Teken Posted March 20, 2020 Posted March 20, 2020 Another new listing for hardware has been added just today from Smartlabs and the FCC ID is: SBP-Wall / PS01 https://fccid.io/SBP-WALL Initial testing data can be found here: https://fccid.io/SBP-WALL/Test-Report/S19101601506001-FCC-249-R1-4657462 Perhaps we shall see a couple of new pieces of hardware for 2020 such as the PLM Pro with 4K links! 1
Brian H Posted March 20, 2020 Posted March 20, 2020 (edited) Thank you for the information. I will give it a look when I can. Seems with all the internet being used from home. Unless I try and do something lets say at 5:00 AM. Many of my pages never load or data is lost. Edited March 20, 2020 by Brian H
lilyoyo1 Posted March 20, 2020 Posted March 20, 2020 6 hours ago, Teken said: Another new listing for hardware has been added just today from Smartlabs and the FCC ID is: SBP-Wall / PS01 https://fccid.io/SBP-WALL Initial testing data can be found here: https://fccid.io/SBP-WALL/Test-Report/S19101601506001-FCC-249-R1-4657462 Perhaps we shall see a couple of new pieces of hardware for 2020 such as the PLM Pro with 4K links! I'm sure they'll make us all happy this year or early next.... As well as piss off many others
larryllix Posted March 20, 2020 Posted March 20, 2020 (edited) It will be called the 007 wallswitch. Put out by the VP Daniel Craig Cregg. I wonder what they changed, if SH knows yet. Edited March 20, 2020 by larryllix 1
lilyoyo1 Posted March 20, 2020 Posted March 20, 2020 52 minutes ago, larryllix said: It will be called the 007 wallswitch. Put out by the VP Daniel Craig Cregg. I wonder what they changed, if SH knows yet. I'm sure they know. It'll be impressive I'm sure
Teken Posted March 21, 2020 Author Posted March 21, 2020 I'm sure they'll make us all happy this year or early next.... As well as piss off many others Well, if the Insteon Gods we’re listening perhaps it will be a LCD driven KPL? Incorporate energy monitoring? Built in Alexa / Google? Just waiting for the FCC database to show the interior / exterior hardware and initial user manual. On a related tangent hope a new dual band I/O Linc is in the pipeline along with more international offerings for our brothers & sisters across the pond! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
kclenden Posted March 21, 2020 Posted March 21, 2020 59 minutes ago, Teken said: Well, if the Insteon Gods we’re listening perhaps it will be a LCD driven KPL? I don't think the IGs were listening. It's described as a 4-button KPL.
lilyoyo1 Posted March 21, 2020 Posted March 21, 2020 1 hour ago, Teken said: Well, if the Insteon Gods we’re listening perhaps it will be a LCD driven KPL? Incorporate energy monitoring? Built in Alexa / Google? Just waiting for the FCC database to show the interior / exterior hardware and initial user manual. On a related tangent hope a new dual band I/O Linc is in the pipeline along with more international offerings for our brothers & sisters across the pond! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Yeah..... They aren't listening that much. Besides, not enough willing to pay for what it would cost 1
larryllix Posted March 21, 2020 Posted March 21, 2020 37 minutes ago, kclenden said: I don't think the IGs were listening. It's described as a 4-button KPL. Where did you see the KPL description?
kclenden Posted March 21, 2020 Posted March 21, 2020 25 minutes ago, larryllix said: Where did you see the KPL description? In the "Family models declaration letter". 1
larryllix Posted March 21, 2020 Posted March 21, 2020 I wonder what the "Dial Switch" could be? Analogue looking dimmer with a rheostat style knob?
Brian H Posted March 21, 2020 Posted March 21, 2020 Teken. Don't hold your breath on seeing things like the users manual, internal and external photos. They are listed as available 09/16/2020 on the FCC web page. Things like the schematics will probably never be released to the public. Unless something has changed. They never released schematics publicly in the past and I doubt the new management will change things.
larryllix Posted March 21, 2020 Posted March 21, 2020 Teken. Don't hold your breath on seeing things like the users manual, internal and external photos. They are listed as available 09/16/2020 on the FCC web page. Things like the schematics will probably never be released to the public. Unless something has changed. They never released schematics publicly in the past and I doubt the new management will change things. They even release white papers with misleading specs to confuse copycats.Sent using Tapatalk
Teken Posted March 22, 2020 Author Posted March 22, 2020 They even release white papers with misleading specs to confuse copycats.Sent using Tapatalk Larry,I’ve seen you reference this a few times over the years. Is there something specific you can point out that you believe is less than factual in the Insteon White Paper?!? I’ve read this document quite a few times over the years and can’t say there are any elements which aren’t grounded in facts or supported by the actual hardware.The only thing I could probably call out that isn’t what most people would consider security is the fact Smartlabs over plays the linking process as being one of the primary security elements. If they were serious like Z-Wave they would have incorporated true encryption along with local add linking to the topology.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
larryllix Posted March 22, 2020 Posted March 22, 2020 25 minutes ago, Teken said: Larry, I’ve seen you reference this a few times over the years. Is there something specific you can point out that you believe is less than factual in the Insteon White Paper?!? I’ve read this document quite a few times over the years and can’t say there are any elements which aren’t grounded in facts or supported by the actual hardware. The only thing I could probably call out that isn’t what most people would consider security is the fact Smartlabs over plays the linking process as being one of the primary security elements. If they were serious like Z-Wave they would have incorporated true encryption along with local add linking to the topology. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk This was one source somebody posted a years ago. Although he didn't succeed to hack into and control Insteon equipment while demonstrating he did discover many aspects of the documentation was false, mostly frequencies and some of the protocol, IIRC. AS I continue to maintain, whitepapers are not specifications. They are proposals for comment. Most companies protect their intelligent properties by publishing old version off-spec documents. THE USPO has become a poor system and checks nothing anymore except you signed the prior art docs.
kclenden Posted March 22, 2020 Posted March 22, 2020 19 hours ago, Brian H said: Things like the schematics will probably never be released to the public. Unless something has changed. Nothing has changed. This was in their confidentiality request:
Brian H Posted March 22, 2020 Posted March 22, 2020 (edited) Actually some things have changed. The Operational Descriptions and Block Diagrams where in the early Insteon FCC Database files. They where still in the 2413U/S PLM FCC Files. I suspect now that Richmond has taken over they have gotten more restricted on what the public can access. The schematics and parts lists for the 2414U/S PLC and 2412S/U older PLM. Where in the Developers Guides. Us early Developers Group members had access to. When they close the group. For awhile the developers information files where publicly released for all to download. Edited March 22, 2020 by Brian H
Teken Posted March 22, 2020 Author Posted March 22, 2020 I was thinking maybe this new 4 button KPL is like the wide button version some members have created in the past. Our dear friend Stu had made a few and show cased them in past threads.I’ve been wanting to do the same for awhile but never got around to doing so. If this is similar then Smartlabs has saved me time and effort and the frame assembly will be purpose built to do so! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
lilyoyo1 Posted March 22, 2020 Posted March 22, 2020 41 minutes ago, Teken said: I was thinking maybe this new 4 button KPL is like the wide button version some members have created in the past. Our dear friend Stu had made a few and show cased them in past threads. I’ve been wanting to do the same for awhile but never got around to doing so. If this is similar then Smartlabs has saved me time and effort and the frame assembly will be purpose built to do so! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk A 4 button would be great. I'd have greater need for that over a 6 button
larryllix Posted March 22, 2020 Posted March 22, 2020 2 hours ago, lilyoyo1 said: A 4 button would be great. I'd have greater need for that over a 6 button Yes. Larger buttons are easier to label and tap. To many buttons on a wall plate makes it more intimidating for non-HA people to us. All my keypad, battery and power, except one got junk boxed, once Alexa and Google Home came out. With dozens or hundreds of vocal buttons I can push, why limit myself to 6 or 8 unlabelled, 'try and see what happens', type buttons.. Then there is the cloud aspect though.
lilyoyo1 Posted March 22, 2020 Posted March 22, 2020 36 minutes ago, larryllix said: Yes. Larger buttons are easier to label and tap. To many buttons on a wall plate makes it more intimidating for non-HA people to us. All my keypad, battery and power, except one got junk boxed, once Alexa and Google Home came out. With dozens or hundreds of vocal buttons I can push, why limit myself to 6 or 8 unlabelled, 'try and see what happens', type buttons.. Then there is the cloud aspect though. Automation as well as voice control has freed up most of what I used the extra buttons for. I still have them for some stuff but in the near future, I can see not needing more than 4 at all
jwagner010 Posted November 26, 2020 Posted November 26, 2020 Anyone have any ideas or a guess when we might see this new 4 button key pad?
lilyoyo1 Posted November 26, 2020 Posted November 26, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, jwagner010 said: Anyone have any ideas or a guess when we might see this new 4 button key pad? Those that know would not be able to say. If I had to guess, I'd say second quarter next year. Third at the most Edited November 26, 2020 by lilyoyo1
Teken Posted November 28, 2020 Author Posted November 28, 2020 As of this writing the bulk of the internal / external photos have been released for the various products.An interim user manual is also published but with nothing called out (TBA). Sadly, the dial switch isn’t listed anywhere for review.The biggest news in all of this is Smartlabs appears to be involved with another company. There doesn’t appear to be much information as it pertains to their business relationship so hard to say how they fit into the mix.After 15 years even this new owner has failed make any in roads with any major third party hardware vendor. The fact Insteon continues to sell and have some market share is truly amazing and unbelievable.Their next generation Hub is the latest FCC filing which affirms (yet again) they believe this is money well spent. Instead of investing money in solid components for higher reliability in all of their hardware?!?If the picture of the latest hardware are to be accepted someone must be a fan of Wemo because that’s what it looks like an ugly turd.2021 is fast approaching and Smartlabs continues to offer hardware with no encryption, no energy monitoring, no field upgradable firmware!I received 27 Alpha, Beta, and Market Ready pieces of hardware in the last 14 months. Every one of them has some form of industry standardized encryption whether it be via software / hardware chip. All of them can monitor the voltage, frequency, power, and current!Lastly, all of them can be upgraded with the latest firmware?!?How the hell companies from small to large in different parts of the world do this yet Smartlabs - Can’t????The answer is inept and out of touch CEO’s and people below them - period. The reality is Insteon would not have any market share if it wasn’t for the 2413S PLM which has allowed great companies like UDI to band aid their hardware.Unlike many here I won’t follow any lighting vendor as the last ten years as proven it’s still a clown show. For me the long term solution and future is in smart panels. No more can’t use this load, no more replacing $50 - 100.00 switches every random year. No more WiFi, BLE, Power Line, RF, and no more proprietary bull sh^t protocol like Insteon, Z-Wave, Zigbee, X-10, blah blah.It just works - that’s the road I’m traveling on in the near term! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
larryllix Posted November 28, 2020 Posted November 28, 2020 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Teken said: As of this writing the bulk of the internal / external photos have been released for the various products. An interim user manual is also published but with nothing called out (TBA). Sadly, the dial switch isn’t listed anywhere for review. The biggest news in all of this is Smartlabs appears to be involved with another company. There doesn’t appear to be much information as it pertains to their business relationship so hard to say how they fit into the mix. After 15 years even this new owner has failed make any in roads with any major third party hardware vendor. The fact Insteon continues to sell and have some market share is truly amazing and unbelievable. Their next generation Hub is the latest FCC filing which affirms (yet again) they believe this is money well spent. Instead of investing money in solid components for higher reliability in all of their hardware?!? If the picture of the latest hardware are to be accepted someone must be a fan of Wemo because that’s what it looks like an ugly turd. 2021 is fast approaching and Smartlabs continues to offer hardware with no encryption, no energy monitoring, no field upgradable firmware! I received 27 Alpha, Beta, and Market Ready pieces of hardware in the last 14 months. Every one of them has some form of industry standardized encryption whether it be via software / hardware chip. All of them can monitor the voltage, frequency, power, and current! Lastly, all of them can be upgraded with the latest firmware?!? How the hell companies from small to large in different parts of the world do this yet Smartlabs - Can’t???? The answer is inept and out of touch CEO’s and people below them - period. The reality is Insteon would not have any market share if it wasn’t for the 2413S PLM which has allowed great companies like UDI to band aid their hardware. Unlike many here I won’t follow any lighting vendor as the last ten years as proven it’s still a clown show. For me the long term solution and future is in smart panels. No more can’t use this load, no more replacing $50 - 100.00 switches every random year. No more WiFi, BLE, Power Line, RF, and no more proprietary bull sh^t protocol like Insteon, Z-Wave, Zigbee, X-10, blah blah. It just works - that’s the road I’m traveling on in the near term! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk We don't say "clown show". We are not supposed to talk politics here. I would be happy with one decent Insteon device this decade/century/millennia. An Insteon load meter that could be used for device activation sensing...and with capacitors costing more than 0.00043 cents each. Good Engineers must be hard to get these days! Myopic Accountants must be cheap. Edited November 28, 2020 by larryllix
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