Status Not Working - Switches don't report state

[gadgetfreak]

I am trying to make a program that relies on the status of a switch so that if a switch is supposed to be on and my kid turns it off, it will go back on. It hasn't worked and I think I found the root of the problem.

 

When a switch is pressed, the state is not automatically updated on the ISY99 until I do a query. This is happening to many (if not all) of my switches whether they are ICONs or Switchlincs. The switches I am currently testing these on are 2876S v.28 and 2876SB v.39.

 

So I guess the first question is whether this is normal (which I doubt) and if anyone has any suggestions on how to fix it.

 

Then, what do people think about workarounds such as running a query every 5 minutes on just those lights? Or what about using control instead of status?

 

But, ideally, I would like to get this two-way stuff working. Thx in advance.

[LeeG]

Definitely not normal. When a device is added to the ISY link records are generated which cause the device to send messages to the ISY whenever the device is manually operated. First is powerline communication of good quality. Do devices turn each other On/Off as expected and can they be controller reliably from the ISY. If powerline communication is intermittent then noise or signal attenuation is suspect.

 

If general powerline communication is good but specific device never notify the ISY of state changes either the link records in the device or link records in the PLM have been lost or corrupted. Pick one device that never works, Restore Device to restore the device link records. If that does not resolve the problem Restore Modem (PLM) to restore the PLM link database.

 

EDIT: routine query of devices should not be necessary. It puts lots of traffic on the powerline that can interfere with other activity. Once the issue is identified and resolved devices will rarely if ever be out of sync.

 

If the ISY is not seeing state changes the use of Control will make no difference. If the ISY sees an inbound state change message such that Control would work the device status would be updated. The status is not being updated because the ISY is not seeing the state change messages in the first place.

[gadgetfreak]

Communication from my ISY to my devices is fine. All my scenes and programs work well. But the devices just don't seem to be reporting their status back to the ISY unless I do a query. I tried restoring an individual device and then I did a Restore Modem (PLM) and neither of those made a difference. The status on the ISY does not get updated until I run a query. I just loaded the PLM Links Table and it counted 247 links. I don't know what other diagnostics to run to try to fix this issue. Any other assistance would be most appreciated.

[LeeG]

Do a Show Device Links Table for the device and look for a link record that looks like this

 

E201 xx.xx.xx .. .. .. where xx.xx.xx is the PLM Insteon address

 

Do a Show PLM Links Table and look for a link record that looks like this

 

A201 yy.yy.yy .. .. .. where yy.yy.yy is the device Insteon address

[gadgetfreak]

PLM is 0F.9E.6C

Outside Deck is 04.49.3B

 

On the Device Links Table for the switch called Outside - Deck, I get three results:

0FF8 : A2 00 0F.9E.6C FF 1F 00

0FF0 : A2 24 0F.9E.6C FF 1F 00

0FE8 : 00 24 0F.9E.6C FF 1F 00

 

When I do a Show PLM Links, I get a count of 247. I searched through all of them and found two entries for 04.49.3B as follows:

 

00E1: E2 00 04.49.3B 02 0B 28

00E2: E2 24 04.49.3B 02 0B 28

 

Now what?

[LeeG]

I cannot explain how but the links for that device are wrong. The required link records for the device to notify the ISY of state changes have occurred are missing. The only solution I know of (since Restore did not correct the problem) is to delete the device and add it back to the ISY. After doing that do a Show Device Links Table before doing anything else to confirm the device add does in fact write the

 

E201 xx.xx.xx where xx.xx.xx is the PLM address

 

link record. Do you use other automation software that could have over written the link records. Does not look like that as the Restore should be put them back if the ISY still have a record of them.

 

What firmware level on you on?

[gadgetfreak]

I am not sure what Firmware I am on. When I go to About it says:

 

Insreon_UD99 v.2.8.16 and ISY 99i/IR (1030) - Open Auto-DR (21010)

 

By the way, this seems to be happening with EVERY light. I will try one at a time to see if deleting and adding back the device will help. Do you have any recommendations on the easiest way to do this? Thx.

[LeeG]

You are on 2.8.16. That is the latest official release. The 3.1.x are Beta level.

 

Sorry I don't know of any way to handle it but one device at a time. Assuming they are all working at the end of this exercise I would take a backup, and then incremental backups as you get the Scenes and Programs back in operation.

[LeeG]

gadgetfreak

 

If you still have a device that has not been deleted/added back and is not sending state changes, is the device entry in the My Lighting tree Red or Blue. If Blue what is the device type displayed in the right pane when the device is selected and does it show an actual firmware level or v.00.

 

Don't worry about it if you have already readded all the devices. This was just a thought generated by a different thread.

 

Lee

[gadgetfreak]

Both the few that I have already deleted and re-added as well as all the ones that are not properly reporting back to the ISY are all red. I have 4 appliance links that have always been blue, though. What does that mean? Thx.

[LeeG]

Responder only devices are Blue. An ApplianceLinc should be Blue. They do not have the function necessary to Control another Insteon device. Other devices that have paddles/buttons which can control other Insteon devices should be Red.

 

The question about color might have provided some information as to how the Controller link records were lost. It does not in this case. Thanks for the information though, it might have proved useful. Actually it is helpful to know that the color is correct. It eliminates one possibility.

[gadgetfreak]

There is a possibility that I manually added all of these switches instead of doing the automatic linking. Someone told me that might explain the problems I am having. I honestly don't remember or think that I could have manually added all of these 30+ switches but I guess it is possible.

 

I have already removed 4 of my switches from all programs and scenes, deleted them, did a factory reset on them and then relinked them automatically. This seemed to have fixed the problem so I guess I need to now do this for all my other switches.

 

Now, if anyone can think of an easier way to do this for all the switches, that would be great . Thx.

[bbtm]

I cannot explain how but the links for that device are wrong. The required link records for the device to notify the ISY of state changes have occurred are missing.

 

E201 xx.xx.xx where xx.xx.xx is the PLM address

 

 

LeeG, after reading your post I spent some time analyzing my link tables as I had to use queries to make some of my programs work. I also tested all the devices to see which one would update their “Current State†in the admin console. All the devices of the following types have A201 entries in the PLM link table

KeypadLinc Relay v.33, SwitchLinc Dimmer v.35, ControLinc v.00, Thermostat Adapter v.28, Motion Sensor v.00, In-LineLinc Relay W/ Sense v.38, IRLinc Receiver v.00, LampLinc BiPhy v.3B

Of these, only the Thermostat does not update its state in the admin console.

None of the following devices - In-LineLinc Relay v.33, In-LineLinc Dimmable v.33, OutletLinc v.32, LampLinc v.33, ApplianceLinc v.32, LampLinc v.37- have the A201 entry in their link tables even after deleting them and re-adding them. They of course also don’t update their status in the admin console.

Is this normal? The OutletLinc have that very handy toggle button but I wish that when used it would report the status change back to the PLM. Could it be that these have outdated firmware?

[LeeG]

bbtm

 

All the devices which have an A201 .. .. .. Responder link record in the PLM are capable of being a Controller. That is, these device can send status changes to the PLM.

 

All the devices which do not have an A201 .. .. .. Responder link record in the PLM are Responder only devices (no Controller function) which cannot send status changes to the PLM.

 

The LampLinc v.33 seems wrong. LampLincs have Controller capability which can send status change messages to the PLM. I have a v.33 2456D3 LampLinc which does send On/Off state change messages as the lamp plugged into the LampLinc is turned On/Off manually. What is the numeric device type of that LampLinc?

 

The OutletLinc is a Responder only device. It cannot send status changes to any device as it has no Controller capability.

 

Only InLineLinc w/Sense has Controller capability. ApplianceLincs do not have Controller capability.

 

EDIT: a device that is a Responder only (cannot send status change messages) can be identified by the lack of information in the Quick Start Guide and online User Guide for linking it as a Controller.

 

Lee

[bbtm]

LeeG,

Thanks for the info. All my LampLincs (the v.33 and the v.37) are 2456D3. None of them have A201 entries in the PLM although they are all shown in red in My Lighting. Pardon my ignorance but how would you use them as a controller as they don’t have ON/OFF buttons on them? I’ve recently bought a LampLinc BiPhy (B2457D2). It has the ON/OFF buttons, shows as a controller and did register A201 entries with the PLM.

Thanks

[LeeG]

bbtm

 

The fact the LampLincs are Red indicates the ISY understands the device has Controller capability and should have an A201 .. .. .. Responder link in the ISY PLM. These devices have load sensing circuits such that if the manual ON/OFF switch on the lamp itself is used to control the load the LampLinc will turn On and Off in response. This state change is reflected to whatever devices have been linked as responders which includes the ISY.

 

When I turn the lamp plugged into my v.33 LampLinc On and Off, the Admin Console display for the LampLinc changes the Current State to reflect the status of the load. Also the Insteon device that is linked as a responder to the Scene for which the LampLinc is a Controller turns On and Off. This allows a lamp on a night table next to the bed to control and primarily turn Off the bedroom lights if left On. Actually I find load sensing more convenient that reaching down to Outlet level to use the buttons on the newer Dual Band Lamplincs.

 

Lee