Using INSTEON micro on/off for ceiling fan control

[kevindavis544]

I have a situation coming up next week where someone has a severe disability and can’t control his ceiling fan with the pull chains. He is dependent on others for this. I would like to provide him the ability to at least turn it on and off by himself using a PC equipped with eye-gaze control. The fan has constant power (no wall switch is connected). Adding a FanLinc is not an option due to lack of ability to use voice and impaired fine motor skills for using touchscreen interface.

 

I am assuming the fan has a 14-2 or 14-3 power supply leading to it. Can I use the INSTEON micro on/off module for controlling on/off to the fan? This fan has no RF automation. Just a plain Jane with speeds and light controlled by pull chain. The fan has two chains, one of fan and one for the fan’s light.

 

If the answer is “yes it can be used in this application”, I am assuming I will follow the Quick Start Guide instructions for “Without Switch”. From this diagram, it looks like L1 (Down) and L 2 (Up) are wired to “Motor”.

 

1. I use just one of these and not both?

2. If I use only one, does it make any difference which one I use (L1 or L2)?

3. Is the L1 used for the Fan motor and L2 used for the fan’s light?

Thank you everyone and please stay safe.

Note: I have updated the diagram to represent the micro module I am considering.

 

[larryllix]

I assume you would be using an ISY for the interface from PC to Insteon device. If so I do not know why you couldn't use a fanLinc, designed for the job.

ISY programs could ramp fan speed Low/Med/High/Off from a single input. The PC could send Rest commands to ISY's Rest interface, using simple URL calls. ISY can detect these via variable values, or direct program controls from the PC using ISY's Rest i/f.

I am not sure if the Insteon FanLinc has light control built-in also.

[mwester]

There are three micro units - the "dimmer" unit is clearly unsuitable for motor control, the "open/close" unit (as your picture depicts) is also unsuitable for ceiling fans.  The micro "on/off" unit might perhaps work, but the relay in the device is too small and is not rated for motor use (motor startup current will probably fuse the contacts and render it useless very quickly).

As noted, the fanlinc is a far better unit, purpose-built for this.

If the fanlinc is not practical, the inlinelinc is a simple on/off unit that can handle small motors.

[gzahar]

Here is link for micro on/off device.

http://cache.insteon.com/documentation/2443-x22-en.pdf

Your wiring diagram does not look right.
It says it is rated to 360W for inductive loads. Not sure what typical fan loads are.
It would only provide control for fan or light, not both (without using 2). Also no speed control (w/o using chain).
So do you plan on using an external control device wired to the sense wires?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Brian H]

The 2444-222 Open Close Micro Module. Normally is used for things like a shade. It has a built in timer you set and only powers the Open or Close output for a set time. So the Fan or Light may only be On for a time set internally.

If you wanted to use a Sense Input.  You supply 120VAC to the Sense Wire and Neutral reference.  So external Sense Wiring would be at 120VAC and need proper insulation

I did notice on the Smarthome Sales site. The 2442-222 Dimmer and 2443-222 On/Off micro modules are not listed right now. Only the 2444-222 Open/Closed micro module is listed. The 2443-222 On/Off probably would be a better choice if available.

[kevindavis544]

I appologize for giving inaccurate information on the INSTEON micro switch. It is the 2443-222 and I now have the correct diagram depicted.

Larryllix: It is the ISY994iZW Pro I will be setting up for this person. My experience with programs is limited and even less with variables. The user interface I will have the person using on his PC with eye-gaze is the UDajax. I need for him to have large buttons on the user interface like the green ON and the red OFF. If just controlling the Motor with the FanLinc, the the spacing between Off, Low, Med, High it too tight for eye-gaze control. I figureed if he can just control on/off, at least he will have some control over the fan (and possibly the light). In the example below, if I clink the green (on), the fan begins by turning on to High. I have found most of the poeple I work with don't want the fan any higher than Low becuase it irritates their eyes (while in bed). So, I thought if the chains are set to the low speed, when the fan has power cut by the micro switch the fan will stop, and when they restore power again by the switch it will come back on at the low speed.

Mwester: I thought about using the 2475SDB inline linc for this but there are two downsides to this (1. It will require a seperate box (approved encloser) and, 2. It appears SmartHome is out of stock on these (like they are a lot of things). So I thought the micro might be able to use the existing enclosure to the fan.

Gzahar: Thank you for the information regarding the specs on the 2443-222 of 350W inductive loads. A google search shows common ceiling fans ranging in size from 46" to 55" will draw from 75w to 100w. 

Brian H: It is my understanding the sense wires are capped when installing without a switch. Do I understand this correctly?

[MrBill]

you can also use a Fanlinc with Scenes:

 

when the scene were created they were made so that when setting a speed, it turns off the other speed.  I use this with an 8-button controller for control of multiple fans, but if this is the style of interface you're looking for, you might consider scenes.

[kevindavis544]

Thank you Mr. Bill. Can you please share what the configuration looks like for each Scene Off | Low | Med | and High in the AC? I am asking becuase when I have created scenes for controlling KPL's with FL's I have followed the instuctions from the wiki

https://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=ISY994i:INSTEON_Device:FanLinc-KPL_FanLinc_KeypadLinc_Configuration

Following these steps, I am not able to use the UDAjax (see below). In this example, it is a 6-button KPL where A Off, B is Low, C is Med and D is High. On each of these, the GUI's for "On" don't respond when clicked on. 

 

[MrBill]

That wiki page didn't exist when I created my fan scenes (I actually looked at the creation date of the page cause I fought with this setup for days), if it had I would be having the same problem that your seeing in the web interface.

In my system i skipped this step:

Click Button Toggle Mode and make all buttons Non Toggle On

my buttons remain toggles, the only weirdness is that on the 6/8 Button controller it is actually possible to turn off the fans using the button that's currently lit.

But since the buttons remain toggles the ON is not deselected in the UDAjax interface.  Trade off I suppose.

 

 

[Brian H]

Yes if you are not using the Sense Inputs. They are capped off and not used. I only mentioned it if you found it necessary to use a Sense Input.