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SOC Windows Server suggestions for Nodelink


paulbates

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I've gone a long way with Raspbian on RPi 2B on Nodelink. However, there are some differences between native .net and mono, especially in how SSL is handled,  and I'm looking to move to a Windows iot host with 2 possible paths:

  1. I'm looking for suggestions for SOC Windows boxes that would be comparable to a Pi 2 / 3 in configuration and performance.. and dual core is fine. I don't put a dent in the B+'s 4 cores. I won't be running a hypervisor and only Nodelink, and possibly someday polyglot as applications on this host. 

    This Intel based SOC looks good, open to other suggestions: UP Core - either of the 2 GB models.
     
  2. Get a new SD Card and install the Windows iot FFU on my existing RPi 2B. This would keep things on ARM/Broadcom and might make it easier to run Polyglot in the future. Anyone tried this, any comments?

To recap, its a simple windows iot server to run existing nodelink and potentially polyglot. The needs are simple. Am not/will not be running a hypervisor, docker. 

Paul

 

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I am playing with Docker on a NAS myself right now bc I already own one BUT for you maybe this will work?

https://www.udoo.org/

You trying to go cheap or?

I still like the Azulle Quantum PC sticks that come with Win10 Pro for $130

Quantum Access LAN Windows 10 Fanless Mini PC Stick https://www.amazon.com/dp/B018GWVOGC/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_89AKAbJHTYT49

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Hey Scott

Not cheap, its that I don't have aspirations / requirements / desire to care for a hypervisor. The nodelink workload I have today is light. So I don't need to move up to an 8+ core, multiple NICs, 24GB ram, etc. One of the beauties of the Pi is low power draw. If you take stock in how much is saved from the electric bill with HA management, the amount drawn to manage has to be subtracted, which for the pi is fairly small. I'm wanting to stay the course on doing well there.

I guess the other requirement is an MS FFU or have it supplied with a W10 image, so its easy to setup and supported. UDOO doesn't seem to have it. It doesn't say it comes with W10, so I'm left to guess that it doesn't and that would have to be purchased to get it working (?)

The quantum does look interesting. Since it comes with windows 10 pro, that side steps the FFU requirement.. Do you know how its powered? The only thing in the area I'd install it that has USB would be my router. I'll keep digging

Thanks

Paul

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Hey Scott Not cheap, its that I don't have aspirations / requirements / desire to care for a hypervisor. The nodelink workload I have today is light. So I don't need to move up to an 8+ core, multiple NICs, 24GB ram, etc. One of the beauties of the Pi is low power draw. If you take stock in how much is saved from the electric bill with HA management, the amount drawn to manage has to be subtracted, which for the pi is fairly small. I'm wanting to stay the course on doing well there. I guess the other requirement is an MS FFU or have it supplied with a W10 image, so its easy to setup and supported. UDOO doesn't seem to have it. It doesn't say it comes with W10, so I'm left to guess that it doesn't and that would have to be purchased to get it working (?)

The quantum does look interesting. Since it comes with windows 10 pro, that side steps the FFU requirement.. Do you know how its powered? The only thing in the area I'd install it that has USB would be my router. I'll keep digging

Thanks

Paul

 

 

 The PC stick draws maybe 5-7watts max. It does come with Win10 Pro and it has a normal two prong 110v power supply. You might be able to use a USB but not sure from the router. I personally own one and never tried using it powered by USB. I’ll look. I have a post about it on the forum under coffee shop.

 

Your right UDOO does not have Win10 preinstalled but I thought it might be an option.

 

Edit: URL here for my review on the Azulle Quantum PC stick

 

Azulle Quantum Access Mini PC Stick

 

https://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/19200-azulle-quantum-access-mini-pc-stick/

 

Edit: Power Supply on the Azulle PC Stick (LAN Version) - Micro USB (female) connection on the PC stick

 

7a7906fe1fe353b5bf83741d423046d2.jpg

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I've come full circle on consolidating vs separating services. I was running HAD on a WD NAS but wasn't happy with the power or performance of the file system. The drive should have gone into standby but never did really and within 3 years the drive started going. I've circled back to an Asus router with VPN, IPS plus NAS services on an SMB 2 SSD. That's working well. That lead to the Pi 2B for nodelink. I'm not going to try and run Mono/docker on a skinny dual core router config.

This year's goal of plumbing all LAN side HA network on SSL was met, sort of. There are differences in the Mono stack vs Windows that make performance Nodelink ok, but not what they should be. I want to get on MS based .net and off of mono. The choices are: replace the pi with a Windows SOC, or load the MS Windows iot FFU on the Pi. That's what I'm trying to figure out.

I only run nodelink today, and a stretch goal of adding polyglot maybe,.. I don't think the benefits of docker will exceed the headaches for me when I "dog paddle" through linux.

Paul

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 2/24/2018 at 11:56 AM, paulbates said:

I've come full circle on consolidating vs separating services. I was running HAD on a WD NAS but wasn't happy with the power or performance of the file system. The drive should have gone into standby but never did really and within 3 years the drive started going. I've circled back to an Asus router with VPN, IPS plus NAS services on an SMB 2 SSD. That's working well. That lead to the Pi 2B for nodelink. I'm not going to try and run Mono/docker on a skinny dual core router config.

This year's goal of plumbing all LAN side HA network on SSL was met, sort of. There are differences in the Mono stack vs Windows that make performance Nodelink ok, but not what they should be. I want to get on MS based .net and off of mono. The choices are: replace the pi with a Windows SOC, or load the MS Windows iot FFU on the Pi. That's what I'm trying to figure out.

I only run nodelink today, and a stretch goal of adding polyglot maybe,.. I don't think the benefits of docker will exceed the headaches for me when I "dog paddle" through linux.

Paul

I been having some issues with Docker as well and god help us if I try to do a docker with Debian! SMH

FWIW I saw this today - http://ledunia.de

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I understand that for some, the learning curve for Linux makes Windows attractive -- but I can't get over the price premium one has to pay to put Windows on anything.  With all the resources available for learning Linux, it really isn't $100+ harder to run Linux vs Windows!  But that's an opinion.

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The flip side of the coin is where this started. I have enough experience to set a pi / linux and get mono running. I've been doing that for 3 1/2 years. I started this thread because I ran into a case where open source, in this case Mono, is not "just the same". In this case, Mono uses google's ssl stack and turning on SSL in nodelink does not work the same way as it does in native microsoft .net.

It works ok, and io_guy provided configuring features to help navigate around the differences in Mono, but its not ideal. For me, even worrisome because its security related. There's a number of posts in other developer forums acknowledging the problem, but no solution seems to be coming from the open source community that I can find.

It was worth it to me to see what it would take to avoid other potential differences lurking in there. io_guy statement a few posts up about MS taking stewardship of Mono lets me believe this will get addressed eventually, so I'm going to give that some time.

Paul

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The HTTP stack in mono is handled very differently.  For the most part it handles ok but https is a bit of a mess.  Following Microsoft's recommended practices allows for https memory leaks on the mono stack.  The next version of NodeLink will try to handle the majority of this by moving to new Framework methods but the Windows guys will not like the outcome.

By default NodeLink will not run on Windows unless it is run as administrator.  This is because the new HTTPListener is bound by Windows security rules which block non-admin users from having port privledges.  If you want to run as non-admin, from an elevated command prompt you would have to enter "netsh http add urlacl url=http://+:8090/ user=Everyone".

Not loving this but I gotta move forward and it's only a one-time deal.  Linux does not have this restriction.

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On 3/10/2018 at 7:55 PM, larryllix said:

Looks like the price is a deal breaker there.

The windows 10 licence seems over the top.

The OP wanted to do it on Windows, that’s the tax of Windows. Value is in the eye of the beholder.

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