Setting a rule to a scene

[ejh3]

Forgive me if this has been covered in another post, but I wasn't able to find my specific question.

 

I have multiple keypadlincs I have recently installed and have a couple questions regarding how I want them to talk/work.

 

One thing I am worried about is someone accidentally pressing the button for the outdoor floods during the day. I understand

I have to add a rule,but where do I add it? Would that be in Programs?

 

I currently have a Scene for (Outdoor Floods) and have keypadlinc "g" as the controller.

 

Another question I have is programming a keypadlinc button to monitor the status of my Garage Door (already have contact/

garage opener wired to the garage opener module) and control the door. So if the door is left open, I would like keypad

button "h" to light up, if I press the "h" button *twice* the door rolls down. Once the door is completely closed the keypad

led button "h" goes out.

 

Thanks in advance for your help!

Ed

[Xathros]

ejh3-

 

I have the same concern and developed the following two programs that I use for my back porch floods day and night:

 

Back Porch Daytime Timer

If
       From    Sunrise +  1 second
       To      Sunset  -  1 second (same day)
   And Status  'Back Porch / Back Porch Flood Light' is On

Then
       Set Scene 'Back Porch / Back Porch' Off

Else
  - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

 

Back Porch Night Timer

If
       From    Sunset 
       To      Sunrise (next day)
   And Status  'Back Porch / Back Porch Flood Light' is On

Then
       Wait  15 minutes 
       Set Scene 'Back Porch / Back Porch' Off

Else
  - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

I have a few more programs that disable and re-enable the above programs as necessary.

 

Hope this helps.

 

-Xathros

[ejh3]

Thanks Xathros!

 

I will do that when I get home this evening. Any suggestions on the Garage Door issue?

 

Thanks!

[Xathros]

ejh3-

 

Sorry, I missed the second question. Here is one of my garage door monitor programs. This assumes you are controlling your door with an IOLink and that the sensor is ON when the door is NOT closed. If you are configured differently, this will need to be modified.

 

If
       Status  'Garage / Garage Door IOLinks / GD- Dad Garage Door Sensor' is Off

Then
       Set Scene 'Garage / Garage-Dad' Off

Else
       Set Scene 'Garage / Garage-Dad' On

 

The only thing in the Garage-Dad scene is a KPL Button H

 

-Xathros

[oberkc]

Regarding the garage door problem, may I humbly suggest that the best way to track garage door status (assuming IOLinc garage door kit with sensor) is NOT a program, but a scene with IOLinc sensor node as controller and keypad button as responder.

 

Using the same button as a trigger for opening/closing the door introduces some additional considerations, but can be done. My first suggestion would be to visit the UDI wiki and search on garage. You should be able to find an example.

 

You expressed, however, a desire to activate the door by pressing the button "twice". Are you referring to a "fast-on" (quick double-press)? What do you want to happen if you press the button only once? What do you want to happen if you press the button when the door is closed (and button H is not on)? Do you expect the button H to display a correct door status even after someone has pressed this button (once, twice, more)?

 

Like the wiki example, I use a single keypad to control a door as well as display status. I don't require a double-press, however. Perhaps you can think further about how you want your system to respond to the various possible combinations of button H status/presses and consider some alternatives?

[ejh3]

oberkc,

 

Thanks for your response. After reading further I have decided to go with a "one press" of the keypadlinc to open or close the garage door. I would also light to have the led behind the same button monitor the status of the garage door.

 

This would allow me to see the status of the garage door by looking at the keypadlinc from across the room.

 

Does that make sense?

 

Ed

[SunSentry]

I am curious about the reason for reading "Status" in the "IF" statement for the outdoor lights. I have a similar situation for swimming pool lights that I don't want other family members to leave on after getting out of the pool late at night.

 

I can understand the need to check garage door status because of the toggling method of the way garage doors work, but is it really necessary to check the status of a light before turning off the scene?

 

In my program, I tell it to turn off the pool light scene during a range of time at night and day, so I don't check the status since I want the light off no matter what the status. Wouldn't you want to do the same with your flood lights? Couldn't the status be reported wrong?

 

tnx for your thoughts,

Richard

[oberkc]

oberkc,

 

Thanks for your response. After reading further I have decided to go with a "one press" of the keypadlinc to open or close the garage door. I would also light to have the led behind the same button monitor the status of the garage door.

 

This would allow me to see the status of the garage door by looking at the keypadlinc from across the room.

 

Does that make sense?

 

Ed

 

 

To me, that is the obvious setup. The wiki includes this specific example, and how to set it up.

 

Your kit should be installed such that the sensor is "on" when the door is open. Configure your iolinc to be in momentary mode to respond to an "on" command. Configure your kpl button to be in non-toggle on mode. Create a second scene with kpl button as controller and relay as responder. Done.

 

Configured in this way, there the KPL will be "on" when the door is open, and "off" when closed. Pressing the button will activate the door, regardless of status. AND...there is only one way that the button will display "off" (closed) ... Wen the door is closed and the iolonc sensor sends the proper command to the kpl button. This gives one a great confidence that kpl status is accurate when it shows closed.

[oberkc]

I can understand the need to check garage door status because of the toggling method of the way garage doors work, but is it really necessary to check the status of a light before turning off the scene?

 

No, unless this condition dictates a course of action, or unless you are overly sensitive to unnecessary insteon commands over the powerlines and airwaves.

 

If you want simply to turn on or off some lights at a prescribed time, regardless of other concerns, then first checking status is unnecessary.

[ejh3]

Oberkc,

 

Firstly, I just want to say thanks for helping out on this issue, you and quite a few others have assisted in me in solving just about any problem I have put on here!

 

This particular problem is driving me crazy! I spent a good 5-6 hours trying to get this to work out yesterday, but it would only either get the

kpl to open "or" every once in a while show the status of the garage door. I have recently updated to the newest ISY version and the newest java applet.

 

I have the I/O wired so that the NC Door Contact crosses terminals GRD and Sense and the Garage Opener goes across COM and NO.

 

I have (2) Scenes:

 

1. Garage Opener Relay

KPL Back Door "H" (Non-Toggle) Controller

Garage Opener Relay (Momentary)

 

2. Garage Opener Sensor (Hooked up to a Sentrol High Security Door contact wired NC when the door is closed)

KPL Back Door "H" (Non-Toggle) Responder

Garage Opener Sensor

 

I can't figure out how to post screen shots to the forum, could I email them to you?

 

My next option today will be to try an wire the Sensor input into a spare input on my Simplehomenet EZIO2X4 and link it to the scene.

 

Do you have any other suggestions?

 

Thanks again,

Ed

[oberkc]

I have the I/O wired so that the NC Door Contact crosses terminals GRD and Sense and the Garage Opener goes across COM and NO.

 

This sounds correct. The direct way that I would check would be to observe the LED on the IOLinc. Does it come on when the door is open and off when closed? Every time? If so, then I believe this will work. Otherwise, there is a sensor wiring problem.

 

but it would only either get the kpl to open "or" every once in a while show the status of the garage door.

 

I see you have configured your IOLinc to be in "momentary" (not latching) mode, but which momentary mode? This should be either momentary A, or B (B is my preference in this case). If the IOLinc is not configured in this way, the response to commands can be intermittent. If you have it in momentary A, make sure it responds only to "ON" commands, not off.

 

Garage Opener Sensor (Hooked up to a Sentrol High Security Door contact wired NC when the door is closed)

KPL Back Door "H" (Non-Toggle) Responder

Garage Opener Sensor

 

I just wanted to make sure your sensor is defined in the scene as "controller".

 

1. Garage Opener Relay

KPL Back Door "H" (Non-Toggle) Controller

Garage Opener Relay (Momentary)

 

Is the KPL button H in non-toggle "ON" or "OFF"? Make sure it is "ON".

 

I don't believe that your problem is related to anything JAVA or software version.

 

To troubleshoot the problem, I would break this into two parts, starting with the KPL indication. Open and close the garage door using the wall button or car remote and observe the KPL button. Is the KPL button indicating proper status? Ever? Sometimes? If this is working always, great (move on to the control problem). If intermittently, is it possible that you are experiencing communication problems? If not working at all, this would cause me to suspect a scene or sensor wiring problem. If you begin to suspect communication problems, you can open an event viewer to see if the ISY/PLM are recieving status from the sensor.

 

Once you have the KPL properly displaying status, what then happens when you press the button? Does it flash a couple of times, staying on? Flash then go off? Not flash at all? Does the door respond sometimes? Never? Only when open or only when closed? Ramdomly? If the IOLinc relay is not configured in the correct momentary mode, this would tend to cause your door only to respond when either open or closed, but not both. Communication problems, as with anything insteon, can cause intermittent operation. Also, some of the fancy new garage door openers can be picky, I understand, regarding IOLinc control.

 

I recently tried to program a KPL button to momentary mode, but without apparent success. If your button is not flashing when pressed, it is NOT in momentary mode.

 

Your specific symptoms should point to the next course of action.

[ejh3]

As you recommended, I will try to break this up in two parts when I get home.

 

You said: "I just wanted to make sure your sensor is defined in the scene as "controller".

 

Is this true? I had the Door Sensor as the Responder and the Relay as the controller. Does that make sense?

[oberkc]

I had the Door Sensor as the Responder and the Relay as the controller. Does that make sense?

 

I don't believe that a sensor can be a reponder, nor a relay as contoller. The sensor status is controlled entirely by the sensor, itself. The sensor can, however, be a controller of other insteon devices.

 

The theory is that you want the sensor to "control" the KPL button status, and you want a KPL button press to "control" the relay. Thus sensor should be controller in its scene, and relay should be responder in its.

 

Hopefully, I am not being dislexic.

[LeeG]

"I had the Door Sensor as the Responder and the Relay as the controller."

 

That is backward. The I/O Linc Sensor can only be a Controller and the I/O Linc Relay can only be a Responder. The ISY does not allow the Sensor to be added to a Scene as a Responder nor does it allow the Relay to be added as a Controller so I suspect you are just remembering the definitions incorrectly.

[ejh3]

Lee,

 

Thanks for your time!

 

I seem to remember programming the kpl for the relay first, when I did it asked if I wanted it to be a controller or responder and I picked controller.

 

When I programmed for the Sensor it popped up with something along the lines of "Since you already have the buttion programmed as a controller

you must want this to be a responder" and I checked ok.

 

I will conform this when I get home this evening,

Ed

[LeeG]

If those were the words, button already a Controller, it was referring to the KeypadLinc button. A node can be a Controller in one Scene only. This is an Insteon design point rather than an ISY limitation. Dropping the KPL button on another Scene would produce the question should the button be added as a Responder as that is the only option available.

 

I just check and the ISY will not allow the I/O Linc Sensor node to be added as anything but a Controller and if an attempt to add to another Scene an error popup displays indicating the Sensor is already a Controller and cannot be added to another Scene (running 3.3.4).

 

When you get home click the Scene name and look at the color of the nodes below the Scene name. Anything in Red is a Controller; anything in Blue is a Responder. Many devices can function as both Controller and Responder, such as a KeypadLinc button and SwitchLinc. Some devices can only be Responders such as an ApplianceLinc or I/O Linc Relay and some can only be Controllers such as the I/O Linc Sensor or RemoteLinc button.

 

I think the Scenes will actually be correct.

[ejh3]

Ok,

 

Well I got home and went back at it, but now my icy is blinking the red and blue (the one right next to the red led).

 

The only thing I did when I got home was change the momentary status of the relay with the help of the Smarthome Tech support. Because the icy wouldn't allow me to change my momentary relay values I have to go to the I/O unit itself and change the status by pressing and hiding down the button on the unit til it beeped. I did this three times x 2 (each time changes from A, B, C.

 

Any suggestions on how to get my icy back on line?

 

Thanks,

Ed

[LeeG]

The Err and Mem LEDs blinking indicates the ISY no longer has Ethernet access.

[LeeG]

Also sounds like you are running 3.2.6 which cannot set the new I2CS I/O Linc options. Have to move to 3.3.4 to get that support.

[ejh3]

Lee,

 

I just saw that you posted that I need to run 3.3.4, I will try this as soon as I get home today.

 

Yesterday afternoon I spent another 5-6 hours on trying to resolve this issue, even calling Smarthome Tech support.

Because the isy admin console would not toggle a bunch of options on the i/o link, I had to change the momentary

positions by pressing the set button for 3 secs in sets of 3 to change to the next possible value. The Smarthome

tech support quoted "UDI still hasn't resolved THEIR issue". The Tech had me remove and reinstall the device, but

it still never allowed me to change the momentary options via the admin console.

 

Does everyone agree that 3.3.4 will resolve my issue?

 

This has been by far the most frustrating device I've ever attempted to install on my ISY.

 

Thanks again for all your help!

[oberkc]

Does everyone agree that 3.3.4 will resolve my issue

 

Unfortunately, I doubt anyone can offer guarantees. It is, however, a step worth trying.

[LeeG]

Release 3.3.4 provides support for setting the options of an I2CS I/O Linc. Release 3.2.6 does not have that capability. 3.2.6 correctly handles pre I2CS I/O Lincs. If that is your only problem 3.3.4 will solve it. The I/O Linc has a variety of features that support nearly a dozen different I/O Linc kits. Even the garage kit can be implemented in various ways depending on how you want the door controlled, how the status of the door should be presented, and so on. I would not be surprised if you have additional questions once the I2CS I/O Linc options can be configured.

[LeeG]

Also keep in mind 3.2.6 was released the beginning of May 2012. That is 7 months ago. The amount of I2CS device evolution alone that has occurred over those 7 months is huge.

[ejh3]

I upgraded my firmware to 3.3.4, but still couldn't get the I/O linc to work with my keypadlincs. I ended up doing a "band aid fix" by

manually linking the keypadlincs to the I/O, it currently works as I wanted, but I would much rather have the ability to do all this

through the admin console.

 

Has anyone had this same issue?

 

Thanks,

Ed

[LeeG]

Release 3.3.5 (RC2) is now available. The issue being discussed before was not being able to configure the I/O Linc options. What type of Scene creation problem are you having? Manual Set button linking is not a good approach. The ISY does not know about those links and will eventually overlay or delete them.

 

Also now that you are on 3.3.4 (RC1) do a right click on the I/O Linc Sensor node, select Diagnostics | Query Insteon Engine. This will insure the ISY has the correct information about the I/O Linc.