KeypadLinc buttons + multiple ramp rates?

[memmo]

Hello folks,

 

Just got an ISY994i and am starting to program some scenes for a dedicated home theater.

 

Setup:

 

1 x 8 button Keypadlinc -- wired directly to 4 recessed lights

1 x InlineLinc - wired directly to 2 more recessed lights

1 x InlineLinc - wired to 3 recessed lights for the screen wall

1 x InlineLinc - wired to 2 lights in my rear riser/seating platform

1 x InlineLinc - wired to 2 wall sconces

 

I have everything added and and just running into a few weird things happening.

 

1. I created an "Entrance" scene where all the ceiling lights are set to 40% and the front screen wall lights are 100%.  This works nicely.  I then created a second scene called "Previews" -- where I want to dim everything to 0% over 4.5 seconds.  So on the scene page, I set everything up how I'd like it, and set 4.5 seconds for the ramp rate on all devices.  What happens however is the front stage lights take 4.5 seconds to dim as expected, but all of the ceiling lights dim much quicker (probably about 2 seconds).  I can't for the life of me figure out what is causing this.

 

2. In addition to the 2 scenes mentioned above, I have a couple more -- my intention was to have the On/Off on the KeypadLinc be the All ON/All Off scene which is what is happening.  I'm wondering now how to go about making the other buttons on the KeypadLinc initiate the other scenes?  I can't recall what was happening exactly, but I think when I tried to set it up with one of the sub-buttons, it told me the KeypadLinc was already in use as a controller and asked me if i wanted to use it as a responder.  Sorta got lost at that point.

 

Any suggestion would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks!

[Scyto]

Hi, I might be the blind leading the blind (I have my own set of issues on these devices )

 

For 1 - did you define the ramp rate at the scene level for each of the devices?  Also I notice if one does this then clicks the device under the scene the locally applied ramp rate is different.  I am unsure how these two ramp rates in the scene interact - might want to try playing?

 

For 2 - for the sub button if you want to make it control a scene you have to set it is a controller - so you would say no to the responder message.

 

FWIW this is what my topology output shows for my KPD - it is an example of where  use the ABCD buttons to control the %brightness of the load attached to the on/off load buttons (I am using the keypad dimmer)

 

http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/15314-mobilinc-connect-with-4223-not-working/

Edited February 2, 2015 by Scyto

[Techman]

memo,

 

a controller can only be used as a controller in one scene.

 

create multiple scenes with different on levels and ramp rates then use a KPL button(s) to control that scene(s)

Edited February 2, 2015 by Techman

[memmo]

memo,

 

a controller can only be used as a controller in one scene.

 

create multiple scenes with different on levels and ramp rates then use a KPL button(s) to control that scene(s)

 

That makes sense.. I guess I couldn't figure out how to get the button(s) to control the scenes(s).

 

In the scenes other than the "All ON" - the load attached to the KeypadLinc needs to be dimmed -- for example -- the "Previews" scene -- Ideally I'd like KeyPadLinc button A to trigger that scene which would mean dim everything in the scene (essentially the InlineLincs) and the load attached to the KeypadLinc itself.

[Techman]

In the scenes other than the "All ON" - the load attached to the KeypadLinc needs to be dimmed -- for example -- the "Previews" scene -- Ideally I'd like KeyPadLinc button A to trigger that scene which would mean dim everything in the scene (essentially the InlineLincs) and the load attached to the KeypadLinc itself.

 

You'll probably need to use an InlineLinc to control the load which is now on button A, then add that InlineLinc as a responder to your various scenes with each scene having unique ramp rates and dim levels for the devices.  Button "A" would then become just another controller for a scene.

[memmo]

You'll probably need to use an InlineLinc to control the load which is now on button A, then add that InlineLinc as a responder to your various scenes with each scene having unique ramp rates and dim levels for the devices.  Button "A" would then become just another controller for a scene.

 

I don't follow.. are you suggesting I would need to add an additional inlinelinc somewhere that would control the load on the 4 lights that are connected to the KeypadLinc?  I can't imagine how that would be wired. hmm...

[Techman]

yes

 

If you want to have the 4 lights controlled by different scenes with different ramp rates and dim levels then you need to have them on a device that

is a responder. Each KPL button would be a controller for a different scene with devices in the scenes as responders.

[memmo]

yes

 

If you want to have the 4 lights controlled by different scenes with different ramp rates and dim levels then you need to have them on a device that

is a responder. Each KPL button would be a controller for a different scene with devices in the scenes as responders.

 

And in this instance, the KeypadLinc can't be both a controller AND a responder correct?

 

For instance:

 

1. Hit the ON button, triggers the "All on Scene" which turns all the lights in the theater on to 100% including the 4 lights directly connected to the KeypadLinc.

 

2. Hit the A button, triggers the "Previews Scene" which say sets all lights to 10%.  With the single KeypadLinc, the A button would be the controller, but I'd need another device to DIM the lights?  Seems like an awkward setup unless I am missing something.

 

I guess the fundamental flaw in my wiring is that I have the KeypadLinc wired directly to a load?

[stusviews]

A KPL button can be both a controller and a responder. Press and hold the button to dim or brighten. Press and hold again to reverse the direction.

[Techman]

Not sure what you're referring to as the "ON" button. The 8 button KPL has buttons A - H

Are you using only one 8 button KPL or do you also have other controller(s)?

 

You could use buttons B-H, configured as controllers, to control different scenes. The "A" button which is connected to the load would only turn on the 4 lights but the "A" button can be a responder in scenes which can control whatever devces(s) are in the scene(s). In that case you wouldn't need to add an inlinelinc to the 4 lights. 

 

I hope I'm not confusing you.

Edited February 2, 2015 by Techman

[memmo]

Not sure what you're referring to as the "ON" button. The 8 button KPL has buttons A - H

Are you using only one 8 button KPL or do you also have other controller(s)?

 

You could use buttons B-H, configured as controllers, to control different scenes. The "A" button which is connected to the load would only turn on the 4 lights but the "A" button can be a responder in scenes which can control whatever devces(s) are in the scene(s). In that case you wouldn't need to add an inlinelinc to the 4 lights. 

 

I hope I'm not confusing you.

 

Tried a bit more last night and ran into a message saying that the buttons couldn't DIM -- only turn on and off.

 

Perhaps I'll try to find someone willing to spend a few minutes on Skype to help me out -- I'm happy to pay for a short consult

[oberkc]

Tried a bit more last night and ran into a message saying that the buttons couldn't DIM -- only turn on and off.

 

Perhaps I'll try to find someone willing to spend a few minutes on Skype to help me out -- I'm happy to pay for a short consult

This is consistent with my understanding. Secondary (non load controlling) buttons are either ON or OFF. They can send dim and bright commands as scene controllers, but, themselves, are either on or off.

[memmo]

This is consistent with my understanding. Secondary (non load controlling) buttons are either ON or OFF. They can send dim and bright commands as scene controllers, but, themselves, are either on or off.

 

So basically, if I understand correctly, in say my "Previews" scene, I'd add the Keypad A button as controller to trigger the scene and add the main Keypad as a responder to do the dimming?  I think I tried this but didn't get anything to work.

Edited February 3, 2015 by memmo

[BobMic]

I think this is what you are trying to do:

 

Scene 1 (push button KPL-A)

Controller/Responder – KPL- A it’s load at 20%

Responder - light 1 at 20%

Responder – light 2 at 20%

Etc

 

Scene 2 (push button KPL-B

Controller KPL-B

Responder – KPL-A load at %50

Responder – light 1 at 100%

Responder – light 2 at 80%

Etc

 

As I understand it you should be able to do this with no problem.  I have similar scenes in my set up where button ##.##.##-B controls the attached load at a different on % than the main button.  I am using mine as a 6 button so the connected load is controlled by the top and bottom buttons like a simple dimmer and the other 4 buttons are scenes that include the connected load and several other devices but I can't imagine it is any different in 8 button mode.

Edited February 5, 2015 by BobMic

[Jimbo.Automates]

And if you put KPL.B in scene 1 as a responder with level 0, then B will turn off when A is enabled.

[BobMic]

And if you put KPL.B in scene 1 as a responder with level 0, then B will turn off when A is enabled.

 

So let's see if I understand...by putting KPL-B in scene 1 as a responder you are setting the LED for button B to off when scene 1 is pressed?  That may explain why my LEDs have never done what I wanted them to do.  Is the LED on a button just a responder and the button just a controller and act independently?

 

Thanks,

Bob

[Jimbo.Automates]

Yes, when you put B in scene 1 with on level of zero it will turn off B when scene 1 is active. that is how mutually exclusive scenes work. But I don't think you can do that for A in scene 2,since a has the load. I've avoided this since I usually want the ability to control the load on its own when needed.

[BobMic]

Not an issue for me because I'm using it in 6 button mode.  I only have scenes on the 4 center buttons and use the big buttons as a standard dimmer control for the connected load.  The other thing I don't quite understand about the KPL is the toggle modes...?

 

Thanks for the tip!!

[stusviews]

There are three toggle modes: Toggle is simply push-on:push-off. The other two modes, non-toggle On and non-toggle Off sends an On or sends an Off, respectively, with every push.

[BobMic]

Thanks Jimbo and Stu.  I made a few adjustments and have the KPL working as it should.  I hope this little sidetrack helps the OP get his KPLs doing what he wants.

I was having trouble getting the KPL to take the changes which is not too much of a surprise as it is 2008 vintage and of course power line only.  I did find something that may help others.  It appears that if I have the load full up it takes the updates better.  That may be a function of having a light load (LEDs) or may just be a coincidence.  I couldn't get it to take the changes reliably with the load dimmed but took it right in with the load full up.

The other thing I had to fiddle with was the toggle modes.  I ended up with the main buttons set for toggle, the "nightlight" button set as non-toggle/on and the "goodnight" button set as non-toggle/off.  Nightlight turns off most of the devices in the scene but sets the connected load to 15% and a couple other devices to a low level.  Goodnight turns everything off.  I did get an error when I tried to set the connected load to 0% for the goodnight scene.  It said that a button on the device could not set the connected load off so I set it to 1%.

 

Edited February 6, 2015 by BobMic

[stusviews]

Try setting to connected load to Off.