Screw Loose Dan Posted February 26, 2021 Posted February 26, 2021 My one IOLinc for a garage door is showing a communication error in ISY (pop-up when signing in and red exclamation next to it). I've tried querying and writing to the device, with no luck. This is what the Event Log shows on a query: Thu 02/25/2021 09:14:26 PM : [INST-TX-I1 ] 02 62 24 2B DF 0F 19 01 Thu 02/25/2021 09:14:26 PM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 24.2B.DF 0F 19 01 06 LTSREQ (01) Thu 02/25/2021 09:14:34 PM : [INST-TX-I1 ] 02 62 24 2B DF 0F 19 01 Thu 02/25/2021 09:14:34 PM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 24.2B.DF 0F 19 01 06 LTSREQ (01) Thu 02/25/2021 09:14:43 PM : [INST-TX-I1 ] 02 62 24 2B DF 0F 19 01 Thu 02/25/2021 09:14:43 PM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 24.2B.DF 0F 19 01 06 LTSREQ (01) I've never really dove into the Insteon communications. Is the ACK from the PLM? Or is that from the device itself? This is what a write looks like (making an option change to trigger): Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:01 PM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [24 2B DF 1] [ERR] [0] uom=0 prec=-1 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:01 PM : [ 24 2B DF 1] ERR 0 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:01 PM : [All ] Writing 101 bytes to devices Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:01 PM : [24 2B DF 1 ] Memory : Write dbAddr=0x0033 [09] cmd1=0x2E cmd2=0x00 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:01 PM : [INST-TX-I2CS] 02 62 24 2B DF 1F 2E 00 01 06 09 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 C2 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:01 PM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 24.2B.DF 1F 2E 00 01 06 09 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 C2 06 (00) Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:10 PM : [INST-TX-I2CS] 02 62 24 2B DF 1F 2E 00 01 06 09 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 C2 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:10 PM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 24.2B.DF 1F 2E 00 01 06 09 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 C2 06 (00) Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:19 PM : [INST-TX-I2CS] 02 62 24 2B DF 1F 2E 00 01 06 09 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 C2 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:19 PM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 24.2B.DF 1F 2E 00 01 06 09 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 C2 06 (00) Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:23 PM : [24 2B DF 1 ] Memory : Write dbAddr=0x0033 [09] cmd1=0x2E cmd2=0x00 - Failed Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:23 PM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [24 2B DF 1] [ERR] [1] uom=0 prec=-1 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:23 PM : [ 24 2B DF 1] ERR 1 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:23 PM : [INST-TX-I2CS] 02 62 4C DA 7F 1F 2F 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 D0 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:23 PM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 4C.DA.7F 1F 2F 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 D0 06 (00) Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:24 PM : [INST-SRX ] 02 50 4C.DA.7F 3B.94.51 2F 2F 00 (00) Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:24 PM : [Std-Direct Ack] 4C.DA.7F-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=3 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:24 PM : [INST-ERX ] 02 51 4C DA 7F 3B 94 51 15 2F 00 01 01 0F FF 00 A2 00 3B 94 51 FF 1F 01 E0 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:24 PM : [Ext-Direct ] 4C.DA.7F-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=1, Hops Left=1 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:25 PM : [All ] Writing 100 bytes to devices Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:25 PM : [INST-TX-I2CS] 02 62 4C DA 7F 1F 2F 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 D0 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:25 PM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 4C.DA.7F 1F 2F 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 D0 06 (00) Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:25 PM : [INST-SRX ] 02 50 4C.DA.7F 3B.94.51 2F 2F 00 (00) Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:25 PM : [Std-Direct Ack] 4C.DA.7F-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=3 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:25 PM : [INST-SRX ] 02 50 4C.DA.7F 3B.94.51 23 2F 00 (00) Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:25 PM : [Std-Direct Ack] 4C.DA.7F-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=0 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:25 PM : [INST-ERX ] 02 51 4C DA 7F 3B 94 51 15 2F 00 01 01 0F FF 00 A2 00 3B 94 51 FF 1F 01 E0 Thu 02/25/2021 09:28:25 PM : [Ext-Direct ] 4C.DA.7F-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=1, Hops Left=1 To complicate matters, the IOLinc is on the ceiling in the garage. Normally, not hard to get to on top of a 6 foot ladder...but I recently fell off a ladder (outside in the snow, stupidly) and have 4 broken bones in my foot and my L2 vertebrata fractured. So, absolutely no ladders for at least a 4-6 weeks. If I'm going to do anything physically with the IOLinc, I need a solid easy plan. So, I'm thinking I'll ask my significant other to just swap it out for one that I pre-setup (not sure how that's going to be received). Before I go that route, I figured I'd ask here if there's anything else I should try remotely.
larryllix Posted February 26, 2021 Posted February 26, 2021 Get a FilterLinc and plug the I/OLink into the unfiltered receptacle and the GDO plug into the filtered receptacle. GDOs (especially Chamberlain with battery backup) are notorious for crippling Insteon signals.
kclenden Posted February 26, 2021 Posted February 26, 2021 4 hours ago, Screw Loose Dan said: Is the ACK from the PLM? Yes, the ACK is from the PLM. Both of your log sections show attempts to communicate with device 24 2B DF with absolutely no response from the device. It could be that the device has gone bad, or as @larryllix hypothesizes, it's possible the communication from the PLM is never reaching the device because a garage door opening is blocking the signal. To test that, you could always just unplug any garage door openers and try communicating with the IOLinc again.
Screw Loose Dan Posted February 26, 2021 Author Posted February 26, 2021 I guess it's possible that the GDO became noisy? Capacitors go bad... The IOLinc has been in place since 2013 or so. Never had an issue before. I never tested the communication of this device before, but never had a reason to. There's another IOLinc on the same branch circuit, controlling the other GDO, it's still functioning correctly. Both IOLincs are the same age and both GDOs are same age/model/manuafacturer (Craftman, likely relabeled Chamberlain?). I agree testing for noise (FilterLinc or unplugging the GDO) should be the first step. And the testing with the physical unit would be very simple, normally. Here's the other IOLinc for the other GDO, as I said it's on the same circuit, just a few feet away. Did both a query and an option update. Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:25 AM : [INST-TX-I1 ] 02 62 24 2E A3 0F 19 01 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:25 AM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 24.2E.A3 0F 19 01 06 LTSREQ (01) Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:25 AM : [INST-SRX ] 02 50 24.2E.A3 3B.94.51 2F 00 01 (01) Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:25 AM : [Std-Direct Ack] 24.2E.A3-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=3 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:25 AM : [INST-TX-I1 ] 02 62 24 2E A3 0F 19 00 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:25 AM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 24.2E.A3 0F 19 00 06 LTSREQ (LIGHT) Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:25 AM : [INST-SRX ] 02 50 24.2E.A3 3B.94.51 2F 00 00 (00) Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:25 AM : [Std-Direct Ack] 24.2E.A3-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=3 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:36 AM : [All ] Writing 101 bytes to devices Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:36 AM : [24 2E A3 1 ] Memory : Write dbAddr=0x0033 [08] cmd1=0x2E cmd2=0x00 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:36 AM : [INST-TX-I2CS] 02 62 24 2E A3 1F 2E 00 01 06 08 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 C3 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:36 AM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 24.2E.A3 1F 2E 00 01 06 08 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 C3 06 (00) Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:36 AM : [INST-SRX ] 02 50 24.2E.A3 3B.94.51 2F 2E 00 (00) Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:36 AM : [Std-Direct Ack] 24.2E.A3-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=3 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:36 AM : [INST-TX-I2CS] 02 62 4C DA 7F 1F 2F 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 D0 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:36 AM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 4C.DA.7F 1F 2F 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 D0 06 (00) Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:37 AM : [INST-SRX ] 02 50 4C.DA.7F 3B.94.51 2F 2F 00 (00) Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:37 AM : [Std-Direct Ack] 4C.DA.7F-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=3 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:37 AM : [INST-ERX ] 02 51 4C DA 7F 3B 94 51 15 2F 00 01 01 0F FF 00 A2 00 3B 94 51 FF 1F 01 E0 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:37 AM : [Ext-Direct ] 4C.DA.7F-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=1, Hops Left=1 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:37 AM : [All ] Writing 100 bytes to devices Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:37 AM : [INST-TX-I2CS] 02 62 4C DA 7F 1F 2F 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 D0 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:37 AM : [INST-ACK ] 02 62 4C.DA.7F 1F 2F 00 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 D0 06 (00) Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:38 AM : [INST-SRX ] 02 50 4C.DA.7F 3B.94.51 2F 2F 00 (00) Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:38 AM : [Std-Direct Ack] 4C.DA.7F-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=3 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:38 AM : [INST-ERX ] 02 51 4C DA 7F 3B 94 51 15 2F 00 01 01 0F FF 00 A2 00 3B 94 51 FF 1F 01 E0 Fri 02/26/2021 02:31:38 AM : [Ext-Direct ] 4C.DA.7F-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=1, Hops Left=1 Thanks for the feedback guys. I guess I need to ask my better half for some more help...
Brian H Posted February 26, 2021 Posted February 26, 2021 (edited) The I/OLinc has the same switching power supply chip as the 2413S/U PLM and revision 2 Access Points. Like the PLM Smarthome has changed capacitors values. In attempts the fix the problem. Depending on what hardware revision you have. So it could be possible it has failed or is confused by some power line noise and would need a power cycle to maybe correct it. It could also be what has been pointed out. As a power line only module. Some new noise or signal suckers has effected the communication to the module. My file on changes I had seen in the I/OLinc: I had a chance to look at a few different hardware revisions of the 2450 I/O Linc Modules. They use the same LNK354GN Switching Power Supply IC as the 2413 PLM and V2 Access Points. C7 was the part I found changed. Between hardware revisions. Hardware V1.0 0851: C3 6.8uf/250V C11 100uf/25V C8 10uf/16V C7 10uf/25V 25V rating was close to the 21VDC I measured on it. Hardware V1.8 1202: C3 6.8uf/250V C11 100uf/25V C8 10uf/16V C7 10uf/50V Mounted horizontally over PCB. As it was large to fit the boards hole spacing. Hardware V2.3 1430: C3 6.8uf/250V C11 100uf/25V C8 10uf/16V C7 220uf/50V Mounted horizontally over PCB. As it was large to fit the boards hole spacing. My thoughts are. In V1.8 C7 was changed to 10uf/50V for a better safety margin. In V2.3 C7 was changed to 220uf/50V to beef up the power supply. Edited February 26, 2021 by Brian H Add information
Screw Loose Dan Posted February 26, 2021 Author Posted February 26, 2021 1 hour ago, Brian H said: or is confused by some power line noise and would need a power cycle to maybe correct it. Thanks for all the great information! I did power cycle the unit when the issue first appeared (using the circuit breaker), but no change. When I get this one down, I'll take a look at what revision it it and if it's not one of the ones listed above, I'll try to get you what it has in it. 1
larryllix Posted February 26, 2021 Posted February 26, 2021 (edited) "Capacitors go bad" In my line of experience with many industrial style battery chargers they don't have any capacitors to smooth out the charging. The battery provides all the smoothing necessary for the circuits. When the battery gets older and the impedance increases more ripple noise is seen by other devices. If you are running a battery backed up style of GDO, your battery may be getting old. When my second Chamberlian GDO was installed, it crippled my Insteon systems right away,so I knew where to look. Then I found my older unit with just AC motors, was also doing the same thing, just not as badly. When I search the forums, I found dozens of others complaining of the same thing over the years. They don't have to be operating, just plugged in. Unplug both GDOs and operate the door by hand to test. Edited February 26, 2021 by larryllix
Screw Loose Dan Posted February 28, 2021 Author Posted February 28, 2021 Well, figured out the issue and resolved for now. I'm slightly embarrassed it was something so simple... The IOLinc had wiggled loose and wasn't plugged in fully. I hadn't thought about looking at the status lights (I don't really notice them normally being up on the 10 ft ceiling), but as soon as my girlfriend touched the IOLinc, the lights came on. She left the 1st GDO unplugged (never bothered with the 2nd one), I tested and confirmed everything worked as expected. Had her plug the GDO back in, repeated tests, and again everything worked as expected. So, for now everything is back to working. I will need to think about a way to more securely hold the IOLinc in place to the ceiling outlet. And, I'll consider putting FilterLincs in place as well. Thanks again for all the suggestions and feedback.
larryllix Posted February 28, 2021 Posted February 28, 2021 Yeah, once you get some lube on the brass/copper contacts thing slide out easily. I think mine are held in by the cords plugged into the ends puts torsion on the ioLinc and keeps it held up. Well, it didn't cost anything other than your time. Glad you solved it!
david-4 Posted May 11, 2021 Posted May 11, 2021 I found the source of my IOLinc failure Problem: I recently started having a similar problem with the IOLinc (2450 V2.4) I use to control and monitor the status of my garage door. It has worked fine for years until today. Every time I triggered the IOLinc to open or close the door the IOLinc would go offline and the ISY reported it as unavailable. It didn't matter if it were triggered from a program or directly from the Admin console. I would have to manually press the link button on the side of the IOLinc to get the IOLinc back on line. I tried disconnecting the IOLinc from the garage door opener but it would still go offline when triggered. But if I moved it to another room it worked fine. After much trial and error I discovered the true cause. Cause and Solution: I had plugged in my Dewalt battery charger (model DCB112) a few days ago and left it plugged in even though I had removed the batter I was charging. It was on the same branch circuit as the IOLinc. When I unplugged the Dewalt charger the IOLinc worked fine! In the future I will use a filter when I plug in the battery charger and unplug it when not in use.
Brian H Posted May 11, 2021 Posted May 11, 2021 The I/OLinc is power line only. So it is possible it was generating power line noise or has an across the AC line type capacitor {Signal Sucker}. On its AC input. Another thing to watch is the lights in them. Some of the LED bulbs will also cause issues. With the RF Keyfobs. I believe it was Lift Master actually markets a Garage Door Opener friendly LED bulb. I have also seen some of those new Deformable LED Garage Lights reviews. Saying when On they spew out RF noise and render the Keyfob remotes close to useless.
MrBill Posted May 11, 2021 Posted May 11, 2021 2 hours ago, david-4 said: Cause and Solution: I had plugged in my Dewalt battery charger (model DCB112) a few days ago and left it plugged in even though I had removed the batter I was charging. It was on the same branch circuit as the IOLinc. When I unplugged the Dewalt charger the IOLinc worked fine! We used to have a deep fryer in the kitchen that if left plugged in and turned off it killed Insteon signals in most of the house... Oddly while heating (120V), things were fine, but once it reached temp and cycled off... same thing... or it was turned off and left plugged in... it was either a noisemaker or signal sucker, never knew which... it was too heavy of a load for filterlinc so we just lived with it for the 30-60 minutes a week it was plugged in (used for homemade mexican chips). That deep fryer eventually went tits up (it was 25 years old) and the replacement peacefully co-exists with Insteon.
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