phantom programs? RF communication issues

[jgorm]

A while back I made a motion testing program where a motion sensor would trigger the front lights for 15 seconds, day or night. Then I deleted the program and reset that motion sensor within 5' of the PLM (held button, updated via ISY, jumper 5 has been jumped since day 1), updated the light switch that controls that light, then made a new program. The new program works only at night, and turns the side light on as well as the front light. It worked for a few days, then it seemed to revert back to the old program that was deleted. The side light no longer turns on, but the front light turns on for 15 seconds, even during the day. The original motion testing program does not show up on the admin console.

 

I was having communication issues with that motion sensor, but I moved a access point to a window only 5' from the motion sensor. The side light works fine and can be controlled by my phone so there are no communication issues there. The access point is on the same 120v leg as the PLM.

 

I have another issue with a different motion sensor. I made a motion beeps program to beep my office fan switch 3x when the motion sensor is triggered. This one almost never works. It has worked a few times, but probably less than 5% of the time. The motion sensor is about 5' from the PLM and the switch is in the same room. I will see the ISY activity light blinking when I trigger the motion sensor, but the switch does nothing. The switch is on the same 120V leg as the PLM

 

My house is pretty big, 2934sqft. The north side is one story and the south side is split level with 2 bedrooms down the stairs, and the kitchen / living room up the stairs. My PLM is in a bad spot. It's plugged into an outlet via a non surge cheap power strip. The other plug on that outlet has a big power strip, then a UPS with another power strip attached to that. 3 desktop computers, 3 monitors, cable modem, ooma network phone, another WIFI router, 2 8 port gigabit hubs, NAS, etc.

 

I could easily move the ISY to a closet location with a gigabit hub, and a network printer, and actually plug the PLM into the outlet. This is a fairly central location. Is it better to run a long ethernet cable from the ISY to the PLM, or run a long cable to the ISY and have the PLM close by? I could also put the ISY or PLM under my house, but then there would be a 8 port POE hub and another WIFI router plugged into the same outlet. That location does provide good wifi through most of the house because it is directly below the floor in the center of the house.

 

RF seems to be my biggest problem. All my lights work fine with 99%+ success when controlled via my phone, and 100% when controlled by the switch, scene, or ISY admin.

 

My setup is as follows

2x 8 button switches

1x 6 button relay switch

5x rocker switches, some dimmer, some relay

1x access point

2x outdoor module

1x appliance module

5x motion sensors (2 work well, one has the issue mentioned with the phantom program, and the other has the issue with the motion beeps. The last is still in the box)

 

Any help will be appreciated

[LeeG]

The ISY and PLM should be near each other. The ISY to PLM connection is over a Serial port. Much shorter cable requirements than an Ethernet connection

 

The PLM should be positioned for the best powerline communication. It should not be on the end of a long run far from the power panel with lots of appliances in between. RF coverage and coupling of the two 120v legs should be handled by Access Points or other Dual Band devices. In other words do not position PLM for RF coverage.

 

The collection of devices being powered from the same circuit as the PLM should be isolated with a FilterLinc. Power supplies in these devices, particularly a UPS, often filter/absorb noise so well as to absorb some of the Insteon signal making PLM to device communication less reliable.

 

The Event Viewer running on LEVEL 3 can be used to evaluate communication between the PLM and devices. Look at the Hops Left=x count when Max Hops=3. A Hops Left=2 is the best communication. A Hops Left=0 (when Max Hops=3) is the worst level of communication.

 

EDIT: the Programs | Summary page is a good place to evaluate Program execution. When a Program does not produce the desired results, such as doing a Beep, the first question to answer is "was the Program actually triggered". The Last Run Time column shows the date and time the Program was last triggered. The Status column shows True or False indicating whether the Then or Else clause executed when the Program was triggered.

[jgorm]

Thanks LeeG! I did some more testing. Here is the program that is supposed to beep the light switch. It works every time I trigger the then statement on the console.

If
       Status  'Motion-Sensor d5' is On

Then
       Set 'Office fan' 1 (Beep Duration)
       Set 'Office fan' 1 (Beep Duration)
       Set 'Office fan' 1 (Beep Duration)
       Set 'Office fan' 1 (Beep Duration)

Else
  - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

 

This is the log that pops up when I trigger the motion sensor.

Wed 11/13/2013 08:56:51 PM : [        Time] 20:56:51 10(0)

Wed 11/13/2013 08:57:00 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 23.25.D5 00.00.01 CB 11 01    LTONRR (01)

Wed 11/13/2013 08:57:00 PM : [std-Group   ] 23.25.D5-->Group=1, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2

Wed 11/13/2013 08:57:00 PM : [  23 25 D5 1]      DON   1

Wed 11/13/2013 08:57:01 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 23.25.D5 00.00.01 CB 11 01    LTONRR (01)

Wed 11/13/2013 08:57:01 PM : [std-Group   ] 23.25.D5-->Group=1, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2

Wed 11/13/2013 08:57:01 PM : [iNST-DUP    ] Previous message ignored.

Wed 11/13/2013 08:57:01 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 23.25.D5 11.00.01 CB 06 00           (00)

Wed 11/13/2013 08:57:01 PM : [std-Group   ] 23.25.D5-->11.00.01, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2

Wed 11/13/2013 08:57:01 PM : [iNST-INFO   ] Previous message ignored.

Wed 11/13/2013 08:57:01 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 23.25.D5 11.00.01 CB 06 00           (00)

Wed 11/13/2013 08:57:01 PM : [std-Group   ] 23.25.D5-->11.00.01, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2

Wed 11/13/2013 08:57:01 PM : [iNST-INFO   ] Previous message ignored.

The program shows up as triggered, but does nothing.

 

This is the log when I run the if, or the then statement of the program with the console. (log from the 'if')

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:07 PM : [        Time] 21:13:08 10(0)

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:07 PM : [iNST-TX-I1  ] 02 62 23 EB 69 0F 30 01

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:07 PM : [iNST-TX-I1  ] 02 62 23 EB 69 0F 30 01

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:07 PM : [iNST-TX-I1  ] 02 62 23 EB 69 0F 30 01

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:07 PM : [iNST-TX-I1  ] 02 62 23 EB 69 0F 30 01

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:07 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 23.EB.69 0F 30 01 06          BEEP   (01)

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:07 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 23.EB.69 0F 30 01 06          BEEP   (01):  Duplicate or ACK for a different device 

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:07 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 23.EB.69 25.13.EA 2B 30 01    BEEP   (01)

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:07 PM : [std-Direct Ack] 23.EB.69-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:08 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 23.EB.69 0F 30 01 06          BEEP   (01)

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:08 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 23.EB.69 0F 30 01 06          BEEP   (01):  Duplicate or ACK for a different device 

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:08 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 23.EB.69 25.13.EA 2B 30 01    BEEP   (01)

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:08 PM : [std-Direct Ack] 23.EB.69-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:08 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 23.EB.69 0F 30 01 06          BEEP   (01)

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:08 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 23.EB.69 0F 30 01 06          BEEP   (01):  Duplicate or ACK for a different device 

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:08 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 23.EB.69 25.13.EA 2B 30 01    BEEP   (01)

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:08 PM : [std-Direct Ack] 23.EB.69-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:09 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 23.EB.69 0F 30 01 06          BEEP   (01)

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:09 PM : [iNST-ACK    ] 02 62 23.EB.69 0F 30 01 06          BEEP   (01):  Duplicate or ACK for a different device 

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:09 PM : [iNST-SRX    ] 02 50 23.EB.69 25.13.EA 2B 30 01    BEEP   (01)

Wed 11/13/2013 09:13:09 PM : [std-Direct Ack] 23.EB.69-->ISY/PLM Group=0, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2

[LeeG]

There is no Off from the Motion Sensor in the trace. Don't know if the Motion Sensor is running in On Only mode. If so the Program will not trigger using If Status. If Status requires a change in Status to trigger the Program. In On Only mode only On commands are sent so the Status never changes.

 

Change the Program to If Control sensor is switched On

[jgorm]

That was it! Is it better to use the control option vs the status option for motion sensors? I don't use any direct links for motion sensors, only as program triggers.

[LeeG]

I use 'If Control' inside because mine are set for Occupancy mode (Sensing mode: checked). In this mode every motion that is detected generates a Sensor On message without waiting for the timeout interval to expire. Allows an ISY Program to be triggered on each motion which refreshes the Wait time. Only when no motion has been detected for the full Wait time does the Program turn the light Off.

 

For a Motion Sensor that is monitoring outside motion where waiting for the timeout interval to expire is more appropriate I use 'if Status' and let the Motion Sensor generate an Off message. There is less Insteon traffic generated this way and an ISY Program is not really needed in most outside uses.

 

Which Motion Sensor options are used and how the ISY Program is implemented (if used at all) is dependent on how the Motion Sensor is being used.