Motion Sensor not resetting lighting

[mefree]

So, I have a motion sensor in our master bathroom set that when it senses motion it sets all the lights in the master bathroom to 33%, which is perfect for at night when you need to use the bathroom.  The problem is, during the day my wife will walk in, the lights turn on, but she will then set the lights to 100% while doing makeup, things like this.  When the motion sensor sees her, it resets the lights back down to 33%.  Obviously she does not like this.  Currenly my work around is to set the motion sensor to do nothing until 30 minutes after it's last activation.  That said, that sucks

​Basically what I would like to happen is that if the lights are already on, then the motion sensor does nothing, it only does something when the lights are off.  (And I'm not referring to just light in the room as during the day I would still like them to activate to 33%.)  Is there a way I can correct this motion sensor default behavior with the ISY? 

 

Motion sensor - Item# 2842-222

ISY 994i ZW with latest firmware

All lights controlled by INSTEON 2477D dimmer switches

 

Thanks!

[Techman]

You could write a program that limits the MS turning on the lights only during the evening hours

 

 

IF

 

  Time is between 7:00 pm and 7::00 am next day

   and MS is on

   and light is not on

 

Then

 

   Turn on lights

 

Else

[stusviews]

If you don't mind a one or two delay to turn on the light when the sensor senses motion, then create a program that turns the light on to 33% and off after a specified duration. Set the MS to send an On only.

Then write a second program that disables the first program when the dimmer is turned on manually and enables the first program when the dimmer is manually turned off.

[mefree]

If you don't mind a one or two delay to turn on the light when the sensor senses motion, then create a program that turns the light on to 33% and off after a specified duration. Set the MS to send an On only.

 

Then write a second program that disables the first program when the dimmer is turned on manually and enables the first program when the dimmer is manually turned off.

 

Hi Stusviews, thank you for the suggestion but I have a question.  The motion sensor itself is acting as a controller and sending the 'on at 33%' command when it senses motion.  Even if I disable an equivalent program on the ISY, wouldn't the motion itself send those commands?  Should I disable the motion as a controller period, and then do what you suggested?

[stusviews]

Yes, use a program instead of a scene to turn on the light.

[mefree]

Yes, use a program instead of a scene to turn on the light.

 

Ok, so one more question.  I have my motion sensor added to the ISY, but the options I have with it are 'status is (responding/on/off)'.  I would assume when it gets 'triggered' the status would be 'on'? right?  That doesn't work, nor does 'responding' to trigger the rule.  If I can just figure out how to get the program to respond to the motion sensor getting tripped then I think we've got this.

[larryllix]

Ok, so one more question.  I have my motion sensor added to the ISY, but the options I have with it are 'status is (responding/on/off)'.  I would assume when it gets 'triggered' the status would be 'on'? right?  That doesn't work, nor does 'responding' to trigger the rule.  If I can just figure out how to get the program to respond to the motion sensor getting tripped then I think we've got this.

If you have the sending of Off disabled from your MS, as most of us do, then the recorded status, inside ISY, will never change to Off.

 

Usually for MS units people use "Control/switched ON" as that is the raw signal from the MS and it can repeat any time it sees motion and retrigger timers from timing out and turning lights off.

 

 Status, even if the MS did send  an Off, will never retrigger your timers because you have to get an Off before you can get it 'back On', registering a change that  triggers programs.

[stusviews]

Post your program (right click, select copy to clipboard).

[mefree]

If you have the sending of Off disabled from your MS, as most of us do, then the recorded status, inside ISY, will never change to Off.

 

Usually for MS units people use "Control/switched ON" as that is the signal from the MS and it can repeat any time it sees motion and retrigger timers from timing out and turning lights off.

 

 Status, even if the MS did send  an Off, will never retrigger your timers because you have to get an Off before you can get it 'back On', registering a change that  triggers programs.

 

Thank you larryllix for the response.  I've tried changing to the method you specified and it still doesn't work.  That said, I don't have this motion sensor sending an 'off' command, I have it set to only turn on devices.  That also said, I don't have it controlling any devices, at least not directly, so should I change that to send an 'off' command after the timer is done?

[mefree]

Post your program (right click, select copy to clipboard).

 

 

Master Bathroom Auto Lights - [iD 0006][Parent 0001]

If

        Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Motion Sensor' is On

    And Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Vanity' is Off

    And Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathtub' is Off

 

Then

        Set 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathtub' 33%

        Set 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Vanity' 33%

 

Else

   - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

Thank you larryllix for the response.  I've tried changing to the method you specified and it still doesn't work.  That said, I don't have this motion sensor sending an 'off' command, I have it set to only turn on devices.  That also said, I don't have it controlling any devices, at least not directly, so should I change that to send an 'off' command after the timer is done?

 

Larry, this is what it looks like when modified to your spec;

 

 

Master Bathroom Auto Lights - [iD 0006][Parent 0001]

If

        Control 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Motion Sensor' is switched On

    And Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Vanity' is Off

    And Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathtub' is Off

 

Then

        Set 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathtub' 33%

        Set 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Vanity' 33%

 

Else

   - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

[mefree]

Thank you larryllix for the response.  I've tried changing to the method you specified and it still doesn't work.  That said, I don't have this motion sensor sending an 'off' command, I have it set to only turn on devices.  That also said, I don't have it controlling any devices, at least not directly, so should I change that to send an 'off' command after the timer is done?

 

Also Larry, you are correct, in the ISY the motion sensor always shows a state of 'on', even past the timeout period.  Which is really odd.

[larryllix]

Thank you larryllix for the response.  I've tried changing to the method you specified and it still doesn't work.  That said, I don't have this motion sensor sending an 'off' command, I have it set to only turn on devices.  That also said, I don't have it controlling any devices, at least not directly, so should I change that to send an 'off' command after the timer is done?

Yes, typically a program would look something like this.

 

Note the status of the MS may never have changed

 

If

. . . MS  is switched ON

Then

  . . set Light On

 . . . wait 30 minutes

. . . set Light Off

Else

  --

[mefree]

Yes, typically a program would look something like this.

 

Note the status of the MS may never have changed

 

If

. . . MS  is switched ON

Then

  . . set Light On

 . . . wait 30 minutes

. . . set Light Off

Else

  --

 

Except I only want the lights to be at 33%, and I don't want it to ever turn them off, and I don't want it to reset the lights to 33% if they are already set to a different level   Thus the other items in my program.

[larryllix]

 

Master Bathroom Auto Lights - [iD 0006][Parent 0001]

If

        Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Motion Sensor' is On

    And Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Vanity' is Off

    And Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathtub' is Off

 

Then

        Set 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathtub' 33%

        Set 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Vanity' 33%

 

Else

   - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

 

Larry, this is what it looks like when modified to your spec;

 

 

Master Bathroom Auto Lights - [iD 0006][Parent 0001]

If

        Control 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Motion Sensor' is switched On

    And Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Vanity' is Off

    And Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathtub' is Off

 

Then

        Set 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathtub' 33%

        Set 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Vanity' 33%

 

Else

   - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

 

 

 

These lines will stop your programing from running when you change the light status.

Any change in any device will cause you If to be re-evaluated and start Then or Else over again. This can stop further lines from executing.

[mefree]

These lines will stop your programing from running when you change the light status.

Any change in any device will cause you If to be re-evaluated and start Then or Else over again. This can stop further lines from executing.

 

?  Sorry, not sure I understand.  Are you saying that my 'and' requirements of the switches be set to 'off' will prevent the program from running because in the 'then' I am sending a '33% on' command to them?  If that was the case, wouldn't I see one of them turn on to 33% before failing?

These lines will stop your programing from running when you change the light status.

Any change in any device will cause you If to be re-evaluated and start Then or Else over again. This can stop further lines from executing.

 

Also, if the lights are on, then I do want the program to not execute.  (As in my wife walked in, the lights turned on to 33%, but she increases their brightness to 100%, I don't want the program executing again and setting them back to 33%, which was the program I ran into initially.)

[larryllix]

You will need two programs then. Disabling the second program will protect changes from stopping execution.

 

Master Bathroom Auto Lights - [iD 0006][Parent 0001]

If
        Control 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Motion Sensor' is switched On

Then

. . .  Run second program (If)

Else

. . .  --

 

Second program (DISABLED)   <----nothing can stop me now!!

If
    And Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Vanity' is Off    <---triggering is disabled
    And Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathtub' is Off                 <--they still work as logical filters though
 
Then
        Set 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathtub' 33%
        Set 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Vanity' 33%

        Wait X minutes

         Turn them off again
 
Else
   - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

[mefree]

?  Sorry, not sure I understand.  Are you saying that my 'and' requirements of the switches be set to 'off' will prevent the program from running because in the 'then' I am sending a '33% on' command to them?  If that was the case, wouldn't I see one of them turn on to 33% before failing?

 

Also, if the lights are on, then I do want the program to not execute.  (As in my wife walked in, the lights turned on to 33%, but she increases their brightness to 100%, I don't want the program executing again and setting them back to 33%, which was the program I ran into initially.)

 

Also, since this unit isn't directly controlling any switches I've changed it back to sending an 'off' command after timeout, and now the ISY does show an 'off' status.  That said, program still doesn't run

 

You will need two programs then. Disabling the second program will protect changes from stopping execution.

 

Master Bathroom Auto Lights - [iD 0006][Parent 0001]

If

        Control 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Motion Sensor' is switched On

Then

. . .  Run second program (If)

Else

. . .  --

 

Second program (DISABLED)   <----nothing can stop me now!!

If

    And Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Vanity' is Off    <---triggering is disabled

    And Status  'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathtub' is Off                 <--they still work as logical filters though

 

Then

        Set 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathtub' 33%

        Set 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Vanity' 33%

        Wait X minutes

         Turn them off again

 

Else

   - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

 

 

Ok thanks Larry, I will try that right now and post back.

[larryllix]

Also, since this unit isn't directly controlling any switches I've changed it back to sending an 'off' command after timeout, and now the ISY does show an 'off' status.  That said, program still doesn't run

 

Ok thanks Larry, I will try that right now and post back.

Enabling the Off from the MS will drain your batteries faster and take away a lot of ISY control that you should have.

 

You should disable the ON in the MS (this makes the timer moot also) until you get this down in your head,  and working. It takes a while to get this through to people, at first. Later it will become much easier once you get on to trigger based programming.

[mefree]

Also, since this unit isn't directly controlling any switches I've changed it back to sending an 'off' command after timeout, and now the ISY does show an 'off' status.  That said, program still doesn't run

 

Ok thanks Larry, I will try that right now and post back.

 

In your program you posted you have a 'wait x minutes then off again'.  That is not a requirement for this to work is it?  Because I don't want them to ever turn off automatically, I want you to manually have to turn them off.

[mefree]

Enabling the Off from the MS will drain your batteries faster and take away a lot of ISY control that you should have.

 

You should disable the ON in the MS (this makes the timer moot also) until you get this down in your head,  and working. It takes a while to get this through to people, at first. Later it will become much easier once you get on to trigger based programming.

 

Ok, I have the trigger sensor programmed, and I can see the status of the motion sensor change in the ISY, but the program never executes per the 'summary' tab isn't showing an updated execution time.

 

 

Master Bathroom Sensor Trigger - [iD 0006][Parent 0001]

If

        Control 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Motion Sensor' is switched On

 

Then

        Run Program 'Master Bathroom Auto Lights' (If)

 

Else

   - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

[mefree]

Enabling the Off from the MS will drain your batteries faster and take away a lot of ISY control that you should have.

 

You should disable the ON in the MS (this makes the timer moot also) until you get this down in your head,  and working. It takes a while to get this through to people, at first. Later it will become much easier once you get on to trigger based programming.

 

Ok I set the option back to 'on only mode' again.  That is what you meant correct?  How do I disable the 'On' as well?

[larryllix]

Ok I set the option back to 'on only mode' again.  That is what you meant correct?  How do I disable the 'On' as well?

You can't disable the ON also. Then the MS wouldn't do anything.

 

Yes you can eliminate the auto Off. Just remove the lines Wait X... and Turn off....

[mefree]

You can't disable the ON also. Then the MS wouldn't do anything.

 

Yes you can eliminate the auto Off. Just remove the lines Wait X... and Turn off....

 

Ok, so any idea why the below program is not executing?  According to the 'summary' page, it's never executing;

 

 

Master Bathroom Sensor Trigger - [iD 0006][Parent 0001]

If

        Control 'Insteon / Master Bedroom / Master Bathroom Motion Sensor' is switched On

 

Then

        Run Program 'Master Bathroom Auto Lights' (If)

 

Else

   - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

[stusviews]

With the option set to "On commands only" the sensor will send an On each time motion is sensed. It will never send an off. That why Control is used in a program. Status won't work because the status never changes. Off is controlled by the program, not the sensor.

 

Edit: Add a Wait to the program.

[mefree]

With the option set to "On commands only" the sensor will send an On each time motion is sensed. It will never send an off. That why Control is used in a program. Status won't work because the status never changes. Off is controlled by the program, not the sensor.

 

Edit: Add a Wait to the program.

 

Ok, good to know.  Problem is, the 'if' is never triggering still.  I tested running the 'then' and that all executes perfectly, but the motion sensor is never triggering the 'if' section of the command.  Not sure what I am doing wrong here.

 

Also, is it just me or is a lot of this not logical at all.  Granted, I haven't done programming in 10 years but this doesn't not seem to follow a logical flow.  Without you guys telling me this stuff, how in the world would I ever guess it?