Motion Detectors Model #2420M sending multiple "ON&quot

[Illusion]

Some of my motion detectors seem to send multiple on commands for a single motion event. Walking in front of the motion detector during daylight hours I get this Using the Event Viewer set on Level 1:

 

2009/02/20 09:00:56 : [ A 3C 31 1] DON 1

 

2009/02/20 09:00:56 : [ A 3C 31 1] DON 1

 

2009/02/20 09:00:57 : [ X10] F3

 

2009/02/20 09:00:57 : [ X10] F3/On (3)

 

But after sunset the same single motion action will cause this:

 

2009/02/20 09:40:07 : [ A 3C 31 1] DON 1

 

2009/02/20 09:40:08 : [ A 3C 31 1] DON 1

 

2009/02/20 09:40:09 : [ X10] F3

 

2009/02/20 09:40:09 : [ X10] F3/On (3)

 

2009/02/20 09:40:09 : [ E B9 9C 1] ST 255

 

2009/02/20 09:40:09 : [ X10] F3

 

2009/02/20 09:40:09 : [ X10] F3/On (3)

 

Where a.3c.31 is the motion detector, X-10 F3 is my alert chime, and e.b9.9c is the relaylinc switch that controls the front porch light.

 

Questions.

 

1. Why does the motion detector send two on commands?

 

1.5 Is the double on signal causing the second chime after sunset somehow?

 

2. Why does the F3 chime sound twice if the motion detector is triggered after sunset but only chime once if the motion detector is trigger before sunset?

 

3. Why is the system not also sending the porch light on command twice after sunset?

 

I am lost on this one. The net results of a daylight motion trigger is what I want, ie the chime alerts, the porch light does not turn on. The net results after sunset that I am after is for the porch light to turn on and the alert chime to sound once.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Motion-Front Porch:

If
       Control 'Front Porch-Sensor' is switched On

Then
       Run Program 'Front Porch Motion On' (If)
       Wait  1 second
       Send X10 'F3/On (3)'
       Wait  5 minutes 
       Run Program 'Front Porch Motion Off' (If)

Else
  - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

 

Front Porch Motion On:

If
       From    Sunset 
       To      Sunrise (next day)

Then
       Set 'Front Porch' On

Else
  - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

 

Front Porch Motion Off:

If
       Status  'Front Porch' is On

Then
       Set 'Front Porch' Off

Else
  - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

Motion-Front Porch: Enabled

Front Porch Motion On: Disabled

Front Porch Motion Off: Disabled

 

The calling of an off program instead of just turning off the light is in deference to certain forum members that shall remain nameless always harping on reducing network traffic as much as possible. I have restructured all my programs to reduce network traffic as much as possible.

[Michel Kohanim]

Hello Illusion,

 

All RF devices send two commands. The theory behind it is that sending multiple commands increases the likelihood of success.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[Illusion]

And the reason the chime sounds twice if it is after sunset, but only once if the sun is up?

[Brian H]

X10 power line signals are an address that wakes up the module. Then a X10 command.

 

If the chime module is addressed and then sent the On command and is busy processing the chime function. The next X10 Address maybe missed [the one that should tell it it is no longer the addressed module] so the chime module still thinks it is being addressed and see the on command for another module to turn on. It WILL chime again. Mine does the same thing. I send a chime on; then light some X10 addressed lights. It frequently chimes again.

This is with an X10 controller and is not in any way an ISY issued command.

I can also chime my module with other light addresses from my palmpad remote if I get the buttons timed exactly right.

It is most likely the chimes way of working and not an ISY thing.

 

I reread your post. It does look like in your example the actual chime on is being sent twice. So my missed new address command example may not be your problem.

[Illusion]

Thanks for your reply. It sure does look to me like the isy is sending a second F3 chime on order if the program triggers after sunset.

 

Due to the 1s delay I have put in, I never get a second chime in daylight hours, and always get a second chime after sunset. I just cannot figure out why.

[Michel Kohanim]

Illusion,

 

Are you also using the dusk/dawn sensor on your motion sensor?

 

With kind regards,

Michel

 

Thanks for your reply. It sure does look to me like the isy is sending a second F3 chime on order if the program triggers after sunset.

 

Due to the 1s delay I have put in, I never get a second chime in daylight hours, and always get a second chime after sunset. I just cannot figure out why.

[Illusion]

Michel,

 

No, the dusk/dawn feature of the detector in question is disabled via the jumper. The detector is active 27/7

 

I think we have a bug here, or at the very least an anomaly. Last night I did some troubleshooting. I removed the line Run Program 'Front Porch Motion On' (If) from Motion-Front Porch and triggered the program after sunset by moving in view of the detector, and the chime only sounds once. The event viewer confirms that the isy only sent the F3 command once. If I put that line back in and trigger the detector after sunset the isy sends two F3 on command sequences. (Of course sunset is subjective here because for testing purposes I am altering the internal clock of the isy to facilitate daylight hours testing.)

 

The system did not used to do this per my memory. This anomaly started with the betas somewhere around 2.6.13. That is not a hard and fast fact though as it is only now that I understand when the double chime is happening. It took me a while to figure out that it was only after sunset.

 

One more data points for analysis:

 

The chime will not occur twice if the program is trigger from the program menu. It must be triggerd by the if statement being made true via the motion detector seeing motion.

[Illusion]

More data points for analysis:

 

I changed Front Porch Motion On to:

 

Front Porch Motion On:

If
       From    Sunset 
       To      Sunrise (next day)
   And Status  'Front Porch' is not On

Then
       Set 'Front Porch' On

Else
  - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

 

Now if I trigger the motion detector after sunset, the isy only sends the second X-10 F3 on command set if the porch light is not already on. If the porch light is off I get the two distinct command sequences sent from the isy and the chime sounds twice. If the porch light is on, the isy sends one command sequence and the chime sounds once.

 

So it is the actual act of turning on the porch light that seems to be causing the isy to send an undesired second command set.

 

Why in the world would altering a downstream program that has nothing to do with X-10 have such an effect as causing the isy to send multiple X-10 command sequences in another upstream program?

 

Chris Jahn Help!

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi Illusion,

 

Just wanted to let you know that we have not forgotten about you and thank you again for your input. We are trying to reproduce, make a test case, and then send off to development for fix.

 

Thanks for your patience and continued support,

With kind regards,

Michel

[Illusion]

Have you had any luck reproducing this? Even if you do not have a fix, I would like validation that I am not crazy.

[Michel Kohanim]

Hello Illusion,

 

We added code in ISY to ignore the duplicates sent by RF devices. Since I was not able to reproduce the same exact symptoms as you had outlined, I do think that this fix will most probably also address what you are experiencing. 2.7.1 should be out in a couple of days.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

 

Have you had any luck reproducing this? Even if you do not have a fix, I would like validation that I am not crazy.

[Illusion]

Okay Michel,

 

I will accept that this is "fixed". I had a hard time accepting this. I have tested this for two weeks since installing 2.7.1 and the chime only has double sounded twice, which I suspect was do to X-10 issues. I have not seen the double command sent by the isy in the event viewer since upgrading to 2.7.1

 

While I know this puts this issue to rest with you {since there is no longer a problem} if someone else is reading this and can satisfy my curiosity I still would like to hear your thoughts.

 

If you read the previous posts carefully, you will see that the trigger for the isy sending the second, undesired X-10 command was an if then program in the isy that had nothing to do with the program that was supposed to send the single X-10 command, except that the program in question was called from the same program that initiated the X-10 command.

 

I am stumped, and it took me a long time to even find this association, but when I did it was a 100% correlation.

 

Michel, thanks for fixing this issue. See that, I did not use quotes there, indicating that I really am coming to terms with this being a fix.

[Michel Kohanim]

Hello Illusion,

 

Thanks so very much for the update (which I was very much looking forward to) and considering this fixed even if temporarily. Please do keep a close eye on the situation and notify us in case you find more anomalies.

 

Thanks again and with kind regards,

Michel

 

Okay Michel,

 

I will accept that this is "fixed". I had a hard time accepting this. I have tested this for two weeks since installing 2.7.1 and the chime only has double sounded twice, which I suspect was do to X-10 issues. I have not seen the double command sent by the isy in the event viewer since upgrading to 2.7.1

 

While I know this puts this issue to rest with you {since there is no longer a problem} if someone else is reading this and can satisfy my curiosity I still would like to hear your thoughts.

 

If you read the previous posts carefully, you will see that the trigger for the isy sending the second, undesired X-10 command was an if then program in the isy that had nothing to do with the program that was supposed to send the single X-10 command, except that the program in question was called from the same program that initiated the X-10 command.

 

I am stumped, and it took me a long time to even find this association, but when I did it was a 100% correlation.

 

Michel, thanks for fixing this issue. See that, I did not use quotes there, indicating that I really am coming to terms with this being a fix.