Some Alexa Routines won't function??

[larryllix]

I don't get this. What am I doing wrong. I have quite a few cases now that vary in triggers as well as vocal outputs using Routines.

Without ISY Portal
A month ago neighbours came over and I tried to impress the tech-snipers with a simple routine.
- Trigger by vocal "Who are our neighbours"
- Response "XXXX and YYYY are your next door neighbours"

I could never get that routine to work despite trying variations of the wording and triggering it from the Alexa app manually successfully every time. Several days later after testing failed again  I deleted it. I had installed another Routine with similar funny neighbour named response, getting the same results. Maybe Alexa didn't like some key word???? All other routines worked first time.

With ISY Portal
 Today I set up another two routines to report my garage door was open/closed. I started simple with an IOLinc sensing the garage door was closed = closed contact. Tried changing wording and a few other sleuthing techniques to no avail.
- Trigger from Insteon IOLinc sensing input.
- ISY portal defined this as a "contact" device, with vocal name "garage door"
- Alexa "Discover" was used and reported one new device by name from the speaker.
- Operating garage door shows Open/Close status on Alexa app device page "garage door"
- Manually triggering either of the two routines (open/closed) operates the speaker of choice, with appropriate wording, as defined by me in the routine response.
- A few hours were allowed and tested again, repeatedly.

These two routines will not function. I Haven't tried changing the device to a MS or tried an ISY state variable yet (I want to combine two garage door positions into vocal reports, later)

What am I doing wrong here? Why does one routine work fine and the next one refuses to function with very similar triggers and responses?

 

 

Edited February 15, 2019 by larryllix

[larryllix]

I have now tried this as a state variable (combining the two doors) defined as a contact (tried MS also) with the same result.

The Alexa app device status shows Closed/Open correctly, but it does  not trigger the Alexa Routine to vocalise the words.
Manual invocation of each routine in the app vocalises both OK.

[dbuss]

@larryllix , Interesting, I use state variables defined as an MS and the routines work as expected. Did Alexa discover your state variable after you added it to Alexa in the portal?

[larryllix]

[mention=4697]larryllix[/mention] , Interesting, I use state variables defined as an MS and the routines work as expected. Did Alexa discover your state variable after you added it to Alexa in the portal?

Yes. Each time I changed the style of ISY element is was reported discovered again.
However when I only changed the Portal type definition, it did not.

My first failure attempt at routines, and seeing the ISY element reported right through to the Alexa app status, tells me this is not a Portal problem but rather something inside the Alexa app server that is not always set up correctly. When I can create a vocal to vocal routine that works just fine and then create another one, a other night that will not work at all, something is flakey with the process or Alexa server.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

[CalPolyME]

I am suffering the exact same issue.  Have you made any progress on this?

[larryllix]

7 minutes ago, CalPolyME said:

I am suffering the exact same issue.  Have you made any progress on this?

Welcome to the forums!!

I gave up. I tried to fix this every week or so many times but no success.

This is not an ISY problem. This is an alexa problem. Some examples are only using alexa to alexa routines.

[CalPolyME]

Thanks for the welcome.

It's unfortunate this is not working properly.  I had high hopes.

[PhilN]

On 2/15/2019 at 7:12 PM, dbuss said:

@larryllix , Interesting, I use state variables defined as an MS and the routines work as expected. Did Alexa discover your state variable after you added it to Alexa in the portal?

Hi,

Long time ISY user, first time poster...

I've had luck triggering Alexa routines with state variable defined as contact sensors.  I have not tested motion sensor triggering.  BUT I didn't get off to a good start!

The routines refused to say custom phrases like "Right garage door has been opened" but would say canned messages like "Hello".  It took two trouble tickets with Amazon to rectify this problem.  BTW Amazon never contacted me, custom phrases just stated working shortly after submitting the second ticket. 

Even after this issue was fixed the routines would randomly not work.  I moved away from using the routine action "Alexa says" and started using send announcement under messaging and have had much better luck.

I agree this is an Amazon issue but I recommend trying canned messages in your routines to rule out the custom phrase issue I had.  Maybe using contact sensors instead of motion sensors might be an idea as well.

Good luck getting Alexa talking with ISY.

I love mine telling me;

..My wife will be home soon (just broke a 1KM geofence)

..It's 10:00 pm and the garage door is still open, should it be closed?

..Patio door open time has been exceeded, heating and cooling paused.

..Zoe, it's time to cleanup and get ready for bed! (I used ISY to take advantage of day of week programming) vs. less flexible Alexa routine programming.

..Verbal leak sensor warnings.

and many more.

 

 

 

[Hurting2Ride]

I don't know if this is in any way related but I spent about 4 excruciating hours of routines & notifications working, then not, then sometimes, then...while troubleshooting a Ring doorbell the other day.  Came to find out that Alexa appears to cache certain information about devices and doesn't do a very good job cleaning up it's cache.  If you delete & re-add a device with the exact same name it's possible that Alexa updates some of the device info but not all.  My problem was "solved" by naming my door bell "Front DoooR".  That's all it took for all of my related routines & announcements to work 100% of the time.  I then waited a few hours, changed the device name back to "Front Door" & everything continued to work fine after that.

P.S. There are also some issues (it seems) with permissions related to Amazon Household.  The website thread I followed the other day to finally determine the above issue with devices also referenced the permission.  While applicable to my issue, someone might find it does theirs.

P.S.S.  What values were you setting in Alexa for contact open/close?

[larryllix]

3 hours ago, Hurting2Ride said:

I don't know if this is in any way related but I spent about 4 excruciating hours of routines & notifications working, then not, then sometimes, then...while troubleshooting a Ring doorbell the other day.  Came to find out that Alexa appears to cache certain information about devices and doesn't do a very good job cleaning up it's cache.  If you delete & re-add a device with the exact same name it's possible that Alexa updates some of the device info but not all.  My problem was "solved" by naming my door bell "Front DoooR".  That's all it took for all of my related routines & announcements to work 100% of the time.  I then waited a few hours, changed the device name back to "Front Door" & everything continued to work fine after that.

P.S. There are also some issues (it seems) with permissions related to Amazon Household.  The website thread I followed the other day to finally determine the above issue with devices also referenced the permission.  While applicable to my issue, someone might find it does theirs.

P.S.S.  What values were you setting in Alexa for contact open/close?

Thanks for the suggestion. I tried renaming my spoken as well as using a single word name for it. I rebuilt, deleted and rediscovered my ISY devices. (need a mass delete back). I changed the device from a contact sensor, to a light switch, and motion detector, each time rediscovering, deleting the routines, rebuilding them, disabling, and re-enabling them with no joy.

My garage doors variable is sensed by Alexa when asked if my garage doors are open, giving proper responses, and yet no triggering works from the same status point. I followed every instruction I could in the ISY wiki instructions. No such luck.

I opened another ticket for this again with Amazon via the app. We'll see if anything happens  this time.

[Hurting2Ride]

If I may...

 What's the name of the device on Alexa?
 What's the name of the ISY variable it's tied to?
 What does your Alexa routine currently look like?

 

[larryllix]

5 hours ago, Hurting2Ride said:

If I may...

 What's the name of the device on Alexa?
 What's the name of the ISY variable it's tied to?
 What does your Alexa routine currently look like?

 

I am using a vocal named "Garage Doors". I tried a one word vocal "GarageDoors" and also "GarageX Doors" to try the app memory jog mentioned. This becomes the Alexa app name after each discovery.

The state variable is named "$sGarage.Doors.both.closed"

The Alexa routine is...
Trigger: Garage Doors closed,  Response:Vocal:custom: "Both garage doors are now closed", Vocal to:Mobile device
Trigger: Garage Doors open,  Response:Vocal:custom: "A garage door has opened", Vocal to:Mobile device

Variable changes with  status change of the variable. Both routines (open/closed) vocalise properly when manually tested from app.

Questions like
Alexa. Are the garage doors closed/open?
responds with
The garage doors is close/open

There is absolutely no problem getting the status via ISY Portal into the Alexa app.
This routine failure is the same for some vocal triggers. Other vocal to vocal routines have been working well..

[Hurting2Ride]

Any chance this is similar to your issue?

 

[Hurting2Ride]

I also meant to ask what happens if you use your same routine but change the action to anything other than a vocalization? 

If that works, what about leaving that action in place and re-adding the vocalization as a second action?

[Hurting2Ride]

...and another thought.  Have you tried disabled the ISY skill & re-enabling it?   I've had a few scenarios (non-ISY) where doing this "fixed" whatever got hung up in Alexa w/ that skill.

[larryllix]

18 minutes ago, Hurting2Ride said:

I also meant to ask what happens if you use your same routine but change the action to anything other than a vocalization? 

If that works, what about leaving that action in place and re-adding the vocalization as a second action?

Thanks. I tried adding a second action in both routines. One was a notification via all echoes before and then after the vocal. The other was a message sent to my mobile device. Both tested OK but will not trigger from the contact variable. When asked Alexa reports the status OK still.

Finding the announcement action, I decided there was a better notification as it can go out to all devices. Way too much echo but left them on only two devices. 

I will try the disconnect and reconnect. I have done this before but WTH? you never know with these things.

[larryllix]

41 minutes ago, Hurting2Ride said:

...and another thought.  Have you tried disabled the ISY skill & re-enabling it?   I've had a few scenarios (non-ISY) where doing this "fixed" whatever got hung up in Alexa w/ that skill.

Got it! I disabled ISY skill and then enabled it again. My garage door routines started work. Thanks so much!!!

Then I went back to the original vocal trigger routine and it still will not work. I tried various phrases with many failures. I eliminated the word "neighbour" and it started to work. It seems "neighbour" is a dirty word that it associates with something else and it confuses Alexa.

Thanks again! This has been a while for frustration.

[Hurting2Ride]

1 hour ago, larryllix said:

Thanks again! This has been a while for frustration.

My pleasure.  I've been experiencing similar frustrations w/ Alexa integrations so I feel your pain!

I've seen a FEW other random posts on the internet machine mentioning that spelling/grammar issues seemed to be a cause of their issues.  I'd be very interested if your neighbor routine would work as intended if you spelled it as "neighbor" rather than "neighbour". 

Edited March 21, 2019 by Hurting2Ride
Forgetfulness. I think.

[larryllix]

8 hours ago, Hurting2Ride said:

My pleasure.  I've been experiencing similar frustrations w/ Alexa integrations so I feel your pain!

I've seen a FEW other random posts on the internet machine mentioning that spelling/grammar issues seemed to be a cause of their issues.  I'd be very interested if your neighbor routine would work as intended if you spelled it as "neighbor" rather than "neighbour". 

Ahhhh! Never thought of that. Since Alexa doesn't seem to use phonetic spelling analysis it may not recognise the word or spelling. I'll have to try the US spelling as a test.

Some of my neighbours are bors so.......I knew I should have bought my Echoes at amazon.Ceh?   
 

Edited March 21, 2019 by larryllix

[palayman]

30 minutes ago, larryllix said:

Ahhhh! Never thought of that. Since Alexa doesn't seem to use phonetic spelling analysis it may not recognise the word or spelling. I'll have to try the US spelling as a test.

Some of my neighbours are bors so.......I knew I should have bought my Echoes at amazon.Ceh?   
 

Another person had all their problems go away when they changed from theatre to theater. Stick with US spelling.

Paul

[larryllix]

10 hours ago, palayman said:

Another person had all their problems go away when they changed from theatre to theater. Stick with US spelling.

Paul

The US spelling was the answer!!!

So I had two problems. Alexa routine process was somehow locked up and vocals are translated into US spelling and then compared with your text.

Thanks so much.

In the back of my mind, I did see somebody discussing US spelling differences but I wasn't into that subject matter at the time, and walked away mentally. The UDI forum has so much diversification now, it is hard to even read/absorb it all, now.

[smokegrub]

Reading these posts has left me with new knowledge. Now, the challenge is to retain it!

[The_Penguin]

 

 

 

On 3/19/2019 at 10:36 AM, PhilN said:

 

..My wife will be home soon (just broke a 1KM geofence)

 

 

I'm curious, what are you using for geofencing? 

I've only recently thought about doing something geofencing, and thought the only options were bluetooth local to the house.