shannong Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 I use KPLs sparingly and never for lights in common areas that are turned On/Off with frequency, especially if it's the light you need to turn on when entering a darkened room. If necessary, I install a MicroDimmer to drive the load that is controlled by a Switchlinc so that these common lights always have a paddle instead of poking a Chiclet key. This keeps all the common functions of the house friendly for the GF, kids, and guests. KPLs are only used for auxiliary lights and advanced functions. I desperately wish there was an Insteon multi-paddle switch something like this. Link to comment
416to305 Posted January 11, 2015 Author Share Posted January 11, 2015 I actually like them a lot more now especially with the color on them. I just found they were two plane before and people didn't really immediately stopped to look at them when trying to turn the light on, but when they are colorful they stand out more and using a dark background with white text and keeping the LED brightness to 1 while off 15 on makes a big difference. It's interesting because it's almost like there is a psychology behind it, because you don't want it too complicated but it's a waste of money to just have it be a fancy three-way switch. so they are tricky, finding the right spot that will be easy for people to use and that actually provides value. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment
stusviews Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 shannong, this is a 3-device KPL. The top and bottom buttons control the wire load, the middle two (large) buttons each toggle a linked load. I used a 6-device KPL and "linked" button A&B and C&D. Or you could have two On-only and two Off-only buttons. Currently, the only device that controls more than one load is the On/Off Outlet. Link to comment
shannong Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 shannong, this is a 3-device KPL. The top and bottom buttons control the wire load, the middle two (large) buttons each toggle a linked load. I used a 6-device KPL and "linked" button A&B and C&D. Or you could have two On-only and two Off-only buttons. Currently, the only device that controls more than one load is the On/Off Outlet. Thanks for sharing. I've converted a KPL to 7-button for one specific use. The KPLs are really flexible that way. My issue is that Chiclet push buttons aren't functional for lights entering/exiting a room. There's a reason mechanical lights are made as switches/paddles. Easy to operate from any angle without looking and you have immediate tactile feedback that it was operated based on its new position. When I walk quickly in/out of a room I want to whack a paddle switch as I'm cruising without looking. Not stop and aim my finger at near 90 degrees to punch a button and/or rotate my body towards the switch. Also, it's difficult to operate a push button if the switch is on the same side as your freehand. If you're carrying something in your left hand and the push button for the light is on the right it's challenging to bend your wrist to the right and extend your index finger at 90 degrees to push the button as you walk by. Link to comment
bleepblorp Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Hi everyone, here's an example of what I am talking about on two of them. Nice job! Those do look good. I do have a set of the clear buttons that I didn't care for originally. I'll take another look at this. Link to comment
416to305 Posted January 11, 2015 Author Share Posted January 11, 2015 Thanks bleep, I like them now, and leaving the off level at 1 and on at 15 is cool too since they always have a neat glow from them. I almost returned the clear buttons as well but it's definitely in the paper. I used actual photo paper and an ink jet printer which I think looks better than the black on white. They are a tall rectangle, but it's hard to get it exact on the computer, so I just used Pages for Mac and made them the rough size after I had the general font size down, and then right now I just print them and keep trimming to fit. Was going to make a better template eventually but started getting easy without. If you use regular paper they look awful since the lights show the fibres through it. To the others, I agree about the mechanical switch, that's why I hated the KPLs, but like I said in my last post, they seem to work best as supplementary control to a switchlinc like I have on my 2. Link to comment
shannong Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 I've had mixed success with the custom etched KPL buttons. I think I'll try the clear button covers with picture paper in the laserjet. Link to comment
larryllix Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Hey everyone this is more of an electrical question but I just had a quick question that I figured someone here would know. In my bathroom I have a keypad in there and there is a separate switch which is for the shower. I just have an Insteon LED bald in there currently as I had a spare. It's been nice having it come on at the same time as the main light and so on. Problem of course is that it is easy to accidentally turn the shower switch off and then of course the ISY cannot control it. Is it safe or possible to use a marette and just bundle the white and black that goes into that switch to gather and talked about behind the switch basically disabling the manual switch? That way the load is always on and it is controlled by the ISY etc? Or is that typically against code? Thanks! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Get some white PVC tape in the electrical dept. at The Borg ($0.99 Home Depot) and tape the white Decora switch On. It can't be noticed more than a 0.5m (US=foot) away. I have used this on my MS units to make blind spots. Lamp fixtures require a switch ahead of them in order to change the bulb safely. You will be standing in a wet shower changing a live bulb. (Will it explode the first time power is applied? Internally shorted? Maybe it really is a 12 volt bulb for a trailer and it won't like 120vac.) The Marrette (wire nut) is fine as long as any connections remain accessible, which they would be with a blank off plate or dummy switch in front of it. Get the tape. Link to comment
416to305 Posted January 11, 2015 Author Share Posted January 11, 2015 Thanks, I actually changed things around and had a better use for that keypad downstairs so now my bathroom is all z-wave and nothing in the shower. I only had died in the shower because I really had no other use for it but I figured something better out that I can do with it so back to manual control for the shower. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment
larryllix Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 I actually like them a lot more now especially with the color on them. I just found they were two plane before and people didn't really immediately stopped to look at them when trying to turn the light on, but when they are colorful they stand out more and using a dark background with white text and keeping the LED brightness to 1 while off 15 on makes a big difference. It's interesting because it's almost like there is a psychology behind it, because you don't want it too complicated but it's a waste of money to just have it be a fancy three-way switch. so they are tricky, finding the right spot that will be easy for people to use and that actually provides value. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk It is the audience that makes the difference. Home owners will become familiar with their own switches after some time but now guests can be told, "Push the red button on, please." Nice! Link to comment
416to305 Posted January 12, 2015 Author Share Posted January 12, 2015 One thing that's cool with them is at night especially I have the off level set to brightness 1 and on to 15, but because they are colored, they actually look like a touch screen until you go right up to it. The nice thing with these too is the clear buttons pop off super easily, you don't even need to remove the frame of the KPL or anything, just use a knife or screw driver and pop it off. So it's handy because you could even have an extra set of them and change them seasonally, like Christmas Lights, things like that. Link to comment
MikeD Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 Hi Lee, Your post on labeling finally got me motivated to label my KeypadLincs. I only been using them for two years with the non-descript keys, really I knew what they did. I had added some clear buttons to one of my orders way back with the intention on doing this so I had everything needed. I originally tried a Brother labeler with 1/2 inch black on white tape. The buttons looked good but rather plain compared to what you have done. So I just had to try your idea which is something that I would have never thought of myself. I used a table set to the approximate dimensions of the buttons in Microsoft Word for the formatting. I'm still playing around with different colored backgrounds and my spouse really likes the idea of color coding the buttons by function. Now she will stop asking what 'that' button does. Thanks for sharing. ~Mike Link to comment
builderb Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 Here's what I've noticed: The 6 button KPLs are much more intuitive for n00bs when it comes to on/off controls. I agree about using paddle switches for ease of use also. I do have an 8 button by the front door for the porch light, but that light is almost always controlled via motion sensor, so I don't have issues with trying to poke it. I also use an 8 button by the bed, but those aren't used by the general public. Otherwise I try to stick to the 6 button. I haven't tried the conversion to 4 button yet, but I could definitely see doing it. Labels on your wall plates may not seem like the best aesthetic, but if there are a lot of switches, or the location of the switch doesn't automatically tell you what it controls, labels are a huge help. I have even used temporary labeling as the family gets introduced to new switches. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Link to comment
416to305 Posted January 15, 2015 Author Share Posted January 15, 2015 Thanks everyone glad you like them! Was determined to crack it and make it work. They look better in person, I find the photos make some look different sizes etc. Key is to use photo paper, glossy and an ink jet then ruler and x acto knife to shave off the edges to make them fit. 6 button are definitely more user friendly I think. I definitely found though if possible keeping the KPL as secondary has been the huge help. So 2 gang switch, switchlinc on left for the main light, KPL on the right for secondary things. I think the colors help too because they make them stand out more, where as before I found it was almost like people wouldn't even notice them. They'd immediately flip the one and only switch, not even looking at the KPLs. With the colors it's more like "Ooh what's this?". I might try later if I have time to write out a tutorial on how I did them, but they aren't too difficult to be honest. I hate ink jet printers, I have 3 of them since you always seem to get one free with a computer, but the ink is always dried out. So printed these at my other place, but haven't been there since, so just been more of a pain because I can't whip up new buttons as easily which is why I haven't finished it all yet. Link to comment
MikeD Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Here is what I have for one of my KeypadLincs. I used a paper cutter to trim the photo paper to size. Trying Icons instead of wording for the Z-Wave Schlage lock and Garage door buttons. Not quite sure if I am satisfied with the top and bottom button color scheme, they might change. ~Mike Link to comment
Teken Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Mike, That would be really hard to get used to seeing. I dunno, maybe I am more conservative than the rest of you. I believe if the icons had the same format I guess it visually would look more appealing. I am unsure what the *bubble art* that people use for some of their icon's like Smartlabs does in their Apps. But, I think that is something that needs to be considered when trying out visual themes for use. The best part of these clear covers is you can keep at it until you find something that fits your environment and aesthetic needs. Link to comment
MikeD Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Hi Teken, Yes, I know what you are saying. I am not shooting for a professional looking appearance. If my objective was to create something for display in a formal or professional environment then I would not go this route. Since my homestead is not quite the formal setting I am going more for the cool factor. The different color buttons are somewhat of a key advantage to function. I have other KPLs with the same Icons so they are easy to spot what they do. I'll admit it is not the most appealing look with different style Icons. Just having fun and throwing it out here. ~Mike Link to comment
Teken Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Hi Teken, Yes, I know what you are saying. I am not shooting for a professional looking appearance. If my objective was to create something for display in a formal or professional environment then I would not go this route. Since my homestead is not quite the formal setting I am going more for the cool factor. The different color buttons are somewhat of a key advantage to function. I have other KPLs with the same Icons so they are easy to spot what they do. I'll admit it is not the most appealing look with different style Icons. Just having fun and throwing it out here. ~Mike Mike, In reality, I am just trying to hold myself back in doing the same thing! Ha! I could see myself spending gobs of time trying to get that perfect icon to match a theme or look. Keep going as I am sure it will inspire more people to offer other variations. Link to comment
MikeD Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Teken, It does take a lot of time experimenting with different sizes, shapes and background colors. I must have printed five sheets of 4x6 photo paper so far, filling each square with different icons and fonts. Ha! I had cut little squares all over the place trying to decide which looked best! ~Mike Link to comment
shannong Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 The font is Futura. It's a commercial font which most sites charge for but keep searching you'll find it to download for free. Interesting note, UDI apparently chose to use Futura for the web page that loads the Admin Console since Smart Labs does. You'll notice that once you have Futura installed the "Please Keep This Window Open" message will be displayed with that font. I'm making mine white background to look as stock as possible. I created an Excel spreadsheet to make my buttons and practiced with regular paper to start with. I'm using bold font at 6 pt with a color that I matched as closely as I could to the stock buttons. However, custom buttons and stock buttons aren't the same shade so I picked something in between since I have mixes on my KPLs. Interestingly, the buttons are not square as I assumed. I couldn't make an Excel grid the exact size because Excel requires a minimum space at the edge before it decides to wrap text. So I had to make the grid slightly larger than the button size. After printing, I use an Exacto knife to cut out the label just inside the grid lines. I attached my spreadsheet and the TTF font file I used. There is a row for buttons with one line of text and two. I didn't fill the whole page with the squares as I would never make that many labels at once but you could easily copy paste to fill the page. Your printer might not print exactly the same as mine but it should be a good starting point to minimize your effort. KPL Template and Font.zip Link to comment
Scyto Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Adding to Mike's comment, the usual configuration when there is only one white wire and one black wires connected to a standard switch is that white is line and black is load. In my house the load and line are never white - just the neutral. Both my load and line and black. So I concur get a $10 voltage detecting pen Link to comment
Teken Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 The font is Futura. It's a commercial font which most sites charge for but keep searching you'll find it to download for free. Interesting note, UDI apparently chose to use Futura for the web page that loads the Admin Console since Smart Labs does. You'll notice that once you have Futura installed the "Please Keep This Window Open" message will be displayed with that font. I'm making mine white background to look as stock as possible. I created an Excel spreadsheet to make my buttons and practiced with regular paper to start with. I'm using bold font at 6 pt with a color that I matched as closely as I could to the stock buttons. However, custom buttons and stock buttons aren't the same shade so I picked something in between since I have mixes on my KPLs. Interestingly, the buttons are not square as I assumed. I couldn't make an Excel grid the exact size because Excel requires a minimum space at the edge before it decides to wrap text. So I had to make the grid slightly larger than the button size. After printing, I use an Exacto knife to cut out the label just inside the grid lines. I attached my spreadsheet and the TTF font file I used. There is a row for buttons with one line of text and two. I didn't fill the whole page with the squares as I would never make that many labels at once but you could easily copy paste to fill the page. Your printer might not print exactly the same as mine but it should be a good starting point to minimize your effort. Just in case those who don't know SH has a template which has the correct size for the chicklets on their sales site. Link to comment
Scyto Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Just in case those who don't know SH has a template which has the correct size for the chicklets on their sales site. Agreed, I used what SH provided and the buttons were perfect (I used all upper case). Link to comment
shannong Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Just in case those who don't know SH has a template which has the correct size for the chicklets on their sales site. Ah hell. I obviously didn't know that. Link to comment
shannong Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 I couldn't find a template. Just a PDF with pre-selected words and symbols. Teken - Do you have it or know a good search term to find it? I tried "smarthome template kpl button" and got several hits without striking gold. Link to comment
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