Best options for Wi-Fi coverage improvement?

[ScottAvery]

My new house has an unusual layout with living areas widely separated by height and/or distance.  I currently have a Verizon gateway router as primary at one end of the house and the verizon extender at the other end.  These worked fine in my old house but I need something more comprehensive now.

 

One factor is that the house does not have any ethernet wiring nor any easy way to pull it as there is no access to some areas and because there were mutiple additions, there are some barriers between spaces.  I do have a decent run on coaxial cable though and can do an independent MoCA 2.0 network as well as the MoCA 1.0 that Verizon equipment sets up.  I use Tivo, not Verizon devices, so I don't need cable TV distributed, just the IP network. As I see it, that means for each hotspot I will probably also need a MoCA device, unless the hotspot is a wifi repeater type.

 

So what should I be looking for best value in a home environment?

 

commercial-style access points that connect to wired ethernet in each area?

 

wifi mesh devices?  are there some better than others?  Google, netgear, tp-link, linksys?

 

Big replacement wifi router ac-2600 or higher?   ad7200 too soon?  Several of such configured as access points?

 

 

 

 

Thanks for the advice, I figure this audience is likely to have similar needs.

[Tim Wilson]

I've heard good things about the Eero equipment. The Wirecutter recommends the Netgear Orbi (http://thewirecutter.com/reviews/best-wi-fi-mesh-networking-kits/). I love my Ubiquiti router, and I've heard great things about their wifi equipment too (https://unifi-mesh.ubnt.com/ for example).

[Jimbo.Automates]

I used the ubiquity unifi, liked it a lot except for the limited placement options for the plugin mesh points, and no wired option. I now use Google WiFi with 4 points, 3 hard wired. I'm very happy with them, they just work, no more separate 2g and 5g networks. But the unifi did have more customization settings.

 

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[apostolakisl]

I just installed a ubiquiti unifi myself.  I'm very happy with it.  I'm just using 1 of these and it is covering all of a 6000 sf house.  Fortunately, I have lots of land and very few neighbors so I don't deal with any competing radio noise.  The unit does have LOTS of settings, of which I'm using all default.  I do believe that you can link them together so that only your primary unit requires an ethernet connection.  They also are powered via poe and come with the poe adapter which means only a single wire needs to go to any one unit.  Also, I believe you can use them as a wifi bridge.  Finally, they are relatively attractive units that come with wall/ceiling mounting hardware for a nice clean install.

[JayC]

I have also added a Ubiquiti Unifi AP-Lite recently really like their equipment and the GUI is awesome, the price points are a huge plus as well.  It was slightly more challenging to setup the standard AP's, as I am running the Unifi software in a docker on my NAS.  

[Jimbo.Automates]

Sorry, I misspoke, I tried the amplifi not unifi, my comments where about that system.

 

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[ScottAvery]

Thanks for the suggestions and personal experiences!

[Moshe]

I am planning on upgrading my wireless network in my home and was wondering if mesh networks like Google Wi-Fi or VELOP Whole Home Mesh Wi-Fi System interfere with the Insteon mesh network. 

Thanks

Moshe

 

 

[mwester]

Insteon's RF is in the 900MHz band -- WiFi signals are  in the 2400MHz and 5000MHz bands... they won't even know each other exist.

[asbril]

I have Google Wifi. Not only is there no conflict with my HA, but it is actually very helpful. When I can not include a new Zwave device because it is too far from my ISY, then I move the latter to the  Google Wifi pod that is closest to the new device, do the 'Include', move back the ISY to its original location, perform a 'healing'....... and voila !!!!

[larryllix]

My Wifi starting working much better once I turned the power output down on both the 5GHz and 2.4GHz. My guess is the antennae cannot handle that much power from both frequencies simultaneously and interfered with each other.

The natural response is to turn up the power output but it can work against you. My 5GHz wasn't good for much better than across the same 20' room but now it is good over my acre property mostly.

[Scottmichaelj]

I am planning on upgrading my wireless network in my home and was wondering if mesh networks like Google Wi-Fi or VELOP Whole Home Mesh Wi-Fi System interfere with the Insteon mesh network. 
Thanks
Moshe
 
 

Don’t mess with MESH. If you can afford it get a Ruckus Unleashed Access Point off Amazon. You won’t be sorry. Great range, great product.

[oberkc]

I use the

9 hours ago, Moshe said:

I am planning on upgrading my wireless network in my home and was wondering if mesh networks like Google Wi-Fi or VELOP Whole Home Mesh Wi-Fi System interfere with the Insteon mesh network. 

Thanks

Moshe

 

 

I use the Netgear Orbi mesh system.  It works quite well in my experience.

Of the mesh systems I looked at, one thing that set it apart from many was that others often required the internet and cloud to work.  I did not want that.  If that is a concern of yours, be sure to look into those sorts of details.

[Moshe]

All -

Thank you for your responses and assistance.  I now have a good idea of next steps.

Moshe

[Teken]

I use the
I use the Netgear Orbi mesh system.  It works quite well in my experience.
Of the mesh systems I looked at, one thing that set it apart from many was that others often required the internet and cloud to work.  I did not want that.  If that is a concern of yours, be sure to look into those sorts of details.

Which brands / models had Internet dependencies to operate in a local manner?


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[Scottmichaelj]

Which brands / models had Internet dependencies to operate in a local manner?


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Ruckus Unleashed AP is 100% local. 1 AP is all you need for up to a 5000sq ft home. It costs considerably more but it’s worth it. No reboots, solid and buy once and forget about it. It can handle many users all streaming with ease.

In my experience the mesh systems will not “handoff” properly to a stronger signal all of the time.

[Teken]

Ruckus Unleashed AP is 100% local. 1 AP is all you need for up to a 5000sq ft home. It costs considerably more but it’s worth it. No reboots, solid and buy once and forget about it. It can handle many users all streaming with ease.

In my experience the mesh systems will not “handoff” properly to a stronger signal all of the time.

Yes, while doing a long term trial for better WiFi coverage for me and a enterprise project. I found the hand off also depended heavily on the device in use. Some iPads vs iPhones vs android based hardware would hang on to dead life before ever letting go.

While others would just drop you like a bad habit at 2 bars?!? Regardless of the technology used placement height is paramount for consistent coverage.

Sometimes selecting different frequencies helps too vs changing the power output. One thing that seems harder to avoid is having a ISP modem that isn't a WiFi router too.

I've found in some cases a user would leave the ISP WiFi running but not in use but also have their own router too. This would cause interference in the home which is supposed to be very rare.

Anyways, I find this new trend to MESH the whole network over sold and poorly implemented.


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[larryllix]

If you are near an aeroport or in a flight path,  remember the 5GHz WiFi spec contains a clause that upon hearing radar transmissions, all routers must immediately cease transmitting and change frequencies. It takes some time for all devices on that frequency to reconnect to the new frequency.

[oberkc]

2 hours ago, Teken said:

 

Which brands / models had Internet dependencies to operate in a local manner?


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Based upon my reading of reviews and manuals, it appeared that the google wifi and the velop reqired access to internet to work.  I am vague about Amplifi.  I was also concerned about many of these not having a browser-accessible settings.  They seem to be heading to requiring some app for setup, along with an account (also needing internet access).

[Teken]

Based upon my reading of reviews and manuals, it appeared that the google wifi and the velop reqired access to internet to work.  I am vague about Amplifi.  I was also concerned about many of these not having a browser-accessible settings.  They seem to be heading to requiring some app for setup, along with an account (also needing internet access).

Thanks for that information. I'm not sure why companies would drop a local web browser access to the setup / administrator page and use a smart application instead. ?

But the whole industry seems to gravitating to this stupid model.

A few months ago I had a chance to setup a few TP-Link routers. Over the years this small company has literally led the way in offering some of most feature rich setup and features that not only rival enterprise class hardware but exceed them!!

When you combine the incredibly low price and value these (TP-Link) appliances offer it's hard to accept and use so called prosumer hardware that offer next to nothing or push this whole cloud power to the nth degree of stupid.


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[oberkc]

23 minutes ago, Teken said:

A few months ago I had a chance to setup a few TP-Link routers. Over the years this small company has literally led the way in offering some of most feature rich setup and features that not only rival enterprise class hardware but exceed them!!

 

 

That is good to know

[Scottmichaelj]

Based upon my reading of reviews and manuals, it appeared that the google wifi and the velop reqired access to internet to work.  I am vague about Amplifi.  I was also concerned about many of these not having a browser-accessible settings.  They seem to be heading to requiring some app for setup, along with an account (also needing internet access).

This is one of the reasons I don’t like UBNT/Uniquity. You need either a “cloud key” at an extra expense OR install the software locally to configure it. Not a fan of either solution.

[asbril]

5 hours ago, Scottmichaelj said:

 

This is one of the reasons I don’t like UBNT/Uniquity. You need either a “cloud key” at an extra expense OR install the software locally to configure it. Not a fan of either solution.

 

Google Wifi continues to work locally if internet is interupted

[Scottmichaelj]

Google Wifi continues to work locally if internet is interupted

I would never recommend this product to any customer, client or family member. I stand firmly in the Ruckus camp. My second choice is Mikrotik, which is a very good product at a decent price. Mikrotik hAP and cAP products are very good. I also LOVE the Mikrotik mAP lite device for places where there is a need for internet but there’s not a connection close and/or the device has no wireless installed. These things come in handy! I am a fan of putting APs in a centrally located spot in the home and then leaving the router tucked away whenever possible. Can’t tell you how many other router brands I have pulled out to replace and just putting an AP in the center of a house on the ceiling made a huge difference. Also 3x3 mimo or more helps. Dump legacy wireless whenever possible as well. No more a/b/g if you can help it. Make sure channel is properly selected, most of the time auto needs to be OFF. You don’t always have to spend a fortune to get quality.

[asbril]

4 hours ago, Scottmichaelj said:

 

I would never recommend this product to any customer, client or family member. I stand firmly in the Ruckus camp. My second choice is Mikrotik, which is a very good product at a decent price. Mikrotik hAP and cAP products are very good. I also LOVE the Mikrotik mAP lite device for places where there is a need for internet but there’s not a connection close and/or the device has no wireless installed. These things come in handy! I am a fan of putting APs in a centrally located spot in the home and then leaving the router tucked away whenever possible. Can’t tell you how many other router brands I have pulled out to replace and just putting an AP in the center of a house on the ceiling made a huge difference. Also 3x3 mimo or more helps. Dump legacy wireless whenever possible as well. No more a/b/g if you can help it. Make sure channel is properly selected, most of the time auto needs to be OFF. You don’t always have to spend a fortune to get quality.

 

I am not familiar with either Ruckus or Mikrotik, and reading your comment these may be excellent routers. In my case, I am very satisfied with Google Wifi. In my condo the internet cable is at a far end of my condo and in the past I endured slow speeds and bad connections at the opposite corners of my home. With 3 Google Wifi pods I now have excellent coverage throughout my home and high speeds. 

As such there seem to be excellent solutions for different situations.

BTW the Google Wifi pods allow me to easily move my ISY when it does not initially reach a new Zwave device. After moving the ISY near the new device, including that device and performing a heal, I can then move the ISY back to its usual location (and perform another heal).