Is Insteon Dead?

[robandcathy1]

Just wondering if this platform is dead because everything I see is greared towards Z-Wave.

[larryllix]

Nahh. It's just old hat for some.

 

Upward and onward!

[stusviews]

Where are you looking?

[Teken]

Just wondering if this platform is dead because everything I see is greared towards Z-Wave.

Not dead in any sense of the word and has expanded into many retail channels. Having said this, they are very much isolated in terms of being the sole vendor / supplier.

 

 

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[Brian H]

I agree with Teken. It is far from dead but having to bend to Smartlabs whims. Can put a damper on things.

[Teken]

I agree with Teken. It is far from dead but having to bend to Smartlabs whims. Can put a damper on things.

And to be fair to smarthome / Insteon. They continue to have the best looking devices in the market place.

 

They also have consistently released new products based on consumer feedback. As far as I recall they also offer the longest warranty period of any HA maker.

 

I do wish they brought back the optional 7 year extended warranty. That would be very worth while insurance coverage for such a massive investment into one single vendor.

 

They have also made business links with Microsoft to be their primary HA vendor of choice in the now crowded HA scene.

 

 

 

 

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[mrbudin]

There's a lot of thing to be done for Insteon/Smarthome. They should go global.

 

- Fully support international user for all of their products include IO Linc, PLM...

- New management software (They should buy ISY and develop it)

- Improve mobile app

[Xathros]

- New management software (They should buy ISY and develop it)

 

NOOOOOO!!!

 

UDI should keep the ISY and continue development.  There is nobody better for that task.

 

-Xathros

[mrbudin]

In my opinion, ISY development is limited since they are separate.

[Teken]

In my opinion, ISY development is limited since they are separate.

 

There's a lot of thing to be done for Insteon/Smarthome. They should go global.

 

- Fully support international user for all of their products include IO Linc, PLM...

- New management software (They should buy ISY and develop it)

- Improve mobile app

 

UDI in partnership is making a global PLM so that is one piece off the books. Smarthome has an extremely piss poor record in developing their own software on any regular basis.

 

They never interact, relay, or apprise any consumer of feature enhancements, bug fix's, or deprecation of features. If the ISY was to ever be purchased by Smarthome the development of said product would be stalled.

 

A complete wall of silence and lack of consumer interaction would prevail. HL / HUB is the perfect example of piss poor development and inclusion.

 

One has to ask themselves: How can the maker of a product not support their own devices??? Lastly, UDI has single handily resolved years of bugs, broken features, and added capabilities that Insteon / Smarthome has failed to provide.

 

Its safe to say tens of thousands of end users have stayed with Insteon because UDI and its product has provided a gateway that makes the insteon ecosystem manageable, reliable, and powerful beyond its current limits.

 

No other company has championed such innovation for Insteon, none. 

[Brian H]

UDI provides such great support.  Smarthome has developed reputation for poor customer service wait times and actual good answers.

UDI should never be merged with Smarthome-Smartlabs.

[oberkc]

I was thinking, instead, that UD should buy smartlabs.

[Teken]

I was thinking, instead, that UD should buy smartlabs.

 

If there was a kickstarter movement to that end I would be first in line. 

[Xathros]

I would rather see UDI buy Insteon. Smarthome can run themselves into the ground selling random junk for more than its worth and let UDI take Insteon into the future.

 

 

-Xathros

 

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[oberkc]

Yes...not smartHOME...smartLABS. I thought smartlabs was entirely focused on insteon. Maybe I was wrong.

 

But whatever the case, yes, UDI should purchase INSTEON.

[Xathros]

Yes...not smartHOME...smartLABS. I thought smartlabs was entirely focused on insteon. Maybe I was wrong.

 

But whatever the case, yes, UDI should purchase INSTEON.

I tend to see Smarthome and Smartlabs as one in the same but I believe you are correct about Smartlabs being Insteon only.  My gut tells me they are two divisions of a single entity.

 

-Xathros

[Brian H]

They have the same address. Just different contract numbers and executives. Joe Dada is the chairman or founder of both branches.

 

http://investing.businessweek.com/research/stocks/private/snapshot.asp?privcapId=6725700

 

http://investing.businessweek.com/research/stocks/private/snapshot.asp?privcapId=39270467

[Teken]

At the end of the day Joe Dada needs to expand the development of Insteon to other third party manufactures. I am afraid the boat has sailed away in that respect so its just wishful thinking on my part. 

 

This is probably one of the main drivers for UDI to expand into supporting another HA protocol. This lets them enter into a new space and garner adoption from existing / new users in, or, entering the HA space.

 

This obviously reduces their dependence and lively hood on just one single vendor should they ever collapse. 

[larryllix]

Better to have some control on the quality of many products in the Insteon line like thermostats and PLMs that have bad reputations.

 

 If UDI bought Insteon, much of the future market may not develop, as many are afraid of single-sourced products and won't touch them. I have already run into negative comments on cocoontech about Insteon being single-sourced. I understand the fear factor there for professional installers.

 

Now if UDI could get rights to spec Insteon products with a superior spec it could work except that I believe X10 already failed at that that and people just shop by price anyway.

[Teken]

Better to have some control on the quality of many products in the Insteon line like thermostats and PLMs that have bad reputations.

 

 If UDI bought Insteon, much of the future market may not develop, as many are afraid of single-sourced products and won't touch them. I have already run into negative comments on cocoontech about Insteon being single-sourced. I understand the fear factor there for professional installers.

 

Now if UDI could get rights to spec Insteon products with a superior spec it could work except that I believe X10 already failed at that that and people just shop by price anyway.

 

In the near term, most people are too stupid to think that far about a single vendor being the only game in town and how it could impact them.

 

In the long term, for those for an eye toward the future this is a concern.

 

But, the reality is that SH / Insteon has done extremely well over the last eight years to grow the market. The simple fact that they have with stood eight years and has shown solid growth and capable of releasing at least one new product a year shows great promise.

 

Most know me to be the first one to throw SH / Insteon under the bus when important issues are present. But people also know I am also quick to lay praise when they get it right. With the ever expansion of Insteon in local stores and retail outlets this shows focus and success in market penetration.

 

They are currently sold by Walmart, Costco, Home Depot, Best Buys, Tiger Direct, Future Shop, Sears, and Amazon. The sticking point for me and many others is the companies lack of support from third party vendors. I don't care who they partner with so long as it shows their willingness to grow the Insteon protocol and allow more device options.

 

When I see Cooper, Leviton, GE, etc all support and develop Z-Wave devices never mind the other dozen of companies also producing said devices. It has to make you take pause as to what the hell Joe Dada is thinking and where he expects Insteon to be in the next ten years.

 

Skylink besides Simplehome that makes those 1980 devices are the only 3rd party vendors since day one. Yes, people can say Morning Lock Industry is also a vendor but they aren't as it requires a secondary device to couple its lock. 

 

The only bright light I saw was Joe Dada pushing into the EU markets. Even this has been piss poor in deployment and the offerings for said markets.

 

People can say its because of testing, regulations, etc. 

 

Its not, its the lack of focus and having the common sense to release at the very least the basics for people to use and gain mass adoption. This time (3 years ago) I stated the same issues.

 

No Global PLM: This was and has been the massive fail of Joe Dada and his team. It has only been after three years the light bulb in someones head said

 

* Hey you know those guys at UDI? They sure are making a good impression with our product and thousands of people are asking when they can use a ISY *

 

The reality is SH decided to deploy their HUB as a method to get into new markets and didn't want to share the global pie with anyone else as it is with their protocol. If that wasn't true don't you think every third party vendor would have jumped on board eight years ago??

 

As painful as it has been over the last eight years this massive train wreck is being directed in the right direction. A global PLM is being developed in concert with UDI.

 

Thank God!

 

But, much work and progress must be made bring back a few key things that will keep the company and the Insteon protocol strong and successful.

 

1. Engage third party vendors to adopt and make Insteon devices.

2. Expand the Insteon device list offerings to all EU / International markets.

3. Bring on some real programmers and provide them the tools, resources, and financing to develop the HUB / House Linc.

 

4. Bring back the optional 7 year extended warranty.

5. Reduce the prices on some of the key components and stop listing the initial prices in asinine dollar levels.

6. Stop selling the pure and utter crap on Smarthome that has been priced out of this world when they are dollar store items.

 

7. Release more devices on the *Wish List* because its been proven they do sell! 

 

ie. Smoke Bridge, Leak Sensor, Mini Remote, etc

[mwester]

If Insteon isn't dead, they're almost dead.

 

They have a handful of products that everyone needs, and generally work pretty well -- switchlincs, keypadlincs, and perhaps the appliancelinc. And some of us on this forum have spend literally a thousands dollars or more on these devices.

 

But lately they seem to be investing enormous effort and dollars in what seem to be "flash in the pan" or "grown-up toys" -- and while I too find it "neat" to be able to turn on lights from a cell phone, once someone gets over that novelty, it's hardly compelling anymore.  The concept of the "hub" is a disaster waiting to happen - I just cannot understand how people think that placing control over their homes on some unknown third-party server in an unknown datacenter with no terms-of-service published anywhere would be a good idea!

 

From a marketing point of view, I just don't see that those who would purchase these recent "toy" starter kits are going to be the ones that will spend upwards of 4 figures with Insteon.  I think it's a good idea to expand into that market, but Insteon seems to be doing so at the cost of losing a lot of business from those who are willing to spend a lot more dollars with them -- that includes everyone on this forum, who ended up buying a device from UDI to manage their Insteon devices!  Someone at Insteon needs to understand that almost every ISY sold represents money that Insteon *didn't* get.  I'm reminded of the attitudes in Detroit when the Japanese automobiles started to eat into their sales -- and look how that ended for those Detroit automakers.

 

Their abandonment of HouseLinc software is telling -- that bit of software should be a vital tool for everyone who owns Insteon gear, but they don't even support a device they introduced over a year ago!  The only valid explanation for that is that they lack the staff and capital to update it.

 

Finally, note the sales end of things -- the junk that Smarthome sells.

 

All of this paints a picture that says that Insteon is going to be taking a huge fall relatively soon.  I personally think the core technology is good enough that someone will buy the patents and designs and we'll see Insteon-compatible products in the future.

 

So I'm delighted to see the focus on Z-Wave stuff -- it's future-proofed my home-automation to a great degree, by offering me an alternate to Insteon.

[oberkc]

Someone at Insteon needs to understand that almost every ISY sold represents money that Insteon *didn't* get.

 

On the other hand, were it not for the ISY, I probably would not have purchased so many other insteon devices, so smarthome wins here.  I assume this is a mutually beneficial relationship.

 

the junk that Smarthome sells.

 

Yes, as suggested by others, this cannot help but degrade the perception of insteon.

[larryllix]

If Insteon was dead where would we go? After reading about other systems we could do a lot worse than a few junky quality units and lack of variety in modules.

 

ISY contributes a lot to the quality of Insteon systems. I started with a Hub, sent it back as soon as I fired it up and realised how limited it was.

[Guest Digger]

If Insteon was dead where would we go? After reading about other systems we could do a lot worse than a few junky quality units and lack of variety in modules.

 

ISY contributes a lot to the quality of Insteon systems. I started with a Hub, sent it back as soon as I fired it up and realised how limited it was.

If SH goes belly up you can get the Zwave module and any new device can be Zwave. Basically UDI is helping protect your investment in Insteon with the Zwave module.

 

 

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[larryllix]

If SH goes belly up you can get the Zwave module and any new device can be Zwave. Basically UDI is helping protect your investment in Insteon with the Zwave module.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I already have a box full of X10 modules. Insteon was many steps better than X10. From the talk on forums about Z-Wave it sounds no better than X10.