Tips on Insteon Communication Issues

[Mark Sanctuary]

Insteon is by far a huge step forward in reliability compared to good old X10 but it is not without some communication issues at times. Here is some common questions that seem to popup often.

 

1. [*:33aa2wls]What are some good tips for troubleshooting an Insteon network?
    
   [*:33aa2wls]The new Insteon modem chip in the PLM seems to be more sensitive to signal issues so some are putting their signalinc or accesspoint right on top of the PLM; what is your thought?
    
   [*:33aa2wls]It has been noticed when programming the network, linking seems to work better when all the Insteon devices are off; do the devices induce noise on the network?
    
   [*:33aa2wls]Electronics, motors, power strips, noisy products; how do you decide what needs fliterlinc filters?
    
   [*:33aa2wls]What tools are there to assess signal levels and troubleshoot issues in the Insteon network?
    
   [*:33aa2wls]Anything else you can think of about for Insteon communication issues?

[SteveL]

What are some good tips for troubleshooting an Insteon network?

 

I use a controlinc and monitor the flashing led to tell me is a signal is being seen. I also put the controlinc in multi-linc mode and then walk around the house with a lamp module and a bulb in it and see if I have any issues linking anyware. This is done after the access points are installed and before I install any switches.

 

The new Insteon modem chip in the PLM seems to be more sensitive to signal issues so some are putting their signalinc or accesspoint right on top of the PLM; what is your thought?

 

I was doing that 2 1/2 years ago. Things worked alot better when I was using the software and searching the network that I did it on every install.

It is always nice to be able to go powerline and RF from your main interface.

 

 

It has been noticed when programming the network, linking seems to work better when all the Insteon devices are off; do the devices induce noise on the network?

It is not the switches but the load the switches are controling.

electronic ballasts, some CFL, ect.

 

 

Electronics, motors, power strips, noisy products; how do you decide what needs fliterlinc filters?

 

The main thing I look for are power conditioner plug strips like Monster...they act like a vacume to Powerline carrier locally to the plug strip.

With INSTEON I don't spend a lot of time looking for noise.

 

What tools are there to assess signal levels and troubleshoot issues in the Insteon network?

Not alot of tools available to the public, fortunatley I don't run into alot of problems....and I am involved in alot of projects. Loose neutrals in your electrical wiring are the bigest thing I would see. If your house has outlets that have the wires pushed in the back of the outlets to splice the wires instead of wire nuts on the wires and a signal wire to the Hot & neutral to the outlet.

 

Anything else you can think of about for Insteon communication issues?

 

_________________

[Guest]

The new Insteon modem chip in the PLM seems to be more sensitive to signal issues so some are putting their signalinc or accesspoint right on top of the PLM; what is your thought?

 

I was doing that 2 1/2 years ago. Things worked alot better when I was using the software and searching the network that I did it on every install.

It is always nice to be able to go powerline and RF from your main interface.

 

 

It has been noticed when programming the network, linking seems to work better when all the Insteon devices are off; do the devices induce noise on the network?

It is not the switches but the load the switches are controling.

electronic ballasts, some CFL, ect.

 

 

Electronics, motors, power strips, noisy products; how do you decide what needs fliterlinc filters?

 

 

_________________

 

Possibly SH could make a PLM/Accesspoint module in one unit to provide more reliability for communications (the RF component could talk to the already installed accesspoints and the user would not be stealing one from the original pair? Whatever happens the feedthrough outlet in the PLM has to stay

 

I often would see communications failures when I had less than 15 devices or so using a PLC. I had to get over 20 devices for somewhat reliable communications. When I hit almost 70 reliablity was pretty good but that included 6 rflincs as well (but the hardware issues killed almost all of the devices). Now that I am attempting to use Insteon again I notice that with only a few devices communication failures are fairly common with the PLM. I am using 4 rflincs and 2 accesspoints and still have some problems (not sure if the rflincs are still working with each other). I dont have enough working switches to rebuld my system and I am hesitant on spending another $3K unitl I hear that SH has resolved the QC issues.

 

Any news on SH swapping the keypadlincs with the older firmware (with the flashing LED's and the loadlinking issues etc)? Has the paddle issue been addressed across all of the Decora style switches? I dont want to start a new box in my garage of defective switches.

[sloop]

well the test plm is heavy - i would bet its stuffed full - in any event - it works! i have beaten the hell outta mine - 3 days of 10 hour continuous use - at least - and it does not need the nappytime its predecessors did

 

i don't know if the signal strength is the same or not - but i have found it adequate in my house - even with the 4 signallincs removed (actually, more reliable without them) - so it might be that you don't need to piggyback an accesspoint or signallinc - it does have the passthrough outlet (at least this one does)

 

so a huge THANKS to whoever got that done

[Guest]

so a huge THANKS to whoever got that done

 

I swear it wasnt me You will get the joke but most people wont.

[Brian H]

I got it!

[Guest]

I got it!

 

You mean you would have known if it was me????

[linuxguy]

Hello all,

 

I have done some research on the SH website to collect receive sensivity numbers for some of the Insteon devices. Here is what I found (sorry for the rough format)

 

+------------------+------------+---------------+----------------+

|.Device.Name......|.SH.Number..|.Min.Rcv.Level.|

+------------------+------------+---------------+----------------+

| PLM..............| 2412S..........|............20 |

| LampLinc.........| 2456D3/S3..|............10 |

| LampLinc. .......| 2456D2.......|.............1 |

| Access Point.....| 2443...........|.............1 |

| SignaLinc Rf.....| 2442...........|.............1 |

| Icon.................| 2876SB/DB..|.............1 |

| Icon Appliance...| 2856S3B......|............10 |

| Icon Dimmer......| 2856D2B.....|.............1 |

| KeypadLinc.......| 2486D.........|.............1 |

| PowerLinc USB....| 2414U......|.............0 |

| PowerLinc Serial | 2414S........|.............0 |

| SwitchLinc.......| 2476D/S/ST |............. 1 |

| ControLinc.......| 2430.......|.............1 |

+------------------+------------+---------------+

 

I noticed the transmit power for all devices was the same, 3.2 volts. The data for the PowerLincs was not listed. Forgive me if I have a number or two wrong, I pulled this together fairly quickly.

 

This invites some conclusions and also some questions:

 

Conclusions:

I would expect the PLM to have communication problems (indeed, it does)

I would expect any device with a sensivity of one mv to have a substantial impact when piggy backed onto a PLM (this does, too)

 

Questions:

Wouldn't it be more cost effective to build uniform receiver units for every module type with the same sensitivity? The transmitters appear to be this way.

Why do the two vs three pin versions of the lamp/appliance modules have different sensivities?

Of all modules to put a really low sensitivity on, why the PLM?

 

Insteon is a great system, and I love all 40 devices I have installed. But if I wasn't an engineer I would have given up on it a year ago. It shouldn't require a high level of technical skill to get a system up and running (and keep it running). I suspect the target market is limited because of this.

 

I expect other forum members will have more questions. It is quite apparent from reading the forums that a "deaf" PLM is a common problem. Perhaps this data explains why.

 

Linuxguy

[sloop]

what is the firmware version of the plm you tested?