johnmsch Posted March 22, 2010 Posted March 22, 2010 I have 3 sets of lights in my garage, each with its own Insteon switch, that I'd like to control from just one switch. I wanted to add a new switch, which would not be directly connected to any light, but when I turn it on, it would turn on the other 3 switches. Also, turning this one off would turn off all 3 switches. Ideally, I'd like it to turn off all but one of them. Seems like I've read about a setup like this some time ago. I was thinking that this would not even involve the ISY-99, but some kind of Insteon-to-Insteon configuration. Thanks for any tips/ideas!
ryarber Posted March 22, 2010 Posted March 22, 2010 If I'm understanding you correctly, you want a dummy (non load) switch to turn on 3 lights, but only turn off 2 of them? If so, the way I'd accomplish this is to set up a scene with the new switch as a controller and the 2 devices you'd like to turn on and off as responders. I'd use a program to activate the 3rd device whenever the new switch is turned on.
oberkc Posted March 22, 2010 Posted March 22, 2010 Also, turning this one off would turn off all 3 switches. I would expect that you could do this, without an ISY. Simply put all the devices in a scene. Ideally, I'd like it to turn off all but one of them. I am having trouble envisioning how to do this without something like the ISY.
johnmsch Posted March 22, 2010 Author Posted March 22, 2010 Thanks for the quick replies and great suggestions. I'm just not experienced enough with setting up scenes to have known this. Gives me something to work on. I am having trouble envisioning how to do this without something like the ISY. I believe there is a way to setup an Insteon switch to control other Insteon switches without using an ISY. However, this gives me a great opportunity to do my first real scene in the ISY. Up to now, all my switches are setup just to control one light. Thanks again
oberkc Posted March 22, 2010 Posted March 22, 2010 I believe there is a way to setup an Insteon switch to control other Insteon switches without using an ISY There is no doubt that one can set up an insteon switch to control other insteon switches without having an ISY. Your ideal scenerio was a bit more complicated than this, however. Your "ideal" scenerio would be to turn on 3 other devices from a single switch, but only turn off 2 of the 3 original devices. It is that particular scenario that I would have trouble doing without an ISY. If all you want to do is use a single switch to control (both on and off) 3 other switches, that is easy. Set all in a scene with the singles switch as the controller. This would be done the old-fashioned way of putting one device into linking mode, then linking other devices to it.
Goose66 Posted March 22, 2010 Posted March 22, 2010 If you use the multi-linking mode of the SwitchLinc, are you not able to link one group of responders to ON and another group of responders to OFF (unlike regular linking)? In other words, instead of using the regular linking procedure to link the non-load SwitchLinc (SL) to the other 3 loads, perform multi-linking for the ON position of the non-load SL and add the 3 loads in ON condition, then perform multi-linking procedure for OFF position of the non-load SL and add the 2 loads in OFF condition. I haven't done this, but it seems theoretically possible. It would also be interesting to see how this then loads into the ISY as scenes.
oberkc Posted March 22, 2010 Posted March 22, 2010 I understand multi-linking mode to simply be the ability to set one device (the controller) into linking mode, then linking more than one device as a responder, without having to put the first device back into linking mode between each responder. I do not understand it to have the capability to separate on and off control.
johnmsch Posted March 22, 2010 Author Posted March 22, 2010 Thanks again for all the great feedback. I've been reading more about setting up scenes in the ISY and this does look like the way to go. Now, what about the "master" switch that controls all the others? Can someone recommend a particular switch? I have about a dozen Insteon switches already, but wonder how I would wire this new one. Would I just cap off the (red?) wire that normally would go to the light?
Sub-Routine Posted March 22, 2010 Posted March 22, 2010 Yes, just cap the red wire. Sounds like the perfect use for a keypad. Thanks again for all the great feedback. I've been reading more about setting up scenes in the ISY and this does look like the way to go. Now, what about the "master" switch that controls all the others? Can someone recommend a particular switch? I have about a dozen Insteon switches already, but wonder how I would wire this new one. Would I just cap off the (red?) wire that normally would go to the light?
johnmsch Posted March 22, 2010 Author Posted March 22, 2010 Yes, just cap the red wire.Sounds like the perfect use for a keypad. Yes indeed! Been looking for an excuse to get one of those, and that's it! I can have one button to turn everything on, another to turn everything off, another to turn off all but one... This is gonna be fun! Thanks!!!!
oberkc Posted March 22, 2010 Posted March 22, 2010 I have about a dozen Insteon switches already, but wonder how I would wire this new one. Are these dozen switches not installed? Did someone else install them? The new one would be installed like the others. Any (there may be an exception) insteon switch requires a line, neutral, and ground. If you intend to control a load with this switch, then you need access to the load's line and neutral connections. Pick a switch that suits your tastes. As suggested, you may consider a keypad. This would allow you to control up to eights scenes. Any insteon switch can act as a "master", including any of the twelve that you already have. All insteon switches have the ability to control a load. If controlling a load is not needed, cap it off as already suggested. Communication between devices is over the powerlines (some exceptions). You may need access points or some way to communicate between various phases of your electrical system.
johnmsch Posted March 22, 2010 Author Posted March 22, 2010 I have about a dozen Insteon switches already, but wonder how I would wire this new one. Are these dozen switches not installed? Did someone else install them? The new one would be installed like the others. Any (there may be an exception) insteon switch requires a line, neutral, and ground. If you intend to control a load with this switch, then you need access to the load's line and neutral connections. Pick a switch that suits your tastes. As suggested, you may consider a keypad. This would allow you to control up to eights scenes. Any insteon switch can act as a "master", including any of the twelve that you already have. All insteon switches have the ability to control a load. If controlling a load is not needed, cap it off as already suggested. Communication between devices is over the powerlines (some exceptions). You may need access points or some way to communicate between various phases of your electrical system. Yes, they are all installed and I did it myself. Used to have about a dozen X10s throughout the house. After some extensive remodeling, I'm down to 3 X10s. Just a matter of time before I replace them with Insteons, but as long as they work, I'll keep them around. Just to be sure I'm on the right track, this is the keypad I'm looking at:KeypadLinc - INSTEON 6 Button Keypad Controller. I'm assuming I could replace one of the light switches with this KeypadLinc. Then, I could program (in the ISY) for button "A" to turn on all three sets of lights, button "B" to turn off all but one, and button "C" to turn them all off? Thanks again for all the great advise!
oberkc Posted March 22, 2010 Posted March 22, 2010 Just to be sure I'm on the right track, this is the keypad I'm looking at:KeypadLinc - INSTEON 6 Button Keypad Controller. I'm assuming I could replace one of the light switches with this KeypadLinc. There is also an 8-button configuration that you may prefer. Yes, you could program these as you suggest.
Goose66 Posted March 22, 2010 Posted March 22, 2010 I would suggest the 8 button if there is no local load, as well. You would not have to program button C to turn them all off, necessarily, because button A could be use to turn all three on an off (toggle mode) and button B could be use to turn off the two (non-toggle mode off). You would then want to add a seperate scene with button A as a responder to your ISY and also a program that, upon press of button B also turns off the seperate scene with button A responder. In this way, button A would turn all the lights on (and toggle the status light to the ON state automatically), then button A could turn off all three (and toggle the status light to the OFF state automatically) OR button B could turn off two of the lights and toggle the status light of button A to the OFF state as well.
johnmsch Posted March 23, 2010 Author Posted March 23, 2010 Wow. Lots of great info and help here. Thanks everyone!
apostolakisl Posted March 23, 2010 Posted March 23, 2010 but wonder how I would wire this new one. Would I just cap off the (red?) wire that normally would go to the light? Why doesn't SH sell a non-load switchlinc. It seems like a significant part of the cost of those switches would be in the circuits to handle the load. In my home probably 1/3 of the switches (maybe more) are capped on the load side. It would be nice if perhaps a half-price non-loadable switch were available. Perhaps it could be the 2476DN (N for non load), look just like the 2476D and have the same features, minus the load.
Goose66 Posted March 23, 2010 Posted March 23, 2010 I don't think handling the load is a major part of the cost. You have the 1) mechanical switch mechanism and status LEDs, 2) the power supply for the Insteon circuit, 3) the Insteon circuit itself (which is pretty generic across all devices), and 4) a triac or relay to switch the load. Those triacs are probably less than a dollar per unit. I don't know what else you could get rid of in a non-load switch.
ryarber Posted March 23, 2010 Posted March 23, 2010 They do sell the icon series which is much less expensive and works well as controller switches. Also, if you are just looking for a controller, you might consider a remotelinc. No wiring necessary, you can put it wherever there is a table to set it on. In addition to portability, they offer more control options for a v2 thermostat
apostolakisl Posted March 23, 2010 Posted March 23, 2010 The icon switches look different so that is no good. If you look at the high wattage (2476dh) switches and how much more they cost than the standard, I would think that the load side does play a significant role in cost. Also, the icon switches are I think 300 watt rated and they cost significantly less. Now the icon switches also only have a single led, so how that plays into cost, I don't know. Otherwise the icon switches look a whole lot like the 2476d's both front and back which rules out things like the mechanical parts or the physical structure being the cost.
Sub-Routine Posted March 23, 2010 Posted March 23, 2010 They do, but is only bundled with InlineLincs and the switch is an Icon with only one LED. 2-Wire-INSTEON-Dimmer-Kit Why doesn't SH sell a non-load switchlinc.
Goose66 Posted March 23, 2010 Posted March 23, 2010 I bet you that is simply an icon switch with the red load lead cut.
Recommended Posts