ctviggen1 Posted July 12, 2007 Posted July 12, 2007 I only have two lights registered with the ISY. I have more, but haven't been able to get communication to work at all times. I only have one set of schedules set for one of the lights. For the past two nights, the ISY correctly turned on the scheduled light, but both nights the ISY did not turn off the light. When I opened the Admin Console, there was an error message stating that there was a failure in communication between the light and the ISY. This also happened this morning. I have the ISY in the "basement", in a room with all my networking equipment. I do not have a linked Control Linc. Do I need to link the Control Linc? Do I need to change the location of the ISY? The ISY is located within 10-15 feet of the two insteon RF signal extenders. Should I re-link the inteon modules with the ISY?
Michel Kohanim Posted July 12, 2007 Posted July 12, 2007 ctviggen, I am so very sorry to hear all these troubles you're having. Would you please take a look at the following topics: http://forum.universal-devices.com/viewtopic.php?t=84 http://forum.universal-devices.com/viewtopic.php?t=39 In short, the first one suggests plugging the PLM right on top of one of the SignaLincs. Please do let us know of the outcome. With kind regards, Michel I only have two lights registered with the ISY. I have more, but haven't been able to get communication to work at all times. I only have one set of schedules set for one of the lights. For the past two nights, the ISY correctly turned on the scheduled light, but both nights the ISY did not turn off the light. When I opened the Admin Console, there was an error message stating that there was a failure in communication between the light and the ISY. This also happened this morning. I have the ISY in the "basement", in a room with all my networking equipment. I do not have a linked Control Linc. Do I need to link the Control Linc? Do I need to change the location of the ISY? The ISY is located within 10-15 feet of the two insteon RF signal extenders. Should I re-link the inteon modules with the ISY?
ctviggen1 Posted July 17, 2007 Author Posted July 17, 2007 ctviggen, I am so very sorry to hear all these troubles you're having. Would you please take a look at the following topics: http://forum.universal-devices.com/viewtopic.php?t=84 http://forum.universal-devices.com/viewtopic.php?t=39 In short, the first one suggests plugging the PLM right on top of one of the SignaLincs. Please do let us know of the outcome. With kind regards, Michel Thanks, Michel. I will give that a try (right now) and report back (maybe now or maybe later). Bob
nanckekr Posted September 23, 2007 Posted September 23, 2007 I am stuck with the ISY and PLM communication problems and hope this forum can help. My domain is as follows: - #2414U, running HomeSeer & PowerHome software - 4 * #2475D - #2856D2 - #2856S3 - 2 * #2456D3 - 4 * #2442 - #2412S (3507Firm52 Rev 2.4) - #2486D - 2 * #2430 I have about 3 circuits and 1900 sqft I have no X10 devices at all. The PLC and through that HomeSeer + PowerHome software is fully able to access and control ALL the devices with very good reliability. THe #2430 and #2486D is also able to control any of the Insteon devices with no problems at all. When introducing the ISY I noticed like many others that communication from the PLM to the rest of the Insteon devices was significantly worse than what the PLC was able to do. I started with locating the PLC & the PLM on the same outlet to give them same communication conditions. The PLM was able to contact 3 out of 11 devices, and even then in a very unreliable way, i.e. devices suddenly went into communication problems only to work later... Other people on this board have reported similar behavior. I followed the forum's advice and mounted the PLM on top of a SignalLinc RF. That enabled me to contact a total of 5-7 of my 11 Insteon devices. As the communication between 2 of these are still unreliable I tried to follow the other advice from the forum such as: - Try another PLM (0720Rev1.9 FIRM 4.0) - Try to remove the PLC from the network - Try to relocate the PLM to another circuit, then to 3 different physical locations. Using PowerHome I retrieved fresh information about linking tables for each of the insteon devices, only to verify, that all links were still valid, and that there were not bad links in the insteon devices that could create a noisy network. Michale mentioned that a blinking PLM light could be indication of problems. I do not have that at all. I do have one of my KeyPadLinc's that is blinking a lot. Due to that I tried with and without that KeyPadLinc on the network --> No impact on the PLM's communication ability. I don't know what else to try at this point, since the network is very reliable using the PLC and the KeyPadLinc's. I hope my feedback on using the SignalLinc as communication buffer can help some of you, and that someone is able to help me with ideas on how to proceed. BR, Anders
Michel Kohanim Posted September 23, 2007 Posted September 23, 2007 Mr. Anders, I am so very sorry to hear about the issues you've been experiencing. As you may already know, PLM has 75% of the throughput than that of the PLC and, that may explain only some of the symptoms you are experiencing. Here are my thoughts and I do appreciate your patience while we troubleshoot the problem: 1. Please go back to your original PLM (FIRM 52) ... PLM Firm 40 is not supported by ISY 2. If you have AccessPoints, may I humbly suggest replacing your SignaLincs with AccessPoints? Since your installation is not that large, I think you'd be fine with only 2 AccessPoints one of which should be mounted on top of the PLM 3. When you initially setup devices in ISY, which option did you choose (rewrite existing links, add devices but rewrite existing links, or add devices and import links)? 4. Now that you can "unreliably" communicate with those devices, do you see a pattern when the devices are most unreliable (i.e. in the morning, etc.)? 5. Is your KeypadLinc still blinking even after you disconnected and reconnected it? If so, I really do believe that you have a bad KPL ... in any case, if you still have a blinking KPL, may I humbly suggest --a. disconnect your PLC --b. disconnect your KPL --c. unplug the PLM and ISY and wait 10 seconds for the PLM to discharge --d. plug back in the PLM; wait 10-20 seconds and make sure the PLM light is solid on (not blinking) --e. plug back in the ISY Again, please accept my apologies for the troubles you've been having and I do look forward to hear your feedback vis-a-vis the suggestions above. With kind regards, Michel I am stuck with the ISY and PLM communication problems and hope this forum can help. My domain is as follows: - #2414U, running HomeSeer & PowerHome software - 4 * #2475D - #2856D2 - #2856S3 - 2 * #2456D3 - 4 * #2442 - #2412S (3507Firm52 Rev 2.4) - #2486D - 2 * #2430 I have about 3 circuits and 1900 sqft I have no X10 devices at all. The PLC and through that HomeSeer + PowerHome software is fully able to access and control ALL the devices with very good reliability. THe #2430 and #2486D is also able to control any of the Insteon devices with no problems at all. When introducing the ISY I noticed like many others that communication from the PLM to the rest of the Insteon devices was significantly worse than what the PLC was able to do. I started with locating the PLC & the PLM on the same outlet to give them same communication conditions. The PLM was able to contact 3 out of 11 devices, and even then in a very unreliable way, i.e. devices suddenly went into communication problems only to work later... Other people on this board have reported similar behavior. I followed the forum's advice and mounted the PLM on top of a SignalLinc RF. That enabled me to contact a total of 5-7 of my 11 Insteon devices. As the communication between 2 of these are still unreliable I tried to follow the other advice from the forum such as: - Try another PLM (0720Rev1.9 FIRM 4.0) - Try to remove the PLC from the network - Try to relocate the PLM to another circuit, then to 3 different physical locations. Using PowerHome I retrieved fresh information about linking tables for each of the insteon devices, only to verify, that all links were still valid, and that there were not bad links in the insteon devices that could create a noisy network. Michale mentioned that a blinking PLM light could be indication of problems. I do not have that at all. I do have one of my KeyPadLinc's that is blinking a lot. Due to that I tried with and without that KeyPadLinc on the network --> No impact on the PLM's communication ability. I don't know what else to try at this point, since the network is very reliable using the PLC and the KeyPadLinc's. I hope my feedback on using the SignalLinc as communication buffer can help some of you, and that someone is able to help me with ideas on how to proceed. BR, Anders
nanckekr Posted September 24, 2007 Posted September 24, 2007 Hi Michael Thanks for good troubleshooting help! 1. I have already turned back to PLM Firm 52 as I learned on the forums that Firm 40 was not too good - however, I thought it was worth a try.... 2. Why would I need AccePoints? I do not have any RF remote controls, and are not planning to use any. What value would the access point bring me? 3. I have tried al three methods, but as ISY often complained when trying to read links, I added the most devices using "owverwrite existing links", as I thought that should be the method triggering the least amount of automation in ISY and thus making it easier to isolate the problem. 4. No, I have not seen any pattern. However, it is the same 2 devices that seem to fail all the time. These two devices have no problems talking with any of the other KeyPadLincs. Also these two devices are located quite far from each other, so it does not appear to be location specific. 5. Yes, the "strange" KPL is blinking after being reconnected. I do not know why. I have tried your advice and - disconnet PLC - dicsonnet the KPL that blinks - unplug PLM & ISY for 10 seconds - connect PLM, wait 5 s - connect ISY (for the first second the error light is on, then it turns off, and in stead RX/TX is blinking for a few seconds, while the SET light is blinking on the PLM during these same couple of seconds) --> No difference in communication Would I gain anything by remove all devices and starting from scratch with adding them? If so, how should I do that to best isolate the problem? Start with adding the faulty/unstable devices?? BR, Anders
Michel Kohanim Posted September 24, 2007 Posted September 24, 2007 Anders, My pleasure! To answer your questions: 1. AccessPoint seems to be more reliable than SignaLinc. In short, AccessPoint is simply going to act as an immediate repeater 2. When you removed the KPL, it's normal that ISY cannot communicate with that KPL only. Is the blinking KPL one of the devices that you cannot communicate with? 3. You do not need to do a factory reset and start fresh. At least not right now. But, would you be kind enough to do a "Restore Device" on each one of those "troubled" devices? 4. And, although I know this is probably too much of a hassle, but I have to ask simply because you mentioned "location" dependent. Would it be possible at all to move ISY and PLM closer to the "troubled" devices? I sincerely appreciate your patience, With kind regards, Michel Hi Michael Thanks for good troubleshooting help! 1. I have already turned back to PLM Firm 52 as I learned on the forums that Firm 40 was not too good - however, I thought it was worth a try.... 2. Why would I need AccePoints? I do not have any RF remote controls, and are not planning to use any. What value would the access point bring me? 3. I have tried al three methods, but as ISY often complained when trying to read links, I added the most devices using "owverwrite existing links", as I thought that should be the method triggering the least amount of automation in ISY and thus making it easier to isolate the problem. 4. No, I have not seen any pattern. However, it is the same 2 devices that seem to fail all the time. These two devices have no problems talking with any of the other KeyPadLincs. Also these two devices are located quite far from each other, so it does not appear to be location specific. 5. Yes, the "strange" KPL is blinking after being reconnected. I do not know why. I have tried your advice and - disconnet PLC - dicsonnet the KPL that blinks - unplug PLM & ISY for 10 seconds - connect PLM, wait 5 s - connect ISY (for the first second the error light is on, then it turns off, and in stead RX/TX is blinking for a few seconds, while the SET light is blinking on the PLM during these same couple of seconds) --> No difference in communication Would I gain anything by remove all devices and starting from scratch with adding them? If so, how should I do that to best isolate the problem? Start with adding the faulty/unstable devices?? BR, Anders
nanckekr Posted September 25, 2007 Posted September 25, 2007 Hi Michael 1. Does that mean that I should not have invested in SignalLinc's but in stead in AP's? 2. I must have mixed up the terms in my past reports. It is a ControlLinc (#2430) I have blinking, and not a KeyPadLinc (#2486D). I have tried the network without the ControlLinc attached at all - no impact. I tried a "Restore Device" on the blinking CL - no impact. 3. I tried to do that on one of the constantly failing devices. The UI frooze and eventually I got a "Socket open failed java.net.ConnectException Connection timed oud:connet" error followed by a "Request Failed" error. 4. I tried that too. No impact. In fact, one of the 3 unstable devices is located next to the SignalLinc & PLM. 5. I tried to shut down ALL my computers and remove all the chargers for mobile phones, laptops etc. as I know switching mode power supplies can cretae noise on the network. It did not have any impact at all. 6. Although a device seems to be OK, i.e. no "exclamation point" it appears that the devices are not always listening to "on" and "off" commands, where they often DO listen to "Fast On", "Fast Off", "Bright" and "Dim". That even goes for the devices with the "exclamation point" 7. I tried to delete one of the devices that constantly had the explamation point next to them. After that I was (at least now) unable to add it again. I know it is hard to troubleshoot when you can not see the installation. I hope that you still have some good ideas based on this update. BR, Anders
Michel Kohanim Posted September 25, 2007 Posted September 25, 2007 Hello Anders, Apologies for a tardy reply ... needed to have some free time to think about the next steps. 1. No, SignaLincs are OK as well ... I think you can upgrade your SignaLinc to AccessPoint but I am not sure. I think we can always get some AccessPoints and test your scenario, but let's leave that as the "last resort" 2. Does your ControLinc blink by itself for no apparent reason? Do you have any of the buttons on your ControLinc setup with X10 addresses? Since you experience the same issues regardless, I agree with you that this is not the problem. But, you might want to check it out nonetheless 3. Not being able to restore the failing device (with the timeout exception) may be caused only by two things: a. The device is not responding ... i.e. the PLM cannot communicate with it b. The link records in your device are not valid and thus the device complains Would you be kind enough to look at the ISY screen and let me know the firmware version/type of the failing devices? I forget whether or not we removed and readded the failing device. Would it be at all possible to a. Remove [one of] the failing device(s) from ISY (in all likelihood, you will get many device comm errors and then request failed) b. Do a hard reset (pull out the set button, leave it out for 10 seconds, the push and hold it back in for 10 seconds) c. Add it back to ISY If this also fails, we should go to the last resort: 1. I can send you another PLM to test 2. I can possibly (don't have any in stock now) send you couple of AccessPoints to test I am so very sorry for all the troubles you are experiencing. With kind regards, Michel Hi Michael 1. Does that mean that I should not have invested in SignalLinc's but in stead in AP's? 2. I must have mixed up the terms in my past reports. It is a ControlLinc (#2430) I have blinking, and not a KeyPadLinc (#2486D). I have tried the network without the ControlLinc attached at all - no impact. I tried a "Restore Device" on the blinking CL - no impact. 3. I tried to do that on one of the constantly failing devices. The UI frooze and eventually I got a "Socket open failed java.net.ConnectException Connection timed oud:connet" error followed by a "Request Failed" error. 4. I tried that too. No impact. In fact, one of the 3 unstable devices is located next to the SignalLinc & PLM. 5. I tried to shut down ALL my computers and remove all the chargers for mobile phones, laptops etc. as I know switching mode power supplies can cretae noise on the network. It did not have any impact at all. 6. Although a device seems to be OK, i.e. no "exclamation point" it appears that the devices are not always listening to "on" and "off" commands, where they often DO listen to "Fast On", "Fast Off", "Bright" and "Dim". That even goes for the devices with the "exclamation point" 7. I tried to delete one of the devices that constantly had the explamation point next to them. After that I was (at least now) unable to add it again. I know it is hard to troubleshoot when you can not see the installation. I hope that you still have some good ideas based on this update. BR, Anders
nanckekr Posted September 26, 2007 Posted September 26, 2007 Hi Michael "Tardy" is not a word that comes to mind at all when working with you! 1: OK 2: Yes it does. I have it disconnected all the time for the same reason as I do not want it to polute the network 3: I only got this error message once. It was from the #2486D KPL. Currently I am unable to connect to that device at all, so ISY will not show me the version numbers. From HomeSeer which is perfectly able to work with this KPL, I got the following numbers: "KeypadLinc V2 Dimmer, Firmware Version: 29 [Comm Reliablility: 97% (9 failed out of 304 cmds)]" I did yesterday try to remove the device from ISY, it was when attempting to add it again, that I got this one time only JAVA error report from ISY. As the KPL is wired into the circuit, it is a little difficult to perform the hard reset. Thus I decided to trouble shoot with another unstable device, a #2456D3 LampLinc. I did the following a) remove device from ISY Hard reset the insteon device c) add device back to ISY ("overwrite existing links" method) At first it looked OK, then I pushed the on/off for this device on ISY UI about 5 times in a row, and then a communication progress bar appeared, after which ISY reported problems talking with this device and added the red exclamation point. I have done this test with ISY mounted in the SignalLinc on a location nearby the fauly device, and another test with the PLM located on top of SignalLinc on top of the faulty LampLinc. BR, Anders
Michel Kohanim Posted September 27, 2007 Posted September 27, 2007 Anders, Thank you but I prefer answering all posts within a couple of hours and not later ... so, again, apologies for the tardiness. I think we have reached the end of the road here and have to take desperate measures! Would you be kind enough to send an email to tech@universal-devices.com and we shall discuss the next steps. At the minimum, I'd like to arrange sending you a couple of AccessPoints if you don't alraedy have a set. Looking forward to hearing from you soon, Regards, Michel Hi Michael "Tardy" is not a word that comes to mind at all when working with you! 1: OK 2: Yes it does. I have it disconnected all the time for the same reason as I do not want it to polute the network 3: I only got this error message once. It was from the #2486D KPL. Currently I am unable to connect to that device at all, so ISY will not show me the version numbers. From HomeSeer which is perfectly able to work with this KPL, I got the following numbers: "KeypadLinc V2 Dimmer, Firmware Version: 29 [Comm Reliablility: 97% (9 failed out of 304 cmds)]" I did yesterday try to remove the device from ISY, it was when attempting to add it again, that I got this one time only JAVA error report from ISY. As the KPL is wired into the circuit, it is a little difficult to perform the hard reset. Thus I decided to trouble shoot with another unstable device, a #2456D3 LampLinc. I did the following a) remove device from ISY Hard reset the insteon device c) add device back to ISY ("overwrite existing links" method) At first it looked OK, then I pushed the on/off for this device on ISY UI about 5 times in a row, and then a communication progress bar appeared, after which ISY reported problems talking with this device and added the red exclamation point. I have done this test with ISY mounted in the SignalLinc on a location nearby the fauly device, and another test with the PLM located on top of SignalLinc on top of the faulty LampLinc. BR, Anders
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