Controller KHO Half Bath: Controller Half Bath Lamp: Responder Kitchen: KS Kitchen: Controller MBedO Kitchen: Controller KS Kitchen Under Cabinet: Responder OPorch Kitchen: Controller GO Kitchen: Controller Kitchen U/C (Range): Responder OPatio Kitchen Under Cabinet: Responder OPatio Kitchen: Controller KHO Kitchen: Controller Kitchen U/C (Sink): Responder Kitchen Sink: Responder Living Room: LRP Living Room: Controller Living Room Spotlight: Responder Living Room Lamp (Chair): Responder FO Living Room: Controller LRP Living Room Lamp (Sofa): Responder LRP Living Room Spotlight: Responder Living Room Overhead: Responder LRP Living Room Lamp (Chair): Responder Living Room Lamp (Sofa): Responder LRP Living Room Overhead: Responder Loft: Loft Lamp (Sofa): Responder LP Loft: Controller Loft Lamp (Chairs): Responder Stairway Overhead: Responder Loft Overhead: Responder Stairway Overhead: Responder SO Loft: Controller LO Loft: Controller OO Loft: Controller Loft Hallway Lamp: Responder Loft Lamp (Accent): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Floor): Responder GBedO Loft: Controller LP Loft Lamp (Accent): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Chairs): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Sofa): Responder LHO Loft Hallway Lamp: Responder LHO Loft Lamps: Responder Loft Hallway Overhead: Responder Loft Lamp (Floor): Responder Master Bath: MBathO Master Bath: Controller MBedO Master Bath: Controller Master Bath Overhead: Responder Master Bath Lamp (Left): Responder Master Bath Lamp (Right): Responder MBedPD Master Bath: Controller MBedPB Master Bath: Controller Master Bath Sinks: Responder MBathS Master Bath Lamp (Left: Responder MBathS Master Bath Lamp (Righ: Responder Master Bedroom: MBedPD Master Bedroom Overhea: Responder MBedPD Master Bedroom Lamps (: Responder MBedPD Master Bedroom: Controller Master Bedroom Lamps (Bedside: Responder MBedPD Master Bedroom Lamp (D: Responder MBedPD Master Bedroom Lamp (A: Responder MBedBL Master Bedroom Lamp (D: Responder MBedBL Master Bedroom Lamp (A: Responder Master Bedroom Lamp (Accent): Responder MBedPB Master Bedroom Overhea: Responder MBedPB Master Bedroom Lamps (: Responder MBedPB Master Bedroom Lamp (D: Responder MBedPB Master Bedroom Lamp (A: Responder MBedO Master Bedroom: Controller GO Master Bedroom: Controller Master Bedroom Lamp (Desk): Responder MBathO Master Bedroom: Controller MBedPB Master Bedroom: Controller Master Bedroom Overhead: Responder Night: OPatio Night: Controller FO Foyer Lamp: Responder LRP Night: Controller MBedPD Night: Controller Foyer Lamp: Responder MBedBL Night: Controller Outdoor Wallwashers (Front): Responder DRO Night: Controller KHO Night: Controller Outdoor Wallwashers (Back): Responder GBedP Night: Controller MBathO Night: Controller GO Night: Controller Loft Lamp (Accent): Responder LP Loft Lamp (Accent): Responder LHO Night: Controller HBathS Night: Controller OPorch Night: Controller MBedPB Night: Controller LP Night: Controller Office: Office Overhead: Responder GBathS Office: Controller Office Lamp (Chair): Responder SO Office: Controller LO Office: Controller OO Office: Controller OO Office Lamps: Responder Outdoor: Outdoor Wallwashers (Back): Responder Outdoor Porch: Responder OPorch Outdoor: Controller Outdoor Patio: Responder Outdoor Wallwashers (Front): Responder Link to comment
DaveGee Posted March 31, 2008 Share Posted March 31, 2008 slooplinc's neighbors talking at a neighborhood block party... So!! The lights dim up and down at dusk at your house too? Boy that weird!! Sorry, just looking at all the devices in that dusk scene made my eyes water... thats all... Dave Link to comment
sloop Posted March 31, 2008 Author Share Posted March 31, 2008 lol - it is hella lots - but all of them ramp up to between 20-40% - most in there are secondary keypad buttons (i have like 24 keypads) - only about 35 are loads funny thing about the neighbors - before i got the isy and was trying to make this stuff work, i was using what the manual called 'grouping' - you have to link (walking around - and up and down the stairs) each button to the other in both the on and off state - so to have 2 secondary buttons grouped button 1 on - link to button 2 button 1 off - link to button 2 button 2 on - link to button 1 button 2 off - link to button 1 of course when a link is created the load lights flash my dusk scene has 14 secondary buttons acting as controllers - which was lots of walking and flashing (my night scene does too) - i had a neighbor that i did not know come to the door and ask if everything was ok the isy has done away with all that - remarkable little box and the only way to go if you go the insteon route i took a backup of my isy before starting the restore devices - i am guessing it will take all night to perform - i think i started it about 21:00 central Link to comment
sloop Posted March 31, 2008 Author Share Posted March 31, 2008 about 5 hours in and i am at 9% with zero errors so far Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted March 31, 2008 Share Posted March 31, 2008 sloop, It's about 30 hours and where are we? With kind regards, Michel about 5 hours in and i am at 9% with zero errors so far Link to comment
sloop Posted March 31, 2008 Author Share Posted March 31, 2008 well it failed some time last night - the last time i woke up and checked it was probably around 6:00 - so will doing each device accomplish the same thing? Link to comment
Guest Posted March 31, 2008 Share Posted March 31, 2008 well it failed some time last night - the last time i woke up and checked it was probably around 6:00 - so will doing each device accomplish the same thing? I had to do individual restores as well. I found it was best to factory reset all of the devices once again before going down that road. I posted in another thread where one device lost its link table due to a static discharge or something similar. I kept trying to restore and got comm failure after comm failure for about 10 or 15 tries. I then remembered I never did a reset. Once I reset it I restored it immediatly on the first try. I met an engineer over the weekend on a Boy Scout trip. The father of another scout. We somehow got around to automation and I mentioned the comm failure and this came up as a "wierd example". His opinion never having played with it was that it is not a signal strength problem but a "data flow management" failure. His "guess" is that the PLM does not manage the data flow well and looses track of who is still being talked to and all hell breaks loose. He came to that conclusion in part he said because device to device is ok, individual messages are ok, but a mass query or multiple messages one after another causes the comm failures (such as programming, system query, or multiple commands). Another example I used was that when my ELK system arms away and its dark out the away lighting causes the lights to flash because of comm failures from apparently to many lights being told to change status at once. I saw that with the PLC once also but the ELK put a 1/2 second or 1 second pause in between commands and it fixed that. Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted March 31, 2008 Share Posted March 31, 2008 Hi sloop, What failed exactly? With kind regards, Michel well it failed some time last night - the last time i woke up and checked it was probably around 6:00 - so will doing each device accomplish the same thing? Link to comment
sloop Posted March 31, 2008 Author Share Posted March 31, 2008 i got no other message other than it failed - i don't think i touched anything while it was doing the restore - so i unplugged the lights i could from the appliancelincs before going to bed - left the rest on - but i am betting i would forget and touch something if i had to wait 30 or more hours - i am doing them one at a time now - i have 2 signallincs online - the one that was causing the failing devices is sitting on the floor the restores of the individual devices is going well - i will test when complete - does the plm need to be restored? Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted March 31, 2008 Share Posted March 31, 2008 sloop, You do not have to redo everything. I should have mentioned that request failed is only for the failed device and thus others should be working properly. Do you know which one(s) failed? With kind regards, Michel i got no other message other than it failed - i don't think i touched anything while it was doing the restore - so i unplugged the lights i could from the appliancelincs before going to bed - left the rest on - but i am betting i would forget and touch something if i had to wait 30 or more hours - i am doing them one at a time now - i have 2 signallincs online - the one that was causing the failing devices is sitting on the floor the restores of the individual devices is going well - i will test when complete - does the plm need to be restored? Link to comment
sloop Posted March 31, 2008 Author Share Posted March 31, 2008 it did not say - just the red failed message i noticed on the list of devices (network view i guess) that the status for many had changed from off to on (not a percentage but the word on) - the lights were off one light in my loft turned on during the restore - it looked like it was 100% on - i left it on while the restore process continued Link to comment
Illusion Posted April 1, 2008 Share Posted April 1, 2008 Sloop, I just completely cracked up when I scrolled down your scene list and hit that dusk scene. I am in North Texas as well (Carrollton), and my power had several hiccups right around dusk, I am thinking that you are to blame. You are an excellent case study for the whole Insteon concept as well as the ISY! Link to comment
sloop Posted April 1, 2008 Author Share Posted April 1, 2008 lol - i keep sayin i have a mack daddy scene that is probably asking way too much of insteon - they never mentioned that when i bought all the craplincs - lol in the dark ages (before the isy), i set all those scenes up (as recommended by smarthome) using houselinc - had to use x10 to sync the buttons - it was thousands of lines of whatever they called their programs - when it would not work, they said to add a delay between every command (which i did) i think these signallincs are causing my comm errors - i got an error twice restoring my dining room keypad - so i placed a different signallinc in the room and the restore worked - i started restoring the upstairs devices and the errors started again - so i removed the signallinc again and the errors went away i hate this guessing stuff with insteon - but i should be able to get these last devices restored - then i'll test the operation some Link to comment
Guest Posted April 1, 2008 Share Posted April 1, 2008 lol - i keep sayin i have a mack daddy scene that is probably asking way too much of insteon - they never mentioned that when i bought all the craplincs - lol in the dark ages (before the isy), i set all those scenes up (as recommended by smarthome) using houselinc - had to use x10 to sync the buttons - it was thousands of lines of whatever they called their programs - when it would not work, they said to add a delay between every command (which i did) i think these signallincs are causing my comm errors - i got an error twice restoring my dining room keypad - so i placed a different signallinc in the room and the restore worked - i started restoring the upstairs devices and the errors started again - so i removed the signallinc again and the errors went away i hate this guessing stuff with insteon - but i should be able to get these last devices restored - then i'll test the operation some I was also told to add a delay between commands by SH as I think was ELK which resolved the ELK problem when using the PLC. Kind of goes with what I stated in my previous post that the comm ailures could be a data flow problem. As long as SH fixes it soon it really doesn't matter. Link to comment
Illusion Posted April 1, 2008 Share Posted April 1, 2008 Sloop, I dumped my whole system two days ago as well, to make a absolutely clean transfer to the ISY from Indigo (Mac). While I do not have as many devices in my whole system as you do in one room, I had the same problems with "Restore Devices". I put my neighbor on Insteon as well (I set up and control her lights through my ISY). I started doing a network query to see which devices were having comm problems. I went to my neighbors house and got one of her access points to add to my system during this "Fresh Start". The difference was remarkable. I was not able to get a failure in the network query when I added this one additional access point to the circuit I was having the most trouble with. When I am not doing data intensive operations like query or restore, my setup seems to be flawless, but for some reason restore and query cause problems. Before I borrowed the access point, I did have some luck doing a restore on single devices at a time instead of the whole network. Also, to others, do not waste time posting about how I should have tried moving my existing two access points first. I did lots of that, and I have a chart of every light and outlet with a phase notation from the days of pure X-10. I would dump the signalincs and get access points. At least with an access point you can test the function of the device with a remotelinc and have some confirmation that it is not craplinc. Link to comment
sloop Posted April 1, 2008 Author Share Posted April 1, 2008 accesspoints might help - my problem is that smarthome has always told me that spending more money with them will fix my every problem - then when it does not, the advice is to spend yet more money with them - as best i recall, i am in for $4,800 so far - it takes a long time to get through my head stuff that should be obvious, but i have finally learned that spending more with them is throwing good money after bad i thought about calling smarthome and putting it back on them to prove my signallincs are working properly - but i am convinced they have no method to test them any more than i do with my 'try this and see if it seems better' method another thing that puzzles me is that my x10 signals worked great - i did have a dryer phase coupler with x10 - but since there is not one for insteon, i have these signallincs - frustrating Link to comment
Illusion Posted April 1, 2008 Share Posted April 1, 2008 My X-10 to that circuit always worked great as well (Panel mounted coupler/amplifier). The only thing that I can think of is that A1 A ON is a pretty pathitic amount of data, and I am guessing that restore and query are massively more data intensive and therefore require a little more robust data path. Where are you buying your Insteon if not from SH? Where is this place a couple burbs over that answers their phone at 1am? Link to comment
sloop Posted April 1, 2008 Author Share Posted April 1, 2008 yep - automated outlet - maybe i will attend one of the north texas user group meetings the guy told me about - i am sure any purchases i make in a moment of weakness will be from them - especially now that so many people that have purchased from smarthome have had strange charges to their credit card accounts - and smarthome won't release any statement about it i have read good things about the way they handle problems - i bought some of my relays from home depot and evidently, they will have no warranty i have most of my devices restored now - only 4 keypads left - the plm is on that circuit - and i am getting failures - i placed the signallinc on the circuit and they seem to be working now i agreee that the setup process does lots of writing on the powerline - and the operation of scenes sends fewer commands - but like all insteon devices, its unreasonable to expect too much from them (like mack daddy scenes) - lol Link to comment
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